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Fianl updates to E-M5 preview

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R Butler said:
I'm trying to add a few extra details to the E-M5 preview, to clear up uncertainties.

Are there any specific questions that I need to cover (I can't promise to address everything as I only have a pre-production camera, so can't comment on performance).

Richard - dpreview.com
Click to expand...
I would suggest that you pay special attention to IBIS in your review.

In the past, various reviewers have stated that the E-P3 and E-PL3 IBIS is good for three stops or so, but in every instance they have not produced any evidence of this (in other words, it's anecdotal).

I have tested IBIS on my E-P3 extensively, and found it to be useless.

Now Oly is touting its new 5-way IBIS as the best thing since sliced bread, and I suspect that this is just more marketing hype.

This is the method I used:

1) Select a lens / focal length subject.

2) Set sutter speed using the rule-of-thumb 1/focal length.

3) Shoot three frames hand-held, as steadily as possible, with IBIS off.

4) Repeat with IBIS on.

5) Zoom in and choose the sharpest. Is it IBIS on or IBIS off?

5) Repeat the above at various shutter speeds, some faster than 1/focal length, and some slower.

I've found that most of the time it's 50/50 as to which frame is sharpest. At higher shutter speeds, IBIS actually makes photos worse (they look more blurry). At very slow shutter speeds, IBIS makes a difference, but rarely enough to make the pic useable (shutter speeds are usually so low as to render the shot useless in any case).

I hope dpreview will be the first website to test Oly's IBIS claims.

Regards,
Scott
 
CrashE3 said:
I can not fathom what you are talking about..?! You are in manual mode.. you are the exposure compensation. Set A/S to your liking and let the auto ISO keep you there. What am I not getting? I don't see a problem to correct... certainly not enough to criticize Olympus over..
Click to expand...
Like aperture and shutter speed, ISO is now one of the basic paramaters.

If you want a particular aperture (for wider DOF or maybe because you're using a lens that sucks wide open so you want to stop it down a bit), and a particular shutter speed (it should be obvious why you don't want your shutter speed to be too low), but you want the camera to still meter the scene and take a well exposed picture, and you would use exposure compensation here for the exact same reason you'd use exposure compenstion in A or S mode.

In other words, you don't really want "manual mode", you're using M when you really want "shutter and aperture priority mode".

Olympus doesn't get that A S and M are outdated modes, relics of the film era. There should be wheels for shutter, aperture and iso, and you can set any of them to AUTO that you like (none, all, or something in between).
 
Hen3ry said:
Also clarification on the sensor. Are pixels lost when we move to 3:2 and 16:9?
Click to expand...
Pixels are lost even on multiaspect GH2 sensor, dude...
 
Hen3ry said:
...when I last looked, it seemed that we are confined to 4:3, which is not correct.

Also clarification on the sensor. Are pixels lost when we move to 3:2 and 16:9?
Click to expand...
He has indicated in an above post that 4:3, 3:2 and 16:9 all maintain the exact same horizontal resolution. Likewise, indicated in the spec sheet, 4:3, 1:1 and 3:4 maintain the same vertical resolution. It's not a multiaspect sensor, nor did anyone expect it to be. (we've ALWAYS known that Panasonic wanted to keep the GH series sensors as an in-house speciality)

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1041&message=40552533
--
http://www.photoklarno.com
 
So is there really a bunny under the hump? ;)
R Butler said:
I'm trying to add a few extra details to the E-M5 preview, to clear up uncertainties.

Are there any specific questions that I need to cover (I can't promise to address everything as I only have a pre-production camera, so can't comment on performance).

Richard - dpreview.com
Click to expand...
 
Hello,

First of all, kudos for the great preview. My lust for this camera went significantly up!

A very specific question I'm afraid, of interest to divers:

I have seen on the Olympus Japan and Olympus Singapore websites that there is an underwater housing coming for the E-M5, referenced as PT-E08 in the Japan website and PT-EP08 in the Singapore one. I am very interested.

Do you have any details on this housing (besides that it is rated to a -disappointing- 45m), in particular whether the ports are interchangeable (as they used to be for the E-5x0 cameras as an example, for which housings are referenced as PT-E0x)) or fixed (as for the Pen E-P cameras where you need to go to third parties to get ports and take the risk associated with it, and for which the housings are referenced as Pt-EP0x).

Besides, do you have any tentative date for the 60 macro lens release?

Thank you very much and best regards from sunny Thailand!

Chris
 
There will be no bunny with Cameras delivered after easter.

Oh...and it is not a 'hump' thank you- it is 'Mt Olympus!'
Button Pusher said:
R Butler said:
I'm trying to add a few extra details to the E-M5 preview, to clear up uncertainties.

Are there any specific questions that I need to cover (I can't promise to address everything as I only have a pre-production camera, so can't comment on performance).

Richard - dpreview.com
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Thanks for the great work at dpreview, I love it! :)

Is the touch screen as usable as with the p3 (limited, only focus) or as with the gf3 for all functions and menues?

How responsive is it?
As with a iphone4 (more) or as with a p3/GH2 (less).
 
ginsbu said:
R Butler said:
sigala1 said:
R Butler said:
I'd jumped over all the correct hurdles, then forgotten to turn Auto ISO on when I tested earlier.

I was wrong, Auto ISO is available in M mode.
Click to expand...
With Auto ISO in M mode, can you set exposure compensation?
Click to expand...
No, you can't.

Richard - dpreview.com
Click to expand...
Argh! It is absolutely infuriating that Olympus won't allow this. Auto ISO is severely limited in M mode without it. Nikon gets it. Pentax does too.

Richard, please criticize Olympus for this in their review. Maybe that will encourage them to fix it.

Thanks for being so responsive in this thread!
Click to expand...
I don't see it as really problematic, after all a manual mode is supposed to let you fix all the parameters by yourself. In what is it disturbing to activate either the shutter dial, or the aperture dial if instead of the compensation wheel ? All the more that with this camera the same wheel will be functioning in all the PASM modes. It is already surprising that you are allowed to have ISO auto in manual mode. If you want to be able to choose both A and M with auto ISO and EV compensation, then use the P mode which is scalable, you will have auto ISO, A and S to your liking and EV comp.

--
rrr_hhh
 
sigala1 said:
CrashE3 said:
I can not fathom what you are talking about..?! You are in manual mode.. you are the exposure compensation. Set A/S to your liking and let the auto ISO keep you there. What am I not getting? I don't see a problem to correct... certainly not enough to criticize Olympus over..
Click to expand...
Like aperture and shutter speed, ISO is now one of the basic paramaters.

If you want a particular aperture (for wider DOF or maybe because you're using a lens that sucks wide open so you want to stop it down a bit), and a particular shutter speed (it should be obvious why you don't want your shutter speed to be too low), but you want the camera to still meter the scene and take a well exposed picture, and you would use exposure compensation here for the exact same reason you'd use exposure compenstion in A or S mode.

In other words, you don't really want "manual mode", you're using M when you really want "shutter and aperture priority mode".

Olympus doesn't get that A S and M are outdated modes, relics of the film era. There should be wheels for shutter, aperture and iso, and you can set any of them to AUTO that you like (none, all, or something in between).
Click to expand...
Then set ISO to auto, use the P mode which is scalable and EV comp. just the same result using another method : you have auto iso, EV comp and you can decide both about s and a. I don't think there is any problem there, Olympus is not necessarily supposed to mimic your Nikon. It can yield the very same result using other method. Which makes more sense, since what you want is not a real manual mode.
--
rrr_hhh
 
Your preview states that on the four ways controller the right and down arrows are customizable, the left arrow is fixed for AF area, what is the up-arrow for ? EV comp, like on the E-P3 ? Or better ISO ?

TIA for answering all our questions !
--
rrr_hhh
 
rrr_hhh said:
ginsbu said:
R Butler said:
sigala1 said:
R Butler said:
I'd jumped over all the correct hurdles, then forgotten to turn Auto ISO on when I tested earlier.

I was wrong, Auto ISO is available in M mode.
Click to expand...
With Auto ISO in M mode, can you set exposure compensation?
Click to expand...
No, you can't.

Richard - dpreview.com
Click to expand...
Argh! It is absolutely infuriating that Olympus won't allow this. Auto ISO is severely limited in M mode without it. Nikon gets it. Pentax does too.

Richard, please criticize Olympus for this in their review. Maybe that will encourage them to fix it.

Thanks for being so responsive in this thread!
Click to expand...
I don't see it as really problematic, after all a manual mode is supposed to let you fix all the parameters by yourself. In what is it disturbing to activate either the shutter dial, or the aperture dial if instead of the compensation wheel ? All the more that with this camera the same wheel will be functioning in all the PASM modes. It is already surprising that you are allowed to have ISO auto in manual mode. If you want to be able to choose both A and M with auto ISO and EV compensation, then use the P mode which is scalable, you will have auto ISO, A and S to your liking and EV comp.
Click to expand...
Not the same. In P mode the shutter speed and aperture don't stay fixed as the scene changes; with Auto ISO enabled the camera will adjust all three parameters.

The goal is to have the camera keep shutter and aperture fixed, while varying only ISO. Exposure comp is needed to bias the metering as the scene requires. Pentax calls it 'TAv' and Nikon calls it 'M'—I don't care what Olympus calls such a mode; I just care that they have it.

A situation where such a mode is very useful is shooting a person in variable lighting against a light or dark background, when you want shallow DOF and a high enough shutter speed to freeze any subject movement. So you can specify f/2, 1/125, and exposure comp to adjust for the background, leaving ISO to the camera.

As far as I'm concerned, such a mode is the most natural for creative photography. The primary creative parameters, shutter speed and aperture, and overall tonal level (via exposure comp) are set by the photographer, without requiring the photographer to constantly adjust ISO manually to varying lighting conditions.
 
May I ask:

In apature priorety mode, @ISO 200 (with lens cap on) what is the longest exposure the camera will meater for? - The EP1s are only down to 4sec, can this OMD automaticly expose for longer (without any exposure compensation)?

Thank you in advance,

J
 
NZ Scott said:
R Butler said:
I'm trying to add a few extra details to the E-M5 preview, to clear up uncertainties.

Are there any specific questions that I need to cover (I can't promise to address everything as I only have a pre-production camera, so can't comment on performance).

Richard - dpreview.com
Click to expand...
I would suggest that you pay special attention to IBIS in your review.

In the past, various reviewers have stated that the E-P3 and E-PL3 IBIS is good for three stops or so, but in every instance they have not produced any evidence of this (in other words, it's anecdotal).

I have tested IBIS on my E-P3 extensively, and found it to be useless.

Now Oly is touting its new 5-way IBIS as the best thing since sliced bread, and I suspect that this is just more marketing hype.

This is the method I used:

1) Select a lens / focal length subject.

2) Set sutter speed using the rule-of-thumb 1/focal length.

3) Shoot three frames hand-held, as steadily as possible, with IBIS off.

4) Repeat with IBIS on.

5) Zoom in and choose the sharpest. Is it IBIS on or IBIS off?

5) Repeat the above at various shutter speeds, some faster than 1/focal length, and some slower.

I've found that most of the time it's 50/50 as to which frame is sharpest. At higher shutter speeds, IBIS actually makes photos worse (they look more blurry). At very slow shutter speeds, IBIS makes a difference, but rarely enough to make the pic useable (shutter speeds are usually so low as to render the shot useless in any case).

I hope dpreview will be the first website to test Oly's IBIS claims.

Regards,
Scott
Click to expand...
I think the problem with most methods of testing IBIS is removing the human variable from the equation. Your method would determine how effective the IBIS is for the person doing the test. Which would difficult to extrapolate to a wider population as obviously some people have very steady hands and others less so.

I actually think that one of the review sites actually quoted “results” for an IBIS test where they labelled the test subjects with such scientific nomenclature such as “Mr Shaky”. So I think a wee pinch of salt is needed with most claims regarding IBIS.

Jim
 
R Butler said:
kenw said:
I'm guessing the dials have fixed functions in the various shooting mode (aperture/exp.comp. for A, aperture/shutter for M. etc.). Or is there some level of customization applied to the dials as well?
Click to expand...
There is LOTS of customization for dials (just as there was on the E-P3).

It's customizable per shooting mode so you can choose which function goes on which dial and specify for each shooting mode.

So, for instance, in Aperture Priority mode you can have FNo (aperture) on either dial and then put exposure comp, flash comp or FNo on the other one.

You can even specify which dial scrolls up and down menus and which delves in/out of them.

If you have a firm idea of what you want, it'll probably let you do it.
Click to expand...
Can it be set in A mode with aperture in one dial and sensitivity in the other?
(Richard seems to be gone, but maybe someone else knows the answer to this...)
 
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