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Reat this one: Need help, buyer remormse maybe but I am not sure how to handle this?

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JJJRRR768

JJJRRR768

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I sold my GRD on ebay about 3 weeks ago, it shipped to Canada, so quick shipping. Unit was received 12 or more days ago.

I never had any issues with this camera that I ordered from Clifton Camera in the UK and has it shipped to the US. I am a bit confused the first message talks about a blank screen, the second about a lens sticking, so they are inconsistent. I have never sold something not as described, I have always has a 1005 positive rating on ebay. I am confused. My sales was "all sales final". The seller has not in so many words said so but it appears that he wants me to refund him.... As I said I never had any issue with this camera, any suggestions on how to handle this would be appreciated.
Thanks

Message received 10 days ago

"Hey, I deleted your emails so I'm contacting you this way. I'm wondering how much you used this camera and if you had any problems with it? Twice the screen has died out wile shooting, I thought it was the battery but it was fully charged. I then tried to use new AAA batteries and it kept saying change batteries and turning off. It also seems to have a very hard time focusing... This is very disturbing to me and I hope this can be resolved, I need this camera to work."
Message received today

"Okay, I tested it for a wile now and it keeps shutting off with the lens still extended even with a fully charged battery. I love this camera but I cannot have it so unreliable especially when I paid for a working camera. You sold me a broken camera and we need to do something to rectify this situation as soon as possible. I wish this would have worked out different as this camera would have been perfect for me.
Hope to hear from you soon."
 
Wow. This is a tough one. I have done lots of buying / selling on Ebay (about 650 feedbacks, 100% positive) and I'll offer my thoughts.

First, if the buyer paid by PayPal I would just take back the camera and refund the money. Why? Because I know someone who sold an electronic item on Ebay, all sales final, and he was 100% certain it was in perfect condition when he sent it. The buyer claimed it did not work. The seller said 'all sales final, it was well packed and I know it was working.' The buyer went to PayPal - who refunded the buyer's money from the seller's account, AND he didn't have to send back the item he bought! For all the seller knows, the buyer just hornswoggled him out of his item for free.

(One lesson learned - if you have a PayPal account don't leave money sitting in it. Transfer it to your bank account post haste.)

The message from your buyer does come across to me as being somewhat sincere. Are the problems he is having with the camera known to affect that model even if they never happened to you? It would be a bad time for the camera to start displaying the issues but you still do end up with the chance he will go to PayPal (again, if he paid that way) and you end up getting nothing at all for your camera as well as paying to ship it.

If the buyer paid by check or other method then you have to decide. If it were I, then I would probably say 'I'm sorry it's not working right, it genuinely was before and you can see by my feedback profile that I'm a reliable seller. Please pack it up and send it back to me and when I receive it undamaged I will refund your money.' When you get it, check it out yourself and see if it is actually working or not. If it is, try selling it again. If not, then at least you know you've done the right thing.

There is always the possibility that the buyer is hoping you'll offer to give him back half his money to settle, or that he hopes you'll just refund his money and say the heck with it. I've bought a couple of things and sold a couple as well where they didn't work though they should have, and the easiest thing for all concerned was to just write it off and refund the money. That was with less expensive items however.

It's a frustrating situation. Even if it's just buyer's remorse and he goes to PayPal you are at risk of losing the money and the camera. I like PayPal but they have some policies that I think are grossly unfair.

Unfortunately Ebay has turned their feedback system into a happy happy tra la la system where it's near impossible to leave negative feedback, so it's hard to find out whether this buyer has a reputation for returning items or being unreasonable. You can't even give someone a negative for not paying unless you wait between X and Y number of days and then it's a hassle to get back your listing fee. Ebay is taking a big chunk of the sales price and if you refund to your seller I would at least try to recoup the listing fee if possible.

--
Art is far superior to "artsy".
 
Midwest said:
Wow. This is a tough one. I have done lots of buying / selling on Ebay (about 650 feedbacks, 100% positive) and I'll offer my thoughts.

First, if the buyer paid by PayPal I would just take back the camera and refund the money. Why? Because I know someone who sold an electronic item on Ebay, all sales final, and he was 100% certain it was in perfect condition when he sent it. The buyer claimed it did not work. The seller said 'all sales final, it was well packed and I know it was working.' The buyer went to PayPal - who refunded the buyer's money from the seller's account, AND he didn't have to send back the item he bought! For all the seller knows, the buyer just hornswoggled him out of his item for free.

(One lesson learned - if you have a PayPal account don't leave money sitting in it. Transfer it to your bank account post haste.)

The message from your buyer does come across to me as being somewhat sincere. Are the problems he is having with the camera known to affect that model even if they never happened to you? It would be a bad time for the camera to start displaying the issues but you still do end up with the chance he will go to PayPal (again, if he paid that way) and you end up getting nothing at all for your camera as well as paying to ship it.

If the buyer paid by check or other method then you have to decide. If it were I, then I would probably say 'I'm sorry it's not working right, it genuinely was before and you can see by my feedback profile that I'm a reliable seller. Please pack it up and send it back to me and when I receive it undamaged I will refund your money.' When you get it, check it out yourself and see if it is actually working or not. If it is, try selling it again. If not, then at least you know you've done the right thing.

There is always the possibility that the buyer is hoping you'll offer to give him back half his money to settle, or that he hopes you'll just refund his money and say the heck with it. I've bought a couple of things and sold a couple as well where they didn't work though they should have, and the easiest thing for all concerned was to just write it off and refund the money. That was with less expensive items however.

It's a frustrating situation. Even if it's just buyer's remorse and he goes to PayPal you are at risk of losing the money and the camera. I like PayPal but they have some policies that I think are grossly unfair.

Unfortunately Ebay has turned their feedback system into a happy happy tra la la system where it's near impossible to leave negative feedback, so it's hard to find out whether this buyer has a reputation for returning items or being unreasonable. You can't even give someone a negative for not paying unless you wait between X and Y number of days and then it's a hassle to get back your listing fee. Ebay is taking a big chunk of the sales price and if you refund to your seller I would at least try to recoup the listing fee if possible.

--
Art is far superior to "artsy".
Click to expand...
Thanks....I do have a paypal account and it was paid for that way....I never leave money there but paypal can go into your bank account and take money out, unless you close that account...but that is not what I want to do....I hear you on paypal though. Especially since they also have the shipping wrapped up in this for an additional $40. Something to think about.
 
Is there a third party camera store where the buyer could take
the camera to be evaluated for its working condition, something
like an insurance adjuster who will verify on oath his opinion?
 
Maybe I'm too suspicious but, if you accept the camera back, be sure it is the same serial number as your camera. It is possible that the buyer was trying to replace a defective camera with yours.

Of course, it's always possible that his charger or the batteries he's using (AAA's?) are the problem -- sounds like it to me.

This is a difficult situation I have always imagined when I consider selling something on ebay, etc.

--
Darrell
 
Maybe the batteries are at fault here. Who knows what the buyer is using.

Perhaps you could gently suggest the buyer use brand new from the store good quality non-rechargeables. Is the camera compatible with Lithium non rechargeable cells? Try those.

Some poor quality or old rechargeable cells drop in voltage very abruptly even when fully charged. It could be the camera is reacting to that.
 
Joel,

how unfortunate. The problem is that you can never be sure that the camera has not just started malfunctioning. I don't know exactly why the buyer is trying AAA s but I think that that is a red herring, as cheap AAAs are not really going to work. But the whole thing about the blank screen, focusing and the lens is unverifiable from your end and it is never going to get resolved unless you got the camera back.

I don't think you can ask him to get it checked, so the cleanest way out of this is to bite the bullet and offer a refund, getting the camera back. Get the camera back before you refund. Check it and sell it again.

He says: 'You sold me a broken camera'

So, even if that is not true, I've got the feeling that they are never going to be happy with the camera now – even if they could be wrong and they don't really know what they're doing.

I suspect that a refund is the only way they will be satisfied and also away that you can be confident of a permanent resolution. But first, I think you need to ask the buyer what they want to happen – give that you are offering a full refund.
 
The suggestion that the buyer tries new batteries is a good one. If the problem persists you may have to accept a return of goods and give a refund if you want to avoid a loss of eBay rating and a lot of hassle and financial loss from PayPal.

It is unfortunate that your buyer is outside the EU as if he returns the item you may be asked to pay VAT + collection fee by Customs unless your buyer declares it as defective goods - no commercial value.
 
Trafford said:
Is there a third party camera store where the buyer could take
the camera to be evaluated for its working condition, something
like an insurance adjuster who will verify on oath his opinion?
Click to expand...
I asked him to send it to Ricoh but have not heard back, but this is a very good suggestion
 
I sent the camera with a Ricoh branded battery that I had used with no issues. I did not send a spare as I was keeping that for my daughter for her GX100. I did not even catch the AAA battery thing, thanks. I will probably take the camera back and no refund until it is in my hands. I am not sure i have the serial number but I have a pic of the box on my aperture, will have to check and see what it ways, i will know the box for sure. All good suggestions, thanks
 
How about asking the buyer to video the camera displaying one of the issues and include (in the same shot) the serial number and the battery indicator? If the battery is full and the serial number shows it's your camera and it is malfunctioning, then I'd ask the buyer to return the camera for a refund.

Prog.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/oren_b
 
I just spoke to Cameratech in the UK and they will look for the serial number, it was no on my receipt but I have not been able to check my ebay pics yet, I always have more than I post. You know, for a couple of hundred dollars it is just not worth the aggravation if this is the same camera. The person always sounded decent in emails (which I know means little these days but I like to have faith). If nothing else, if this is the same camera I will just use it for black and white jpegs but it has to be the same camera, and I am willing to bet I will never see the same issue ever. I so know what I will do in the meantime, he will have to but in a report to ebay so I get my fees reversed and the same to paypal. Those alone will make up about $35 or so US. I think I am done with ebay and paypal....tired of it, there is no control for the seller, no protection at all.
 
Joel, His tone implies to me that he is fishing for something back from you.

I sold a GX100 that worked fine on Amazon. Person had problems with it. She seemed sincere and I asked her to send it back and I'd refund her. We did that with no problems.

I would not trouble shoot or barter back and forth. Just tell the buyer to return it and that as soon as you receive it you'll refund the money. Be nice and friendly about it. If they give you trouble then hmmm...

Sorry about the troubles. Selling stuff like this is not easy.

But I would avoid Ebay. Use a reputable camera gear site, such as Fred Miranda, where you know the buyers are probably legit and fair.
 
Joel Stern said:
I just spoke to Cameratech in the UK and they will look for the serial number, it was no on my receipt but I have not been able to check my ebay pics yet, I always have more than I post...
Click to expand...
Hi Joel :-)

Sorry to hear about you problems with Ebay; quite common today though...

I don't know if the GRD is exactly like the GXR when it comes to exif data but I'm sure that with the help of ExifToolGUI (or any other decent free exif utility) you'd be able to easily retrieve the serial number of your camera from one of the pictures you've taken with it...

Just look under "Maker" info on the right hand side of ExifToolGUI and you'll see the info you're looking for...

Hope this helps and good luck with this matter...

Kind regards from Cologne,
Michael

--
Carpe Diem & Remember:

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing... (Edmund Burke)
http://www.picshare.co.il/member_gallery.asp?id=3180
 
have you looked back through his feedback profile
i think you can see what hes bought in the last 3 or 6 months
he may have bought faulty camera same as yours at car boot sale
and now saying that camera is yours
or he may have dropped yours on the floor
when i sell camera on ebay i always take serial number and write it down
and just before i post the camera i put a cheap sd card in and take a picture

of the uk newspaper headlines showing the date, this way they can tell it was working a

few days before,,,,but any post worker may drop and damage during transit
 
carpediem007 said:
Joel Stern said:
I just spoke to Cameratech in the UK and they will look for the serial number, it was no on my receipt but I have not been able to check my ebay pics yet, I always have more than I post...
Click to expand...
Hi Joel :-)

Sorry to hear about you problems with Ebay; quite common today though...

I don't know if the GRD is exactly like the GXR when it comes to exif data but I'm sure that with the help of ExifToolGUI (or any other decent free exif utility) you'd be able to easily retrieve the serial number of your camera from one of the pictures you've taken with it...

Just look under "Maker" info on the right hand side of ExifToolGUI and you'll see the info you're looking for...

Hope this helps and good luck with this matter...

Kind regards from Cologne,
Michael

--
Carpe Diem & Remember:

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing... (Edmund Burke)
http://www.picshare.co.il/member_gallery.asp?id=3180
Click to expand...
High Michael,

Thanks for info, so far no go, I cannot get it from the above or in aperture where is shows serial number and then a blank....so I am going to keep on looking but maybe Ricoh did not have this imbedded in their files....thanks
 
Thanks Andrew and I am taking yours and MW's advise.....get this back and enjoy it myself, and so far I have been nice but asked the buyer not to accuse me of selling a broken camera...I have not gotten a reply yet, so we shall see. when you do this do you bother to reimburse the shipping fees? I certainly will not reimburse for what he pays to ship it back.
 
Bassy said:
have you looked back through his feedback profile
i think you can see what hes bought in the last 3 or 6 months
he may have bought faulty camera same as yours at car boot sale
and now saying that camera is yours
or he may have dropped yours on the floor
when i sell camera on ebay i always take serial number and write it down
and just before i post the camera i put a cheap sd card in and take a picture

of the uk newspaper headlines showing the date, this way they can tell it was working a

few days before,,,,but any post worker may drop and damage during transit
Click to expand...
I will check his feedback thanks, and lesson learned on taking serial numbers..... lesson learned, I will not sell on ebay anymore, not worth the aggravation, I have only once before been scammed and I hope this is not another.
 
Sounds like the battery in the camera is not accepting full charge to me. If batteries are getting old and have not had a lot of use then they can sometimes be a problem. From memory AAA batteries were only for emergency use and at best only did about 30 shots maximum per set.

If the camera has had little use it may require a bit of continuous use to free up if that is the best word for it.

I cannot remember the GRD lens problems that much and I have never had any problems myself. I seem to recollect that there were some stuck lenses but the consensus was that it was quite easy to switch a GRD on whilst in the carry case or in a pocket and the lens would try and extend then jam when it met resistence.

Meanwhile it is a problem for you. I think it sounds like someone who might not be under the Ricoh GRD aura and just sees an old technology camera with prime lens and rudimentary menu system. If you are converted then you are converted and would never sell your GRD but for those that buy one in the cold light of the day they are just an aging digital camera from the days before light.

I guess you can only have it sent back to test it yourself and if it continues not working and no sign of tampering or misuse then you have to refund the money and call it experience.

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Hi Joel,
Sorry to read your story -- hopefully everything will turn out well.

I sold a lot of equipment, but never via eBay, only via forums. I believe that people are nicer there...

Just a short note regarding the S/N. On my Mac, GraphicConverter displays the S/N, but it is the S/N of the module. However, I do not know what the GRD does, because I never owned one.

But for a test, you might want to send me a sample photo and I might check whether a S/N is displayed.
Best regards, Gerd
 
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