Finally started my M system; more 28 and 50mm question

I just got a mint M9 (still got warranty with zero shutter count), never saw the light with the previous user because he never got to buy a lens. Now that my wallet is $5300 thinner, I'm considering other options in term of lenses.

As I said in the other thread, I want 28 Elmarit and 50 cron - but I realized that there is ZM 28/2.8 and 50/2 Planar.

Both ZMs, cost less than $2000 - so I'm interested (have to save more to buy cron/lux in the future) - but what will I miss if I get these ZMs instead of the Leica options?

Your advice and inputs are greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Winston
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The Zeiss options are excellent.

Some might be better than the Leica counterparts.

At the end it all comes to personal preference.

Zeiss are very good. But if you can afford leica, buy those. I couldnt so i bought zeiss. And i love the lens. 35mm f2. On my m8.
Would also be a good idea to wait until leica lenses are more available.
Hope you enjoy your new rangefinder.

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Great price on the M9!

A lens is very, very necessary if you want to get the most out of the camera. Don't forget that you can almost any M lens on the M9 (the old Dual Range 50mm Summicron being the most noticeable exception) and Leica thread mount (with an inexpensive adapter).

When I made the M8 plunge I spent a huge chunk of money on a modern Leica lens--the 35mm Summilux ASPH. Fantastic lens.

But I've rounded out the kit with lenses from different era, many of which are available on the used market for not that much money.

Definitely look around for older 50mm Summicrons and 28mm Elmarits--the latter won't be as small as the new ASPH version, but I don't think you'll be disappointed by the image quality. Plus, if you end up not liking them, you can generally resell at little or no loss.

And if you're happy with Zeiss glass, take a look at the used market there too--there aren't as many bargains as there pre-M9 and pre-Micro Four Thirds, but you can find one if you look for it.

--
Jim

http://www.daguerreotyping.com

Thank you for your feedback!

The reason I asked about ZM lenses is because today I played with ZF 35/1.4 distagon on Nikon bodies. It's a sharp lens, for sure, but I thought there's too much contrast and the color looks brighter as well. I don't know If this is the characteristic of current Zeiss lenses (including ZM).

As a comparison, my friend lent me his Nokton 50/1.1 and this lens produces some nice results on M9! In fact, I prefer the kind of rendering from this combo rather than ZF 35/1.4 on D3/D7000.

But of course, the Zeiss might behave differently on Nikon/Canon bodies since they use CMOS sensors, low pass filter, etc..

I just want to be sure before I pull the trigger - and there aren't many ZM users that I know.

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that's what I was thinking, get the ZM for now, save some money for 28 cron and 50 lux. But if ZM is a no go, I'll just get 28 Elmarit and 50 cron because that's pretty much what I can afford right now. Thanks!

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thanks for your inputs

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The Zeiss 50mm f2 Plana is a very nice lens with great colours and contrast, if you want something faster then the CV Nokton 50mm f1.5 is very good and very cheap, mine kept me happy until I got a 50mm Lux.

kewlguy said:

I just got a mint M9 (still got warranty with zero shutter count), never saw the light with the previous user because he never got to buy a lens. Now that my wallet is $5300 thinner, I'm considering other options in term of lenses.

As I said in the other thread, I want 28 Elmarit and 50 cron - but I realized that there is ZM 28/2.8 and 50/2 Planar.

Both ZMs, cost less than $2000 - so I'm interested (have to save more to buy cron/lux in the future) - but what will I miss if I get these ZMs instead of the Leica options?

Your advice and inputs are greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Winston
--

Click to expand...

Obviously, if you want Leica lens imaging qualities, you must buy Leica lenses...

But:

Nearly all the lenses available in M-Bayonet mount are pretty darn good lenses, whether Leica, Zeiss or Cosina/Voigtländer, and it is often simply a matter of what you like more in a given lens and can afford.

Getting back into Leica M, I decided to go with Voigtländer lenses to start, which I'll use for a while, and later consider specific Zeiss and Leica lens options if I feel I want something different.

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Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

..."I was wrong. I thought it was the end of your rants after you got yourself an M9, but it's actually the beginning of a nightmare!"

that happened after I told her about my lens options!

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I intend to try the ZMs before buying, hopefully it's up to its reputation so I could save some $$$ stilll.

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Your first line is really not helping me

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kewlguy said:

..."I was wrong. I thought it was the end of your rants after you got yourself an M9, but it's actually the beginning of a nightmare!"

that happened after I told her about my lens options!

Click to expand...

LOL!

My partner never says anything, he just cocks his eyebrow and shrugs, "It's your money. The rent is due next week." Then walks away. I pay the rent, then buy what I can pay cash for if I still want it.

I'm really quite happy with the CV lenses I purchased. Five new lenses for about $2000 .. I can't complain. But the results are what count. They are all producing satisfying results.
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Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

I had a Zeiss ZM 50/2 as well as a 50mm Summicron (latest version). I didn't see a difference, if anything at all, other than the colours of the Ziess. I kept the Zeiss, sold the Cron, and saved myself over a grand.

The best one from Zeiss are:
ZM 50/2 Planar - As good as the 50/2 cron IMO
ZM 35/2.8 C-Biogon
ZM 25/2.8 Biogon

From Voigtlander, the ones to get are:

28/1.9 Ultron (the newer 28/2 doesn't seem to be as good, and suffers from focus shift)
28/3.5 pancake (if speed isn't crucial)
35/1.2 vII

35/2.5 Color Skopar (I have one, and I liked it better than my 35/2 Cron IV pre-asph, which I sold, as a result)
75/2.5 super sharp, with great bokeh

Thank you for your great input!

50/2 planar, 25/2.8 Biogon (or 28/2.8 Biogon), and 35/2.5 skopar are on the list! They are not available in my area, so I'm trying to find them in OZ and Singapore.

I have in my hand now a brand new 50/1.1 Nokton - while a great lens (sharp wide open, 90% CA gone at f/1.4), I still feel that I miss something with the bokeh. Bokeh is not bad, really, but at f/1.1 I expect it melts more Until I have the 50/2 planar I don't know which one I should keep. I don't expect 50/2 has better bokeh, but that Zeiss crispness should help!

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I have a Leica M5 35mm film camera and a digital rangefinder the Epson R-D1 as well as 2 Russian made LTM (M39) bodies and have (5) Leica lenses and (4) LTM M39 lenses from other mfr's. Almost all of them were purchased from KEH.com second hand. It's was nice to pay $850 for an EX grade 50mm f/1.4 Summilux first version (my favorire lens out of 50 others in all mounts).

I saved a lot by purchasing Leica M and LTM from KEH.com under $300 for each additional lens 90mm f/4 Elmar, 135mm f/4 Elmar and a 50mm f/2 Summitar LTM and a 35mm f/3.5 LTM Summaron all Leicsa glass. I purchased adapters from Rainbow Imagies at Amazon.com for M39 to Leica M for $25 each (after paying around $55 for the same adapters from several other vendors-the exact same adapters.

Then a new Voightlander 28mm f/3.5 Color-Skopar in M39/LTM for $235 from B&H.com.

Lastly I went over to the NYC based Russian on line seller Urie is his name at FEDKA.com and purchased 3 Russian made screw mount lenses and 2 cameras, 85/f2 Zorki ($185) and 2 50mm f/3.5 copies of the Leica Elmar's (collapsable) for under $100 and FED IIIc and Zorki IIIa.

My point is that you can obtain a very complete Leica lens collection from 35mm Summaron, 50mm Summilux, 90mm Elmar and 135mm Elmar all for about for around $1,200. Then you can add a 28mm f/3.5 Voightlander for around $350 (the price has gone up since 2006 and 2007. Lastly you can spend around $300 and get a nice 85mm f/2, and two 50mm f/3.5 all in LTM Russian made lenses.

My second hand lenses don't know that they are second hand and they work fine on all 4 cameras. Note M system lens cannot mount on M39 LTM bodies.

Before I got into Leica back in 2006 I had spent about $12,000 - $14,000 on new Canon L lenses as I purchased 10 of them as well as the $8,000 Top of the Line 1DsMkII camera.

I learned my lesson and decided to save as I no longer was a working pro and never can be again as I'm now disabled. But I srill love photography and continue to shoot in film and digital in Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Olympus, Panasonic and Leica and Kodak SLR/n. I have 4 pro bodies, 2 of which are FF Digital.

I recomend that as a hobbiest that you start out with the used Leica Lens selection that I have talked about. They are excellent. Then. slowly if you really Must, you can purchase new Leica and Zeiss glass. I'm thinking you will find this unneccessay as the second hand lenses are very very good.
-Peter
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Life as an artist has had some unusual times to say the least.
visit my web site http://www.flickr.com/photos/artist_eyes/
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That is a solid advice - but it's hard find used Leica lens in my area. It's equally difficult buying new and second hand here. Seems like I'm gonna have to stuck with the Nokton for a while.

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JPG OOC f/1.1 ISO640



DNG converted in CS5, f/1.4 ISO160



the Nokton is a good lens, at f/1.4 CA is mostly gone. I just wonder why the DOF even at f/1.1 seems 'longer' than it's supposed to be.

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My opinion is that anything between the 28mm - 50mm range, get a Leica. Anything outside of this, get a Zeiss or other brand (not following my own logic I have a 21mm Elmarit). My reasoning is that this range would be your typical focal length range (> 50% use), so might as well get the best you can (not disparaging Zeiss or other manufacturer's qualities).

I just bought a 50mm Summicron - used. New ones are hard to come by (even my normal go to Leica places in NYC), so if you are interested in a 50 cron you're only option might be used unless your patient. If you wait, the price will only go up, so either you find a good condition used one now and get the quality, or wait for a new one where the price may go higher.

kewlguy said:

I just got a mint M9 (still got warranty with zero shutter count), never saw the light with the previous user because he never got to buy a lens. Now that my wallet is $5300 thinner, I'm considering other options in term of lenses.

As I said in the other thread, I want 28 Elmarit and 50 cron - but I realized that there is ZM 28/2.8 and 50/2 Planar.

Both ZMs, cost less than $2000 - so I'm interested (have to save more to buy cron/lux in the future) - but what will I miss if I get these ZMs instead of the Leica options?

Your advice and inputs are greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Winston
--

Click to expand...

There must be on-line sellers even in Indonesia. I'm in the U.S.A. and I can purchase from Japan and China as well as my U.S.A. vendors. I'd give it a try. Also there is alway's E-Bay. Sometimes on e-bay you can locate a reputable on-line vendor selling on e-bay.
-Peter

kewlguy said:

That is a solid advice - but it's hard find used Leica lens in my area. It's equally difficult buying new and second hand here. Seems like I'm gonna have to stuck with the Nokton for a while.

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Click to expand...

--
Life as an artist has had some unusual times to say the least.
visit my web site http://www.flickr.com/photos/artist_eyes/
Remember to click on 'All Sizes' for better viewing.
Artist Eyes