Why would you choose a Nikon 1 ?

A picture is worth a thousand words. Here is a mirrorless camera with zoom lens mounted, fitting inside the space of a Rebel DSLR body (a DSLR it is already one of the smallest DSLR bodies). Hardly a slight reduction in overall volume. LOL
We were talking about a whole system. I usually carry 4-5 lenses, covering a range from full-frame fisheye to 400mm, and including at least two fast primes and a flash with a guide number of 58, plus accessories (filters, remotes, gels, mini-tripods, memory cards, cleaning stuff, spare batteries, bag with weather protection, etc.). Show me that, not a simple 1-lens system. If a 1-lens camera is what we're after, I'll go for a lack of interchangeability and save a lot of size and weight - enough to get it in my pocket and get rid of the bag as well.

My typical travel kit:

5D
24-105L IS
70-200/2.8L IS
Sigma 15mm fisheye
35/1.4L
Two 1.4x teleconverters
580EX
Accessories
All inside a ThinkTank ChangeUp.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
Pocket, pocket, pocket, pocket. Can't get beyond the pocket issue, can you? Well, guess what? These mirrorless systems are going to be the next big thing in photography.
Good for them. For now, they represent less than 1% of deployed systems, and I've never once seen one outside of a store, even after six straight days at Disney.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
The other factor is, often, being able to take a photo unobtrusively and un-noticed.
You're gonna be noticed no matter what you shoot with. I certainly have no problem noticing when people are taking a picture with their cellphones, so surely spotting a guy using Sony NEX with that 18-200 isnt gonna be too big of a problem either.

But hey, if one believes he's somehow become invisible just cause he's now using a big black camera that's 300g lighter than his previous one, that will perhaps encourage him more to go out and shoot. It's all in the head..
 
Which still does not mean that the f stop magically adjusts when you put an F lens on a CX mount with the adapter.

F mount lenses will produce a larger focal circle which is then cropped in, making the actual f stop smaller than quoted on the lens. If the camera software accounts for this and tells you the relative f stop I will gladly eat my breakfast tomorrow. ;-)

--
================================
Enjoying Photography like never before with the E-450!
Images, photo and gimp tips:
http://olympe450rants.blogspot.com/

NORWEGIAN WOOD GALLERY
http://fourthirds-user.com/galleries/showgallery.php/cat/888

Olympus' Own E450 Gallery http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/products/dslr/e450/sample/

"to be is to do" Descartes;
"to do is to be" Satre ;

............................"DoBeDoBeDo" Sinatra.
=============================
 
Remember when Sony NEX used the sole selling point of " you can have a nice blurry background like the grown up photographers have"?

This is being pitched at P&S upgraders with the big USP benefit of speed. Great.

However: It looks like nikon have put all their eggs into erm 1.5 baskets with an allegedly superb focus system and FPS while neglecting

1) Ergonomics
2) What you can do with the size of chip
3) How much a decent sub f 3 system will actually cost the punter
4) Who is it that pays more than 600 USD for a camera?
--
================================
Enjoying Photography like never before with the E-450!
Images, photo and gimp tips:
http://olympe450rants.blogspot.com/

NORWEGIAN WOOD GALLERY
http://fourthirds-user.com/galleries/showgallery.php/cat/888

Olympus' Own E450 Gallery http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/products/dslr/e450/sample/

"to be is to do" Descartes;
"to do is to be" Satre ;

............................"DoBeDoBeDo" Sinatra.
=============================
 
Remember when Sony NEX used the sole selling point of " you can have a nice blurry background like the grown up photographers have"?

This is being pitched at P&S upgraders with the big USP benefit of speed. Great.

However: It looks like nikon have put all their eggs into erm 1.5 baskets with an allegedly superb focus system and FPS while neglecting

1) Ergonomics
Why would the ergonomics be worse than other mirrorless?
2) What you can do with the size of chip
One stop less DOF control vs a m43 system is a drawback I agree, but otherwise the sensor performance overall seems to match the m43 sensor surprisingly well.
DxOMarks are out:

http://nikonrumors.com/2011/09/28/nikon-1-test-results-from-dxomark-are-out.aspx/
3) How much a decent sub f 3 system will actually cost the punter
We will see when the fast lenses comes out (fast normal prime and fast portrait lens are promised). Otherwise, one can use the small tele zoom for subject isolation.




4) Who is it that pays more than 600 USD for a camera?
--
I think the V1 competes price wise well with Oly m43s and the Pana GF-series, considering you dont have to buy an optional viewfinder.

================================
Enjoying Photography like never before with the E-450!
Images, photo and gimp tips:
http://olympe450rants.blogspot.com/

NORWEGIAN WOOD GALLERY
http://fourthirds-user.com/galleries/showgallery.php/cat/888

Olympus' Own E450 Gallery http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/products/dslr/e450/sample/

"to be is to do" Descartes;
"to do is to be" Satre ;

............................"DoBeDoBeDo" Sinatra.
=============================
--
http://dslr-video.com/blogmag/
 
Pocket, pocket, pocket, pocket. Can't get beyond the pocket issue, can you? Well, guess what? These mirrorless systems are going to be the next big thing in photography.
Good for them. For now, they represent less than 1% of deployed systems, and I've never once seen one outside of a store, even after six straight days at Disney.
I see them around Toronto all the time - NX, NEX and Olympus. The size of a 5 lens kit gets smaller as the sensor gets smaller. And the mirrorless companies choose to cater to those who want small stuff. Look at the size of a NX200+16mmf2.4+20mmf2.8+30mmf2. It's a very small, fast collection to which you can add bulkier special purpose lenses on occasion. And it's not just that the whole kit is small, it's that you have there 3 body+lens combinations all of which are small. Not bad for a very young system that hasn't really had time to take off.
 
The other factor is, often, being able to take a photo unobtrusively and un-noticed.
You're gonna be noticed no matter what you shoot with. I certainly have no problem noticing when people are taking a picture with their cellphones, so surely spotting a guy using Sony NEX with that 18-200 isnt gonna be too big of a problem either.

But hey, if one believes he's somehow become invisible just cause he's now using a big black camera that's 300g lighter than his previous one, that will perhaps encourage him more to go out and shoot. It's all in the head..
LOL. No, it's not "all in the head." Walk into some market, or store, or public location with a big DSLR and lens slung over your shoulder, versus a very compact mirrorless camera, and you'll get a very different response from people, either overtly or non-overtly. It isn't that a smaller non-DSLR camera makes you "invisible". It's that non-DSLRs look less serious, and intimidating. That's why some people, like yourself, will notice people "taking a picture with their cell phones" and not think anything of it. But when a guy comes traipsing through with a bag full of DSLR gear and a DSLR clacking away as he shoots, it creates a different impression to bystanders.

And as for your "Sony NEX with that 18-200" example, who says he has to use an 18-200? Sony does make smaller NEX lenses, including a pancake lens. Likewise, the m43 system also offers pancake lenses as well. Heck, even with some zoom lenses, some of these cameras present miniscule packages compared to even small DSLRs.



And with these cameras being a fraction of the size of a DSLR, it is not only less obvious, it creates a totally different impression than a big DSLR.

Furthermore, it isn't just an issue of camera weight effecting whether someone may or may not take their camera gear along with them. It is also a factor of whether one feels its really appropriate, or distracting to others, to take along one's DSLR gear. When you have a camera that can be tucked away much more easily than a DSLR, and is less attention-drawing when it is out, this can and does effect whether you may or may not take your camera.

I'm sure all of us have encountered situations where we decided "I'd like to bring my DSLR, but it's too big...too heavy...more difficult to tuck it away...will draw too much attention...might make the wrong impression...might make people nervous...etc" whether a camera kit that is much more compact (see image above) would have been a better option to have. Of course, there are people who will say, "I don't have a d@mn what kind of impression, or attention, or effect I create with my big DSLR gear! It's not my problem!"...well, I don't think we need to talk about those callous oafs. LOL
 
Pocket, pocket, pocket, pocket. Can't get beyond the pocket issue, can you? Well, guess what? These mirrorless systems are going to be the next big thing in photography.
Good for them. For now, they represent less than 1% of deployed systems, and I've never once seen one outside of a store, even after six straight days at Disney.
Wow. Talk about shortsightedness! Everything has to start somewhere.

First of all, the mirrorless market is growing rapidly . In Japan, mirrorless cameras have contributed to a "35% drop in their combined market share" for Canon and Nikon. And "mirrorless cameras now account for an impressive 40.5% of Japanese-market ILC [Interchangeable Lens Camera] sales." As for worldwide sales, mirrorless cameras are "accounting for just 16% of ILC sales worldwide", but "The projection is that this will grow to some 23% by the end of 2011." Yes, by the end of this year, mirrorless cameras are expected to account for almost one quarter of all interchangeable lens cameras! Imagine what that percentage will be by the end of 2012, when mirrorless systems will be even more mature, and more heavily marketed, with mirrorless systems like Canon's in full swing!

Here's the article:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/NEWS/1315587245.html

Unfortunately, you're being a bit shortsighted, narrow-mined, and ill-informed. I wouldn't be so dismissive of mirrorless systems.
 
A picture is worth a thousand words. Here is a mirrorless camera with zoom lens mounted, fitting inside the space of a Rebel DSLR body (a DSLR it is already one of the smallest DSLR bodies). Hardly a slight reduction in overall volume. LOL
We were talking about a whole system. I usually carry 4-5 lenses, covering a range from full-frame fisheye to 400mm, and including at least two fast primes and a flash with a guide number of 58, plus accessories (filters, remotes, gels, mini-tripods, memory cards, cleaning stuff, spare batteries, bag with weather protection, etc.). Show me that, not a simple 1-lens system. If a 1-lens camera is what we're after, I'll go for a lack of interchangeability and save a lot of size and weight - enough to get it in my pocket and get rid of the bag as well.

My typical travel kit:

5D
24-105L IS
70-200/2.8L IS
Sigma 15mm fisheye
35/1.4L
Two 1.4x teleconverters
580EX
Accessories
All inside a ThinkTank ChangeUp.
Yeah, and you'll stick out like a sore thumb in most places. And you're lugging a lot of weight too. That's fine for certain occasions, but some of us like the option of also using smaller, more compact gear. So you're missing the point again . LOL. Not everyone needs to head out the door with a full load of 35mm DSLR gear all the time. Sometimes, all you want or need is a compact interchangeable lens mirrorless system. So don't be so narrowminded. We all have a full set of DSLR gear. We all know what it feels like to lug it all around. We all know what it's like to carry around a bag stuffed with DSLR gear. We all know the feel of that weight on our shoulder or our waist (I use a Think Tank Skin Set belt system for weddings). But some of us realize that it would be nice to have a more compact set of interchangeable lens camera gear.
 
Yeah, and you'll stick out like a sore thumb in most places.
So what?
And you're lugging a lot of weight too.
About a third as much as carrying my daughter, can I'm carrying it supported on both of my hips and both of my shoulders at the same time. 6 days in a row at Disney for 12-16 hours a day wasn't a problem.
That's fine for certain occasions, but some of us like the option of also using smaller, more compact gear. So you're missing the point again . LOL. Not everyone needs to head out the door with a full load of 35mm DSLR gear all the time.
Sometimes I leave with just my 5D and a 24-105L. Most of the time, if I don't have room for the whole kit, I don't have room for anything other than my pocket camera.
Sometimes, all you want or need is a compact interchangeable lens mirrorless system. So don't be so narrowminded. We all have a full set of DSLR gear. We all know what it feels like to lug it all around.
Most people carry it wrong.
We all know what it's like to carry around a bag stuffed with DSLR gear. We all know the feel of that weight on our shoulder or our waist (I use a Think Tank Skin Set belt system for weddings). But some of us realize that it would be nice to have a more compact set of interchangeable lens camera gear.
Not me.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
1) Ergonomics
Why would the ergonomics be worse than other mirrorless?
Some of the other mirrorless cameras have integrated grips and external controls.
2) What you can do with the size of chip
One stop less DOF control vs a m43 system is a drawback I agree, but otherwise the sensor performance overall seems to match the m43 sensor surprisingly well.
DxOMarks are out:

http://nikonrumors.com/2011/09/28/nikon-1-test-results-from-dxomark-are-out.aspx/
Sensor performance can change over time, but the sensor size (and inherent limitations on DOF control) is going to be a constant.
3) How much a decent sub f 3 system will actually cost the punter
We will see when the fast lenses comes out (fast normal prime and fast portrait lens are promised). Otherwise, one can use the small tele zoom for subject isolation.



The much smaller sensor is still going to be a limitation for DOF control. And using telezooms for subject isolation requires that you have the distance to work with. You'll have to stand back pretty far, made even worse by the 2.7X multiplier.
4) Who is it that pays more than 600 USD for a camera?
--
I think the V1 competes price wise well with Oly m43s and the Pana GF-series, considering you dont have to buy an optional viewfinder.
The problem is that an E-PL3 ($699) plus the optional viewfinder VF-3 ($175) is still less expensive than a V1 ($899). Plus, the VF-3 offers variable angle viewfinder viewing. Also keep in mind that you won't have to buy an optional viewfinder every time you buy a PEN camera because it's transferable/interchangeable between your cameras. Plus, the Nikon 1 cameras don't have in-body stabilization, which the PEN cameras do have. And the Nikon 1 cameras don't have wireless flash (which is very bizarre, since Nikon does have a wireless DSLR flash system), which the PEN cameras have. In fact, the V1 doesn't include a flash at all, so you'll have to buy the SB-N5 ($149), even if all you want is a touch of fill light. And quite frankly, I think most buyers (especially the P&S upgraders that the N1 is targeting) are going to want or expect a flash more than a VF. Most P&S users are pretty okay with not having a VF. But no flash, or having to pay an additional $149 to have a flash? Hmmm, I don't think that's going to be so attrractive for most consumers.
 
The ergonomics of the size and shape, the dials and the big longer zoom are maybe just a matter of taste.

The image shown is fine and apart from "how far away were you ?" with the telefoto at at least a 135 eq of 90mm, hence slow exposures for those f stops, I smell something PR ish:

1) No EXIF suggesting Nikon's PR agency have had to go straight for RAW which the targe market have never heard of. Is it even a V1 shot?

2) A little soft, but really nice colours. DR is better than maybe to be expected

3) Not expanding far enough for the pixel peepers, or in fact to really get an idea of sharpness for an 8x10 print.

When Ashton Kutcher has a purple polkadot one, it will sell a shed to a whole new group of Hagendaas upgraders who never knew they needed to blow a grand on a two lens system.

iPhone 5 anyone?

--
================================
Enjoying Photography like never before with the E-450!
Images, photo and gimp tips:
http://olympe450rants.blogspot.com/

NORWEGIAN WOOD GALLERY
http://fourthirds-user.com/galleries/showgallery.php/cat/888

Olympus' Own E450 Gallery http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/products/dslr/e450/sample/

"to be is to do" Descartes;
"to do is to be" Satre ;

............................"DoBeDoBeDo" Sinatra.
=============================
 
1) Ergonomics
Why would the ergonomics be worse than other mirrorless?
Some of the other mirrorless cameras have integrated grips and external controls.
2) What you can do with the size of chip
One stop less DOF control vs a m43 system is a drawback I agree, but otherwise the sensor performance overall seems to match the m43 sensor surprisingly well.
DxOMarks are out:

http://nikonrumors.com/2011/09/28/nikon-1-test-results-from-dxomark-are-out.aspx/
Sensor performance can change over time, but the sensor size (and inherent limitations on DOF control) is going to be a constant.
3) How much a decent sub f 3 system will actually cost the punter
We will see when the fast lenses comes out (fast normal prime and fast portrait lens are promised). Otherwise, one can use the small tele zoom for subject isolation.



The much smaller sensor is still going to be a limitation for DOF control. And using telezooms for subject isolation requires that you have the distance to work with. You'll have to stand back pretty far, made even worse by the 2.7X multiplier.
4) Who is it that pays more than 600 USD for a camera?
--
I think the V1 competes price wise well with Oly m43s and the Pana GF-series, considering you dont have to buy an optional viewfinder.
The problem is that an E-PL3 ($699) plus the optional viewfinder VF-3 ($175) is still less expensive than a V1 ($899). Plus, the VF-3 offers variable angle viewfinder viewing. Also keep in mind that you won't have to buy an optional viewfinder every time you buy a PEN camera because it's transferable/interchangeable between your cameras. Plus, the Nikon 1 cameras don't have in-body stabilization, which the PEN cameras do have. And the Nikon 1 cameras don't have wireless flash (which is very bizarre, since Nikon does have a wireless DSLR flash system), which the PEN cameras have. In fact, the V1 doesn't include a flash at all, so you'll have to buy the SB-N5 ($149), even if all you want is a touch of fill light. And quite frankly, I think most buyers (especially the P&S upgraders that the N1 is targeting) are going to want or expect a flash more than a VF. Most P&S users are pretty okay with not having a VF. But no flash, or having to pay an additional $149 to have a flash? Hmmm, I don't think that's going to be so attrractive for most consumers.
The VF-3 is a lower res budget alternative to the VF-2 if I am not mistaken. It is pretty bulky and adds to the size. The EVF of the V1 looked good when I peaked through it at the press event - (for being an EVF). A viewfinder is a must for full usability in view (I have tried to get along with LCD-only cameras, - but no) and the lack of a bult in one is the weak spot of the Olympus m43 line IMO, but I dont like the "fake DSLR” form factor of the Panasonic G-series either.

So I think the built in viewfinder is a very strong point of the V1. The AF, being in DSLR-class (if Nikons claims holds) is of course the other - a breakthrough.

As for the flash, I think the optional is very cool - a mini version of a serious unit with full bounce and swivel that will be attractive for the more advanced user looking for a second system.





I am all for DOF control, but the m43 systems are not hottest cameras either in that regard. Its about choosing the best compromise.
--
http://dslr-video.com/blogmag/
 
The ergonomics of the size and shape, the dials and the big longer zoom are maybe just a matter of taste.

The image shown is fine and apart from "how far away were you ?" with the telefoto at at least a 135 eq of 90mm, hence slow exposures for those f stops, I smell something PR ish:

1) No EXIF suggesting Nikon's PR agency have had to go straight for RAW which the targe market have never heard of. Is it even a V1 shot?
At the press event I saw many 30x40 cm prints and Nikon distributed a large sized book with lots of photos. To me they looked just as images shot with m43 or APS-C with kit lenses. There were several with short DOF, shot with the longer lenses. The tele zoom included in the kit is very small and capable of decent subject isolation.

But if I bought into the system myself I would buy the planned portrait prime as soon as it came out for better DOF control.
2) A little soft, but really nice colours. DR is better than maybe to be expected

3) Not expanding far enough for the pixel peepers, or in fact to really get an idea of sharpness for an 8x10 print.

When Ashton Kutcher has a purple polkadot one, it will sell a shed to a whole new group of Hagendaas upgraders who never knew they needed to blow a grand on a two lens system.

iPhone 5 anyone?

--
================================
Enjoying Photography like never before with the E-450!
Images, photo and gimp tips:
http://olympe450rants.blogspot.com/

NORWEGIAN WOOD GALLERY
http://fourthirds-user.com/galleries/showgallery.php/cat/888

Olympus' Own E450 Gallery http://asia.olympus-imaging.com/products/dslr/e450/sample/

"to be is to do" Descartes;
"to do is to be" Satre ;

............................"DoBeDoBeDo" Sinatra.
=============================
--
http://dslr-video.com/blogmag/
 
LOL. No, it's not "all in the head." Walk into some market, or store, or public location with a big DSLR and lens slung over your shoulder, versus a very compact mirrorless camera, and you'll get a very different response from people, either overtly or non-overtly.
I've never noticed any response from anyone.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
Look at the size of a NX200+16mmf2.4+20mmf2.8+30mmf2. It's a very small, fast collection to which you can add bulkier special purpose lenses on occasion.
Every one of those is a special purpose lens. I'd never, ever carry three primes that closely spaced. My three primes the 15mm fisheye, the 35/1.4L and the 85/1.8.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
Which still does not mean that the f stop magically adjusts when you put an F lens on a CX mount with the adapter.

F mount lenses will produce a larger focal circle which is then cropped in, making the actual f stop smaller than quoted on the lens. If the camera software accounts for this and tells you the relative f stop I will gladly eat my breakfast tomorrow. ;-)
No, the actual f stop will remain the same.
Besides, what would that matter?
The Relative Aperture system is to get consistent exposures.

Exposure will be the same using that lens on a CX, APS or FF Nikon provided you move the camera back or forth to match the field of view.

Also the relative f stop remains the same, because it is dependent of the lens only.
 
Because of the crop factor Gato, the effective f-stop becomes darker and therefore slower.
The whole concept of Relative Aperture was conceived to maintain similar exposure using same ASA/ISO film across any format size or camera device.
...and focal length.
No, that makes no sense.

It is a relative system conceived to obtain consistent exposures across many camera formats.

It is composed by just 3 Variables.
1. Relative Aperture.
2. Exposure time measured in seconds.
3. Film Sensitivity expressed in ISO numbers.
And what meaning does the ISO number have for sensors with different sizes?
Equivalent sensitivity/exposure demands, regardless of noise.
Even with film ISO 400 on MF was a whole different kettle than on Super 8.
Because resolution/grain was less noticeable in MF, but it was the same film formula used for the same ASA/ISO.
 
Can anybody give me a good reason why they would choose the Nikon 1?
Sure. On paper, I like:

Sophisticated AF that works with video and stills. This is a big deal. Many compacts hunt for AF. m4/3s is good, but only the GH2 is really good. 1 System should be far better than the GH2. This is a big deal for people who shoot snapshots and fun/family pics.

Can snap a full-rez still right in the middle of shooting a video.

Shoots 1080i or 1080p video. But a bummer that it doesn't do 720p at 60fps. That is a big goof IMO.

60fps full-rez burst mode - just no AF tracking during.

10fps full-rez burst mode with AF tracking.

It may not be the most compact, but it is compact enough and does things those other camera can't do.

Nice high resolution EVF on the V1.

10Mp 1" modern sensor should be really good for the vast majority of picture taking situation. Won't win prizes for low light, but then only a few m4/3s camera are good there - notably the GH2.

It's a lot like the camera system I suggested about six years ago.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
 

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