The GXR+ m mount will face major competition from Sony NEX7

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http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr5-confirmed-two-nex-cameras-coming-late-august-available-in-october/

Of course, NEX7 is only a rumored product and no one has seen any prototype of the camera, but if rumor is true, It will be release in October, around the same time as GXR M mount. Since both has the same APS-C and I think Sony will keep the latest sensor for their use this time around...... and the NEX7 will have a build in EVF. Hopefully GXR+m mount will be a bit cheaper with better UI than Sony. Also Sony should have a new sensor. More advantages.
 
If I wanted a NEX camera, I'd have bought one already.
I don't like their control ergonomics much.
Exactly. The new NEX 7 will not necessarily be "better" than the GXR, just different. I have a Leica Digilux 2 which is now 8-9 years old--ancient for an electronic device--but I wouldn't trade it for most of the new stuff on the market. Sometimes the overall "experience" of using a particular camera is more important than having a toy with a lot of--often un-needed--bells and whistles...

--
Keith...

Look at the picture, not the pixels...
http://www.lkeithr.zenfolio.com
 
... I have a Leica Digilux 2 which is now 8-9 years old--ancient for an electronic device--but I wouldn't trade it for most of the new stuff on the market. Sometimes the overall "experience" of using a particular camera is more important than having a toy with a lot of--often un-needed--bells and whistles...
The Leica Digilux 2 is a rebranded Panasonic LX1, which was designed and manufactured by Panasonic. It has been replaced successively by the D-Lux3 / LX2 (which was a much better camera all around) and by the D-Lux4 / LX3 (a camera I own and use regularly). The latest LX5 replaced the LX3 but hasn't been rebranded by Leica yet. Admittedly it is a more usable camera than the LX3.

I can't imagine what a PITA it must be to shoot with the D-Lux2 (it has a reputation for very slow operation compared to any modern compact P&S). But whether you are happy with it or not doesn't make it any less obvious that the LX line of cameras has evolved considerably.

The NEX7 will most likely be a less expensive, better camera for manual focusing M-mount lenses than the GXR + M-mount combo, despite Ricoh's very good UI. And as mentioned, it will have a much better, latest generation 24MP sensor vs the old 12MP sensor on the M-mount module.
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Andrew
Panasonic LX3, Ricoh GXR w/ A12 28&50mm user
 
24mp?

I will just have to be happy bumbling along with a few crazy 50 year old lenses on a m Mount module and a stupid grin on my face. Maybe I am old enough now to work what I have to death.

If someone cannot get good enough images from what has been on the market for the last few years I guess they should give up buying cameras and stick to painting (house painting that is).

Frankly it is getting to the point where who cares what the opposition might bring out I am happy in my own little mud puddle.

Anyone make any sense out of Leica's latest announcement? - seems that the "Leica people" can't.

"Mirrorless aps-c" - obviously not re-badging another Panasonic.

The only camera company that Ricoh seems to worry is Leica ...

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Irrelevant and a waste of disk space unless you are intent on making 40x60 inch prints all the time.
Anyone make any sense out of Leica's latest announcement? - seems that the "Leica people" can't.

"Mirrorless aps-c" - obviously not re-badging another Panasonic.

The only camera company that Ricoh seems to worry is Leica ...
I doubt that Ricoh is worrying Leica at all. I'm sure that Leica has been working on their LIVE camera for several years now if they'll be showing it at Photokina next year. They put priority on delivering the M9 and the entirely new S2 product line for the past couple of years, that's all. Now that those are out the door and selling well (and selling well in Leica terms is a wholly different number of units compared to a company like Ricoh's notions of "selling well" ...), they're turning their resources to the LIVE camera again.

I expect it will be a delight. As I commented on the DPR thread:

"Make it APS-C format or similar, give it a line of lenses without a servo motor between my fingers and the focusing helicoid, put a great viewfinder in it, and make it as responsive to the shutter as a Leica M. Don't burden it with idiot modes and unnecessary frippery.

In other words, make it a solid, high performance camera usable in a wide range of circumstances with Leica grade lenses and image quality. I'll buy it without question."/

In the meanwhile, the GXR and M-lens module will make a delightful M-lens body to work with.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
 
The Leica Digilux 2 is a rebranded Panasonic LX1, which was designed and manufactured by Panasonic. It has been replaced successively by the D-Lux3 / LX2 (which was a much better camera all around) and by the D-Lux4 / LX3 (a camera I own and use regularly). The latest LX5 replaced the LX3 but hasn't been rebranded by Leica yet. Admittedly it is a more usable camera than the LX3.

Andrew
Panasonic LX3, Ricoh GXR w/ A12 28&50mm user
Sorry, I must correct you - Leica Digilux 2 was rebranded Panasonic LC1 and very different from the later D-Lux range. The Digilux 2 is still an excellent camera that is highly regarded.
D-Lux 5 is the rebranded LX5, both excellent cameras

K
Ricoh GRD III, GXR A12 28mm, LX3, LX5
 
Whoops sorry chum the Digilux 2 was co-desiigned by Leica and Panasonic. The Panny version was the LC1, of which I might add I am a very proud owner and it's stiil the camera I use most, despite its limitations, because it's funky. The D-Lux 2 was the Leica-badged Panasonic LX1 and sorry but I disagree about the supposed improvements brought along when the LX2 was released, except for the ISO 1600 capability and the more interestingly pushable manual WB. The LC1 and LX1 do not suffer from the somewhat wormily heavy-handed NR employed by Panasonic for some time afterwards, and the BW jpgs from the LX1 are comparable (in my opinion, oh God cats amongst pigeons scenario rears its ugly head) to those from the GRD1. Nice and Panagrainy, lots of contrast. And before anyone asks, yes, I have owned and extensively used all of the aforementioned old-fashioned electronic devices except for the Digilux 2!

That's why I want the GXR wide to portrait zoom module...but I bet the lens won't be up to the LC1's as it'd be a whopper.
 
Irrelevant and a waste of disk space unless you are intent on making 40x60 inch prints all the time.
I was only commenting on what must have been a typo in the previous comment.

Has everything got to be so serious?

I quote:

"The NEX7 will most likely be a less expensive, better camera for manual focusing M-mount lenses than the GXR + M-mount combo, despite Ricoh's very good UI. And as mentioned, it will have a much better, latest generation 24MP sensor vs the old 12MP sensor on the M-mount module."

Is the NEX-7 going to be 24mp and irrelevant?
Anyone make any sense out of Leica's latest announcement? - seems that the "Leica people" can't.

"Mirrorless aps-c" - obviously not re-badging another Panasonic.

The only camera company that Ricoh seems to worry is Leica ...
I doubt that Ricoh is worrying Leica at all. I'm sure that Leica has been working on their LIVE camera for several years now if they'll be showing it at Photokina next year. They put priority on delivering the M9 and the entirely new S2 product line for the past couple of years, that's all. Now that those are out the door and selling well (and selling well in Leica terms is a wholly different number of units compared to a company like Ricoh's notions of "selling well" ...), they're turning their resources to the LIVE camera again.

I expect it will be a delight. As I commented on the DPR thread:

"Make it APS-C format or similar, give it a line of lenses without a servo motor between my fingers and the focusing helicoid, put a great viewfinder in it, and make it as responsive to the shutter as a Leica M. Don't burden it with idiot modes and unnecessary frippery.

In other words, make it a solid, high performance camera usable in a wide range of circumstances with Leica grade lenses and image quality. I'll buy it without question."/

In the meanwhile, the GXR and M-lens module will make a delightful M-lens body to work with.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
--
Tom Caldwell
 
The Leica Digilux 2 is a rebranded Panasonic LX1, which was designed and manufactured by Panasonic. It has been replaced successively by the D-Lux3 / LX2 (which was a much better camera all around) and by the D-Lux4 / LX3 (a camera I own and use regularly). The latest LX5 replaced the LX3 but hasn't been rebranded by Leica yet. Admittedly it is a more usable camera than the LX3.

Andrew
Panasonic LX3, Ricoh GXR w/ A12 28&50mm user
Sorry, I must correct you - Leica Digilux 2 was rebranded Panasonic LC1 and very different from the later D-Lux range. The Digilux 2 is still an excellent camera that is highly regarded.
D-Lux 5 is the rebranded LX5, both excellent cameras

K
Ricoh GRD III, GXR A12 28mm, LX3, LX5
Yep the LC1and DL2 are purty fine cameras. Not so sure that the Leica lens in there is not the real McCoy and not just a made in Japan by Panasonic under licence one. In any case I don't care and the lens is pretty good wherever it was made. Saved me a bundle by buying the Panasonic version and have not missed the red dot one little bit.

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Whoops sorry chum the Digilux 2 was co-desiigned by Leica and Panasonic. The Panny version was the LC1, of which I might add I am a very proud owner and it's stiil the camera I use most, despite its limitations, because it's funky. The D-Lux 2 was the Leica-badged Panasonic LX1 and sorry but I disagree about the supposed improvements brought along when the LX2 was released, except for the ISO 1600 capability and the more interestingly pushable manual WB. The LC1 and LX1 do not suffer from the somewhat wormily heavy-handed NR employed by Panasonic for some time afterwards, and the BW jpgs from the LX1 are comparable (in my opinion, oh God cats amongst pigeons scenario rears its ugly head) to those from the GRD1. Nice and Panagrainy, lots of contrast. And before anyone asks, yes, I have owned and extensively used all of the aforementioned old-fashioned electronic devices except for the Digilux 2!

That's why I want the GXR wide to portrait zoom module...but I bet the lens won't be up to the LC1's as it'd be a whopper.
Mmm so I put my foot in a cowpat? Well I know what a LC1 is as I also have one but I, for the life of me, cannot understand the Leica D-Lux this and D-Lux that - I have just assumed that the poster was right when he called the DL2 the Leica equivalent of the LC1.

Sounds that the crazy D-Lux everydoodle naming sequence is about as understood by the rest of the unwashed camera crowd excepting Will, he is brainy. That is as long as Will hasn't been bamboozled as well.

Sorry Godfrey, but any company that has to preface half it's models with "D-Lux" has to get some better marketing guys. Really. I am sure that you understand one D-Lux from another. Makes my head spin I am afraid.

Great cameras dopey name.

Yes, and I know D-Lux is a take on deluxe, but where is their standard model? You can't have deluxe without a plain jane offering to have a deluxe version, sorry, I guess you can if you are Leica marketing.

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Whoops sorry chum the Digilux 2 was co-desiigned by Leica and Panasonic. The Panny version was the LC1, of which I might add I am a very proud owner and it's stiil the camera I use most, despite its limitations, because it's funky. The D-Lux 2 was the Leica-badged Panasonic LX1 and sorry but I disagree about the supposed improvements brought along when the LX2 was released, except for the ISO 1600 capability and the more interestingly pushable manual WB. The LC1 and LX1 do not suffer from the somewhat wormily heavy-handed NR employed by Panasonic for some time afterwards, and the BW jpgs from the LX1 are comparable (in my opinion, oh God cats amongst pigeons scenario rears its ugly head) to those from the GRD1. Nice and Panagrainy, lots of contrast. And before anyone asks, yes, I have owned and extensively used all of the aforementioned old-fashioned electronic devices except for the Digilux 2!

That's why I want the GXR wide to portrait zoom module...but I bet the lens won't be up to the LC1's as it'd be a whopper.
Mmm so I put my foot in a cowpat? Well I know what a LC1 is as I also have one but I, for the life of me, cannot understand the Leica D-Lux this and D-Lux that - I have just assumed that the poster was right when he called the DL2 the Leica equivalent of the LC1.

Sounds that the crazy D-Lux everydoodle naming sequence is about as understood by the rest of the unwashed camera crowd excepting Will, he is brainy. That is as long as Will hasn't been bamboozled as well.

Sorry Godfrey, but any company that has to preface half it's models with "D-Lux" has to get some better marketing guys. Really. I am sure that you understand one D-Lux from another. Makes my head spin I am afraid.

Great cameras dopey name.

Yes, and I know D-Lux is a take on deluxe, but where is their standard model? You can't have deluxe without a plain jane offering to have a deluxe version, sorry, I guess you can if you are Leica marketing.
Tom,

I don't really follow Leica models and naming very closely other than for the M series. There are pleasantly few enough of those that I can remember them all off the top of my head. M3, M2, M1, M4, M5, CL, M4-2, M4-P, M6, M7, MP, M8, M8u, M8.2, M9, M9-P .. that spans 1953 to the present.

I don't remember, or care to think about very closely, all the nuances of the Leica fixed lens consumer cameras. I think "D-Lux" was some play on words around "Digital Light" or "Deluxe", probably both. But who cares? I'm not all that concerned with a company's marketing or camera naming strategy. If I'm interested in a particular line of cameras, whatever they're called is fine by me.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
 
Irrelevant and a waste of disk space unless you are intent on making 40x60 inch prints all the time.
I was only commenting on what must have been a typo in the previous comment.

Has everything got to be so serious?

I quote:

"The NEX7 will most likely be a less expensive, better camera for manual focusing M-mount lenses than the GXR + M-mount combo, despite Ricoh's very good UI. And as mentioned, it will have a much better, latest generation 24MP sensor vs the old 12MP sensor on the M-mount module."

Is the NEX-7 going to be 24mp and irrelevant?
The NEX 7 is a rumor at present, Sony hasn't made an official announcement. But the current hot rumor is alleging a 24 Mpixel sensor.

I see no reason why a NEX 7 couldn't have a 24 Mpixel sensor, I expect that it indeed might.

My comment was that I wonder why. Why is having 24 Mpixels on an APS-C format sensor desireable? What does it bring to the table other than even bigger files to process, requiring more memory, more disk space, more processing power, etc? Is that huge number of additional pixels really relevant to anything other an typical marketing spin and boosterism?

If the NEX 7 ships with the features suggested by the rumor sites, it will be a fantastic technological achievement and has the potential to be a superb camera. It might have 24 Mpixel resolution. It will not be irrelevant.

But for many people's photography, 24 Mpixel images will remain irrelevant.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
 
Mmm so I put my foot in a cowpat?
I don't really follow Leica models and naming very closely other than for the M series. There are pleasantly few enough of those that I can remember them all off the top of my head. M3, M2, M1, M4, M5, CL, M4-2, M4-P, M6, M7, MP, M8, M8u, M8.2, M9, M9-P .. that spans 1953 to the present.

I don't remember, or care to think about very closely, all the nuances of the Leica fixed lens consumer cameras. I think "D-Lux" was some play on words around "Digital Light" or "Deluxe", probably both. But who cares? I'm not all that concerned with a company's marketing or camera naming strategy. If I'm interested in a particular line of cameras, whatever they're called is fine by me.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
The M series names seems eminently sensible and I have some sort of handle on it even if I have never really aspired to own one. I guess I am into huge amounts of ordinary gear challenges rather than a select few gems. However I suppose my Canon EF lens kit says otherwise, it is just that maybe one day, some day, Canon will jump on the EVIL type bandwaggon. However I am not displeased with the Canon dslr series just yet. I have a 5D a 50D and a 30D and they work well enough for me to be prepared to skip a model or two before I "upgrade". As you and I both agree great lenses always remain great lenses. In another world I might have an M9 and not a few suitable lenses but having made my bed with a cozy Canon blanket I am not about to change at all.

Simply the Canon gear is for real when the camera talks for my skill and much of the rest is for fun, the challenge to get the most from it. There is some personal satisfaction only to get a high ISO grainy candid image without flash from a small camera. Or to get a manual focus lens to focus precisely. To achieve this on a NX10 with a $20 Russian lens is as much fun as to set eyeballs back in their sockets with a $2,000 Leica lens on a genuine Leica body. However I will take your advice on a nice Voigtlander or two once my GXR-M is bedded in - I am not completely stupid (grin). Meanwhile my fun index will be twitched by seeing just how well a good cheap Russian lens might compare, that is my idea of a good time. There are far too many great photographers in the world for me to throw huge money at the craft trying to emulate them. I do get lucky occasionally, we all do. Getting lucky constantly is harder. Getting lucky with a lens litle regarded is quite a surprise. (Smile).

Meanwhile the D-Lux terminology has escaped me as you also seem to agree. Not that I ever had the need as they seem to be principally re-badged Panasonic gear. Perhaps the Panasonic equivalent is the "standard" model and the Leica is the deluxe version in which case I have inevitably opted for the standard version which has always been good enough for my plebian palate. I certainly know my LC1 from my LX-whatever and the naming seems sensible. But D-Lux 1 to whatever? You don't need to own one or even aspire to one to talk about them and I am not alone in being confused - this is very obvious.

Second only to Leica is the arcane naming of Ricoh modules. I must agree that it is hard to suggest anything much better. A limited number of modules and a sole existing camera back keep it all reasonably within bounds. But I can see a time when a GXRII A12 50mm f2.5 macro is going to be compared to a GXR A16 50mm f2.0 - quite possible and one might do the same thing with any system camera and lens but in the GXR case each combination is a "different camera" and not a system body with on-going lens stock. The GXR lends itself to endless combinations and some wierd ones if we take the M mount to it's inevitable variations be they 24mp sensors, rigid manual-only, or to some future inserted electronics in the mount as well.

I air these not as "problems" or even as "fantasy" or "worries". We can live quite well with whatever might happen, I serve up only observations. Connection to any angst, wish list, or advice to Ricoh is an illusion that I would resile from creating. Subject for honourable debate? Well, maybe ...

--
Tom Caldwell
 
There is no question that Sony NEX7 may be a great camera. But there are few areas in which dedicated module could be much better:

1) so far all the lenses that NEX has are poor optical quality, In fact this was the main reason why I stopped using NEX5. Ricoh has couple of great ones.

2) like most digital cameras that are using M mount lenses with an adapter, NEX5 suffered from artifacts related to rear element being too close to the sensor. This makes it impossible to use some lenses - mainly wide angle ones. If Ricoh could solve this issue optically or in processing this would make it a much better platform for M lenses.

3) Ricoh can incorporate ability to read encoded leica lenses. Perhaps this could be used for focusing. I am not sure NEX plans to do that.
--
--
Eugene
http://fratkinphoto.com
 
Tom Caldwell:
...I air these not as "problems" or even as "fantasy" or "worries". We can live quite well with whatever might happen, I serve up only observations. Connection to any angst, wish list, or advice to Ricoh is an illusion that I would resile from creating. Subject for honourable debate? Well, maybe ...
I only responded because you suggested I might be able to name all these cameras or keep track of them. Otherwise, getting concerned enough to bring product names and marketing up so frequently seems a lot of meaningless small talk over inconsequential nothings.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
 
There is no question that Sony NEX7 may be a great camera. But there are few areas in which dedicated module could be much better:

1) so far all the lenses that NEX has are poor optical quality, In fact this was the main reason why I stopped using NEX5. Ricoh has couple of great ones.
Takes quite a few years and a lot of effort to get a range of new lenses for any new mount that is introduced. Obviously the first essential is to produce lenses for the popular market and cheaply as well. Consequently all the new mounts have their consumer level lenses first and gradually work towards the more esoteric end. With accompanying rage that the lens that one might really like is really too expensive.

Sony were smart enough to realise that it made some sense to encourage users to instal a variety of manual lenses via adapters. To a greater or lesser degree users of EVIL type cameras can get their rocks off lens-wise with an older manual lens or two whilst they wait and save for an exotic oem one.

Meanwhile Ricoh said "you have our modular lens packages or nothing". All the while sweating away in the back room trying to keep up a supply of new modules that might supply every taste. Meanwhile when they do make a module they simply go for the traditional best and do it properly as they always seem to do.

Obviously when you adapt any new lens mount to an older mount the essential purpose of the new mount is to fit the oem designed lenses for that mount. Therefore at best the adaption is a kludge and any functionality between lens and camera is more an accident of the lens' mechanical design. If the lens has electronics then function is lost.

Not only this but the internal shape of the mount is dictated by the contraints electronic or otherwise of the new oem lenses with little regard for any non-oem internal protrusion. Unfortunately the very manual wide angle lenses that seem to drive popular demand are the least likely to fit in one of the new mounts.

However Ricoh is joining in the effort to assuage the demand for an almost instant wide range of great modules. As usual they take the novel approach of making a "true" manual camera mount. None of this kludge business and we might expect all M mount lenses to fit on an M mount camera properly designed. We might also presume that the firmware will not bother us over-much with redundant features that simply are of no use in driving a manual lens. Something that has not had any real airplay is the amount of features that a M mount module might not need from the GXR firmware. I have not thought much about it but the exercise might be interesting.

I have previously mentioned my NX10 and manual lenses from the point of view that I feel I can as the camera is so much different in character to the GXR as to be hardly a competitor. The NX10 works well with manual lenses simply because it is simple. With a Samsung oem lens it utilises them as one might expect but the firmware is nowhere as deep and sophisticated as that of the GXR. However this very simplicity is a real asset when you instal a manual lens. Hardly anything changes except you can no longer use "P" & "S" modes, and auto focus of course. The NX10 is in many ways just a tiny legacy slr camera updated to current manufacturing standards in actual use. Just added a lcd screen and ... well not much else, if you discount the march of electronics versus mechanical. Firmware sweet and simple and not much of it.

Therefore I guess the GXR-M might also work and feel like a legacy rangefinder camera with an lcd out back. No bad thing and if the redundant firmware is kept safely out of sight with the M mount module attached then there might be little to distract from the simple enjoyment of the camera.

I think I am going to love it. Back to the future and a smile all over my face.

What a breath of fresh air when point'n'shoots are not complete without GPS, face recognition and a database of friend's faces (including your own dog and cat?), hi-res video, and all so sweetly automatic that you dare not even think lest you overide the auto composition-control and auto-find selection of venue and spoil the image.

However a database of all the points of interest will be sadly lacking and therefore the user will unfortunately be deprived of many duplications of the best loved tourist images. Drat!

Someone has to make serious cameras.
2) like most digital cameras that are using M mount lenses with an adapter, NEX5 suffered from artifacts related to rear element being too close to the sensor. This makes it impossible to use some lenses - mainly wide angle ones. If Ricoh could solve this issue optically or in processing this would make it a much better platform for M lenses.

3) Ricoh can incorporate ability to read encoded leica lenses. Perhaps this could be used for focusing. I am not sure NEX plans to do that.
--
--
Eugene
http://fratkinphoto.com
--
Tom Caldwell
 
...Someone has to make serious cameras.

LOL! You'd love an Olympus E-1, Tom. :-)

It's about as simple and basic as any DSLR to date, has superb ergonomics, and can work with a huge lot of Nikon, Pentax, Contax/Zeiss, Olympus OM, Leica R and, yes, Russian lenses using adapters. When using adapters, it hardly feels like it, it's that good. And the Olympus Zuiko Digital lenses themselves are as good as it gets.

And they're available dirt cheap these days: a pro-quality DSLR for less than $250. Now that's serious.
--
Godfrey
http://godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com
 
Among camera buyers, what would be the ratio between "Photographer" and "Consumer" ? 1 : 10, 1 : 20 or 1 : 100?

Pro models - the Serious Cemeras - are much more expensive partly due to cost but also due to limited sales, fewer units to spread the development expenses. Big campanies like Canon or Nikon can't survive from the profit off these elite models. They have to sell the not-so-serious ones en masse. These are cheaper to make, and with the hugh volume will generate more profit that can be plowed back into R&D, the results of which usually show on Serious models first.

So, the two factions are complementary. Companies that know how to balance there act will be able to serve both markets well.
 
There is no question that Sony NEX7 may be a great camera. But there are few areas in which dedicated module could be much better:

1) so far all the lenses that NEX has are poor optical quality, In fact this was the main reason why I stopped using NEX5. Ricoh has couple of great ones.
I don't see that being an issue in case one uses lenses from other makes, which for me would be the sole reason to get a NEX in the first place, and just as one would to with the M module.

btw. from reports of friends using the NEX with a host of old manual lenses from various brands it meters them very well, no need for electronic contacts.
I have previously mentioned my NX10 and manual lenses from the point of view that I feel I can as the camera is so much different in character to the GXR as to be hardly a competitor. The NX10 works well with manual lenses simply because it is simple. With a Samsung oem lens it utilises them as one might expect but the firmware is nowhere as deep and sophisticated as that of the GXR. However this very simplicity is a real asset when you instal a manual lens. Hardly anything changes except you can no longer use "P" & "S" modes, and auto focus of course. The NX10 is in many ways just a tiny legacy slr camera updated to current manufacturing standards in actual use. Just added a lcd screen and ... well not much else, if you discount the march of electronics versus mechanical. Firmware sweet and simple and not much of it.
Therefore I guess the GXR-M might also work and feel like a legacy rangefinder camera with an lcd out back. No bad thing and if the redundant firmware is kept safely out of sight with the M mount module attached then there might be little to distract from the simple enjoyment of the camera.
Tom you say that the NX10 sure is not even close to a match to the GXR for being less sophisticated. I wonder, when using legacy glass, is that sophistication needed? Saying that the GXR-M might feel like a legacy rangefinder seems to suggest that it isn't.

When using my manual lenses on my Pentax dSLR all I need is fast and easy access to setting the ISO, sometimes but rarely shooting mode. I don't need more than that really.

On the NEX, I hear, at least after a firmware upgrade, this also is provided and one does not need to touch that touch screen. I would miss a viewfinder, and I have the feeling that I prefer the output of the NX10. The high ISO of the Samsung lags behind though.
Maybe the Ricoh will combine that, but so will other, new cameras.

When using legacy glass IMO most important are a viewfinder resp. aids for manual focusing, easy access to ISO setting, that the camera meters them well and of course IQ should be good. No need for much more. The feel, quality, craftsmanship, superior UI and 'sophistication' of the Ricoh certainly makes it most attractive. However if the mentioned above is offered by any other camera for a considerably lower price than it certainly should be steep competition, most likely preferred for anyone who wants to keep costs low, and that includes me
--
http://flickr.com/photos/kuuan/
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/andreasgriesmayr
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=kuuan
 

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