Canon 70-200 2.8 IS II vs. Sigma 50-500 OS

sundayman99 · May 27, 2011

Funny you should mention lens speed, as that's one of the things I noticed in my field test of the Sigma yesterday: It is not a fast lens (relatively speaking). I read some reviews stating you need to stop down to f/8 for maximum sharpness on this lens. I knew this going in, so no surprise there. But as you noted, that means higher ISO's in general.

UrbanStudios · May 27, 2011

I own the 70-200 2.8L, 70-200 2.8L IS, 70-200 4L IS, 70-200 2.8L IS II
Yes im sure lol
focusing manual...what r u talking about lol

it will not work on the old 80-200 2.8L

ISRlee said:
UrbanStudios said:

buy the new 2.0x III its a killer with 5d2.u get an incredible good 140-400...of course u have auto focus on it

Click to expand...

Ah, you sure about that AF with the 2.0 T.C. ?

I also owned the 5D2 for a time. My 5D2 + 1.4 T.C. + 70-200 IS f/2.8 worked nicely...focusing manually.

By the way, a noob...

Is that someone who is speaking from experience with these cameras and lenses...or someone who is speculating and doesn't have the experience?

Eugene Powers · May 27, 2011

And this one is a small crop from 18mp to 4 mp. The only time I stop down is to gain DOF.

--
Eugene

The only time a smaller sensor with the same pixel count is superior to a larger sensor (aka higher pixel density) is when you are focal-length limited.

Quote by Lee Jay

sundayman99 · May 27, 2011

Thanks for your insight! What drew me to this lens in the first place was its unmatched zoom range! And in my first tests with it yesterday, that paid off, as I was able to shoot my friends up close on the trail at 50mm, and the city below at 500. Very versatile.

UrbanStudios · May 27, 2011

thank you for telling everyone

and the f4 will focus on 1d

with 2x

Daniel Clune said:
Ok a 7D can focus at f5.6 or wider aperture. Take a 70-200 2.8 ad a 1.4 tele it reduces light by one stop so its now a F4 lens. Take a 2X tele on same lens, it reduces light by 2 stops so its now a F5.6 lens. So it will focus BUT it will focus slower because the tele has circuits in it telling camera to slow focus speed to get it correct. So a 70-200 F4 will focus with a 1.4 but not a 2.0 converter.

Now using tele converters is a pain. Now can a sigma 50-500 be used wide open at 500mm. Mine can pretty well. Pic below. The 50-500 wont match sharpness of a 70-200 2.8 mk2 but it is very versatile. Best airshow lens i can think of.

--
http://www.pbase.com/dc9mm

UrbanStudios · May 27, 2011

hard to belive...but the new II with 2x III im sure it will

Eugene Powers said:
Are you saying that if you take a picture with Sigma at 500mm and Canon at 200mm from the same distance Canon is equal or better even though it is magnified?
Can you post samples?
--
Eugene

The only time a smaller sensor with the same pixel count is superior to a larger sensor (aka higher pixel density) is when you are focal-length limited.

Quote by Lee Jay

UrbanStudios · May 27, 2011

i never do birds...but if...i use my 400 2.8 with 2x

Rlee said:
SpartanWarrior said:

I have the Kenko 2x 300 Pro converter and my 70-200 2.8 II does AF no problem

Click to expand...

Interesting. I haven't tried to see if I can get AF on my 70-200 f/4.0 with a 1.4 T.C...thanks for the clarification.

Still the reach is only 400mm, even with a 2X T.C. on a 70-200.

Again, I suppose it's what the primary use of the lens is. My understanding is that the 70-200 was designed as a sports/portrait lens. My thing is wildlife and birding and few, that I know, would reach for anything short of a lens that goes to 400mm and preferably beyond for birding.

Good info though.

sundayman99 · May 27, 2011

Yes, although that was a very quick and informal test out my window. I did use a tripod + cable release and live view MF, but I would not consider that "real world" however, so I want to do more proper testing with both lenses in a better setup. Those were just my initial observations (so I reserve the right to change my opinion).

UrbanStudios · May 27, 2011

let us see haha
but really if u interpolate a 5dm2 really good image...it still very good

sundayman99 said:
Yes, although that was a very quick and informal test out my window. I did use a tripod + cable release and live view MF, but I would not consider that "real world" however, so I want to do more proper testing with both lenses in a better setup. Those were just my initial observations (so I reserve the right to change my opinion).

sundayman99 · May 27, 2011

Thanks all for your valuable opinions, pro or con the Sigma or the 70-200 w/ TC. A lot to digest here. Please keep them coming, if you've got something to add.

Like everything else, I figured there would be differing points of view, but that's a good thing; I want to hear all sides. There is rarely one single solution that works universally when it comes to photography and lenses (as I'm sure we all know!) so that's why I appreciate hearing differing experiences with one or the other (or both). Ultimately, I will have to figure out what works best for my circumstances (which doesn't mean the other way is 'wrong' or not as valid).

Again, I just got the Sigma 50-500 OS in my hands about 24 hours ago, so I really need to spend more time with it. I got the Canon 70-200 2.8 II when it first came out (about 15 months ago?), but have never used TC's. So all the advice on that is appreciated (although there seems to be some dispute as to what works with what lenses in terms of AF). Maybe I need to get the 2.0X TC and see for myself.

Anyway, thanks again for sharing your experiences and advice.

Eugene Powers · May 27, 2011

Please do because I have very hard time believing it. Did you MFA both lenses?

I don't shoot to many at 200mm but here is one I could find on the short notice at 244mm and 167mm. At 244mm is wide open.

--
Eugene

The only time a smaller sensor with the same pixel count is superior to a larger sensor (aka higher pixel density) is when you are focal-length limited.

Quote by Lee Jay

Rlee · May 27, 2011

Sundaymann,

Since you have the lenses mentioned, seems all you have to do is spend some time with both to see what you think.

With wildlife/birds it's all about reach. That's why I bought the 50-500 OS and I haven't been disappointed.

T.C's are fine but they always seem a bit of a hassle to me....AF or no. I use my 1.4 T.C. with my 400 f/5.6 once in a while to get that 500mm reach but I still would rather use the Sigma.

If you are after sports/action/photojournalism, then I would go 70-200, that's why I got that lens.

For birding, minimum 400mm and 500mm is better.

There aren't many folks I know that buy a 70-200 for wildlife/birding. However, the new 70-200 f/2.8 with a 2X T.C. may work fine to get you to 400mm but I just don't see why you would go that route if you can buy a lens that will get you to 400mm or, preferably 500mm, without a T.C. ?

Rlee · May 27, 2011

One other thing about the Sigma. Again if it's reach you want, and you seem to indicate that in your first post, you can add a 1.4 T.C. to the Sigma to get 700mm.

Here's a shot I took when I was messing around with the Sigma and a 1.4 T.C...manual focus...long shot at 700mm...no cropping

I didn't keep the Sigma 1.4 T.C. because I'm just not a fan of them....but to each his/her own.

AlYousuf · May 27, 2011

was this shot cropped?

If not I can tell why you got good detail, also what kind of post processing? It can be used wide open, however try stopping down to f/9 and see how sharpness increases alot.

On the $10K Canon super telephotos, you do NOT stop down unless u want to change the DOF, there is no sharpness to be had at F/9 vs wide open at f/2.8 in this case referring to the 400 II.

Daniel Clune said:
Ok a 7D can focus at f5.6 or wider aperture. Take a 70-200 2.8 ad a 1.4 tele it reduces light by one stop so its now a F4 lens. Take a 2X tele on same lens, it reduces light by 2 stops so its now a F5.6 lens. So it will focus BUT it will focus slower because the tele has circuits in it telling camera to slow focus speed to get it correct. So a 70-200 F4 will focus with a 1.4 but not a 2.0 converter.

Now using tele converters is a pain. Now can a sigma 50-500 be used wide open at 500mm. Mine can pretty well. Pic below. The 50-500 wont match sharpness of a 70-200 2.8 mk2 but it is very versatile. Best airshow lens i can think of.

--
http://www.pbase.com/dc9mm

sundayman99 · May 27, 2011

Rlee - I appreciate your opinions; you make some very good points. I guess the one place where the 70-200+TC combo will never be able to touch the Sigma is at 50mm!

That versatility is what led me to purchase this lens in the first place, and based on some of the other comments, that seems to be a popular sentiment.

AlYousuf · May 27, 2011

Eugene,

This isnt soft at all, but do some controlled tests, focus on a sharp object, wide open and stop down and you will see the increased sharpness, I mean your lens cant be any different than mine If you want, Ill start a thread and post results of this and you can post your results as well

Eugene Powers said:
And this one is a small crop from 18mp to 4 mp. The only time I stop down is to gain DOF.

--
Eugene

The only time a smaller sensor with the same pixel count is superior to a larger sensor (aka higher pixel density) is when you are focal-length limited.

Quote by Lee Jay

sundayman99 · May 27, 2011

Eugene - I HOPE you are right! As I said, my initial test was very quick and informal, so I don't have a problem admitting if I was wrong (and I hope I am). As mentioned previously, I'm new to the tele end of things, so I bought the Sigma with the hope of capturing images that I simply could not with my 70-200, and I certainly hope that turns out to be the case.

My initial observations of the 50-500 OS:

Pros

10X zoom range
50mm capability
Close MFD
Very nice build to the lens (better than expected, to be honest)
VERY reasonably priced for a lens of this caliber

Cons

On the slower side (need f/8 for sweet spot? This is only from what I've read; I will have to see for myself. Your samples seem to refute that)
Heavy! With this zoom range, I wish it was more walkaround weight... but I guess you can't have everything!

Apewithacamera · May 27, 2011

Looks good to me.

Daniel Clune · May 27, 2011

This lens is sharpest at F8 which is were i usually shoot it at. But it can do wide open fairly well. I have this printed at 8.5 by 11 inch and its very sharp at that size. After cropping it was about 3300 pixels wide. Everything i post online is big enough for printing at least 8 by 11 in size. I like to have at least 190 ppi for the print size iam printing at without any upsizing. All images online have been reduced in size for web veiwing.
Here is one at 500mm at f7.1

and 500mm at F8

I AlYousuf said:
If not I can tell why you got good detail, also what kind of post processing? It can be used wide open, however try stopping down to f/9 and see how sharpness increases alot.

On the $10K Canon super telephotos, you do NOT stop down unless u want to change the DOF, there is no sharpness to be had at F/9 vs wide open at f/2.8 in this case referring to the 400 II.

Daniel Clune said:

Ok a 7D can focus at f5.6 or wider aperture. Take a 70-200 2.8 ad a 1.4 tele it reduces light by one stop so its now a F4 lens. Take a 2X tele on same lens, it reduces light by 2 stops so its now a F5.6 lens. So it will focus BUT it will focus slower because the tele has circuits in it telling camera to slow focus speed to get it correct. So a 70-200 F4 will focus with a 1.4 but not a 2.0 converter.

Now using tele converters is a pain. Now can a sigma 50-500 be used wide open at 500mm. Mine can pretty well. Pic below. The 50-500 wont match sharpness of a 70-200 2.8 mk2 but it is very versatile. Best airshow lens i can think of.

--
http://www.pbase.com/dc9mm

Click to expand...

--
http://www.pbase.com/dc9mm

Daniel Clune · May 27, 2011

But if you can show me then ok. Here is a link to a shot with a 50-500 at 226mm at f5.6 with a 1dmk2 , warning full size image
http://www.pbase.com/dc9mm/sigma_50-500ex
--
http://www.pbase.com/dc9mm

Canon 70-200 2.8 IS II vs. Sigma 50-500 OS

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