Why is the Sony SLR Talk forum so different?

I usually don't wander far from this forum, and look at the other forums on Dpreview. But, when I do, I can't help but notice how the threads on this forum are so different from the other camera forums.

I don't want to make assumptions, but the difference in the types of threads is very noticeable. Even the Sony NEX forum doesn't have the type of threads seen on this one.

Are Sony SLR users that different from people who use other cameras, even those from Sony?

How different, I frequient the Sony and Minolta forums and I see differences with the Minolta but the Sony....

--
Sarge
Five Sony P&S + KM 7D & Alpha 700
Albums at http://www.sony-snapper.com

Edward Sargent said:

How different, I frequient the Sony and Minolta forums and I see differences with the Minolta but the Sony....

--
Sarge
Five Sony P&S + KM 7D & Alpha 700
Albums at http://www.sony-snapper.com

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If you check out the Canon, Nikon or other camera forums, you don't see threads about rumored cameras, like the A77, or at least not as many. And, on this forum, there are numerous post about people wishing that Sony would do this, or come out with that.

The Nex forum, even with the fact that Sony only has three E-mount lenses for the two bodies, doesn't have that type of questions. They seem to be happy adapting other brand of lenses to their bodies. They're not obsessed with rumors of an NEX-7, unlike this forums numerous threads about the A77.

I know that back when Minolta was around, and Sony wasn't, the Minolta users had a bit of an inferiority complex, always looking for anything that would validate their choice in cameras. I know I used to be like that.

The other forums' posters seem a lot happier than the posters on this forum.

I know other posters have made comments about the 'strangeness' about this forum, but I shrugeed them off, until I looked at the other forums, and saw it for myself. You can check out the other forums and see what type of things they post about. You'll see what I'm talking about.

Maybe it is that we, Sony Dslr users, always want Sony to be more "solid" . Sony users are always looked upon by users of the other brands as strange. We all want a killer dslr/slt so that we can brag about it.

But.....i dont feel strange i have the love of my live an A55....

Edwin

Maybe it's because Canikon forum members don't have anything exciting to hold their collective breaths for.

cyainparadise said:

Edward Sargent said:

How different, I frequient the Sony and Minolta forums and I see differences with the Minolta but the Sony....

--
Sarge
Five Sony P&S + KM 7D & Alpha 700
Albums at http://www.sony-snapper.com

Click to expand...

If you check out the Canon, Nikon or other camera forums, you don't see threads about rumored cameras, like the A77, or at least not as many. And, on this forum, there are numerous post about people wishing that Sony would do this, or come out with that.

The Nex forum, even with the fact that Sony only has three E-mount lenses for the two bodies, doesn't have that type of questions. They seem to be happy adapting other brand of lenses to their bodies. They're not obsessed with rumors of an NEX-7, unlike this forums numerous threads about the A77.

I know that back when Minolta was around, and Sony wasn't, the Minolta users had a bit of an inferiority complex, always looking for anything that would validate their choice in cameras. I know I used to be like that.

The other forums' posters seem a lot happier than the posters on this forum.

I know other posters have made comments about the 'strangeness' about this forum, but I shrugeed them off, until I looked at the other forums, and saw it for myself. You can check out the other forums and see what type of things they post about. You'll see what I'm talking about.

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well..my observation is somewhat different but i see where u came to think like that..

1.canon and nikon's forums contain a lot of brand fanboys..just try doubting a camera over there and see how little of a time it takes for you to get hammered in every way possible that contains the same theme "human error - u suck at photography "

infact there are numerous threads about the d7000 glitches and yet every one of them contains a lot of very negative people .

2.Sony is making an effort to seize more market share thus producing a lot more new exciting technology ...while if you look at the canon section you see

that 550d and 600d and 60d and 7d are not that different all containing the same sensor .

the D5100 is a new sensor but with the same older AF ..and D7000 has sony sensor in it...

so this is a reason ..while sony made mirrorless and slt cameras and EVF etc....they have done nothing.

3.is seems sonyalpharumors has a lot more backup sources compare to canon and nikon rumors...i have barely seen new posts on them .
4.most negative users you can see in here are basically the same people...

i will not start a name calling but there are 3 or 4 "happy souls" around here who find nothing happier than just bash anybody that does not think like them ..while most here are very nice...

i myself when first joining had lots of question and i never once got negative response and i try not to do so accordingly .

In a sense the OP is correct - Sony DSLR owners are a slightly different breed. Since Sony took over from Minolta each step that Sony has taken has been an experiment in design & marketing with unexpected changes & no proper sense of continuity.

I don't think it likely that the likes of Canon or Nikon would have abandoned a camera like the A700 without any explanation or indication of future moves. Again they would not have 'developed' their range by removing long established features from cameras, again without apology or explanations. This episode of Sony cameras has been very unsettling especially to those who already had a significant 'investment' in lenses & accessories.

There is still some uncertainty around despite the fact that the SLTs appear to have found favour with a lot of people. The OVF appears to have been abandoned but fixed mirrors ,which are difficult to clean & which allow Ghosting , still remain.

If Sony could produce a fast focusing Mirrorless camera with a very high grade EVF & quiet shutter then perhaps I might be more reassured.
--
Keith-C

It's different because many of the ex-minolta users are highly agressive and opinionated posters who criticise everything that sony does, good or bad. Too many bitter, grumpy old men, in other words.

Well I'm a lot of time on the Nex forum and there are may post about rumors, The Nex7, The new lenses, the Nex c3 etc.

Then there is a lot of bashing, mostly from people with m43 cameras. Then there are Nex users who complains about rumored lenses etc. So Nex is not that different from the Sony DSLR forum.

Now why is it? I think it is easy. Canon and Nikon users feel that Sony is attacking them (OK not them, but their cameras) by bringing out new and more exciting cameras. So do feel the m43 guys. (I know there are just a few in those camps who do, the others are out using their cameras )

And there is an other thing: In some way people expected more from Sony, the big comany had to come out with a new A7xx camera every two years or so, but they didn't. They expected new and exciting features, but those features came with the A5xx/Axx cameras and the Nex not in the A7xx.

And Sony went a different route then Canon and Nikon did, They came with the SLT cameras, and they came with the mirrorless. New and nice cameras, but not exactly what some Sony users want.

And then there is the fact that Sony is doing better then other brands (like Pentax and Olympus) and they are not realy a cmera brand, but an electronics firm. Everybody expected Sony should do as bad as Samsung did. But they didn't.

So conclusion is: there is a lot of envy from other brands and there is a lot of expectation from Sony that didn't come out the way people expected.

Thinking back to my Minolta days, it was the same then.

The easy option (and thus the default) is Canon, Nikon etc and I don't think that will ever change.

But I always saw the Minolta (and now Sony) as almost the thinking persons camera. For people who don't want to follow the heard and just want to be different. For those users, Sony today fills that niche. Perhaps people who are a little bit more technical.

But because we are talking about a different demographic here, you get the threads you are talking about. Many users on this forum are just as interested in the technicalities and technology as they are in actually taking pictures.

I am not saying Sony is better than Nikon or Canon. Nor am I saying that Sony owners are better or worse photographers.

Just that they are (and have been right back from the Minolta days) a different type of user. Possibly the same type that would by an Android rather than an iPhone or would rather build their own PC that buy an over priced Mac (their words not mine) because that is the non conformist thing to do.

Clearly this does not apply to ALL Sony users. I would not be so bold as to make such a sweeping generalisation but I do believe that a lot of users (especially on this forum) so fall under that category which in itself is not a bad thing.

Hey.

If we were not all different, the world would be a very dull place.

As a long term lurker I can say there is one thing here one quickly understands: Knowledgeable photographers move in - and often very quickly out again. It's not too difficult to figure out why.

--
http://www.pbase.com/maurus_e/

cyainparadise said:

If you check out the Canon, Nikon or other camera forums, you don't see threads about rumored cameras, like the A77, or at least not as many. And, on this forum, there are numerous post about people wishing that Sony would do this, or come out with that.

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You are right about Canon and Nikon and this is not only on dpreview, but in all the other places I checked as well.

I think that the explanation is that camera brand forums attract many people who define themselves by brand loyalty. So they feel that they have to defend their chosen brand against the rest of the world. Canon and Nikon fanboys, being secure that their chosen brand is in the top 2, don't feel threatened by "lesser" brands, so they will only be really aggressive against the other brand, and feel that the rest of the market only deserves contempt ("not a real camera").

Conversely, other brands fanboys define themselves by the following strategies:

-snobs (that would be medium format or Leica camera, simply because it is part of the marketing communication of these brands)
-feeling threatened (and that would be Sony and some others).

Now, there is an additional element with Sony: the fans were abandoned by their masters. That is obviously something hard to swallow for a fanboy and the consequences are lasting. I think this is the main explanation behind the "Sony has abandoned the A700" psychosis. Would it still be Minolta, I think that the fanboys would rather defend that the A5x or A850 are better cameras (whether they are or not, I am not discussing that). The trauma of "feeling abandoned" is still lasting. We see the same effect behind the "Sony will abandon the FF" or "Sony will abandon the optical viewfinder" nonsense.

There is another brand with the same trauma: Olympus. The old brand still exists, but abandoned their users a number of time: by not managing the transition to AF in the 80s, by associating with an enemy (Panasonic) for digital cameras, by cutting itself from any possibility of compatibility with the old analog 24x36 world and, lately, by effectively abandoning the DSLR market to concentrate on the EVIL micro four thirds system. Now, if you go to various Olympus forums, you will see that the behavior is quite similar to what you see on the Sony forum.

Explained this way, it is a bit of a caricature, but there is some amount of truth to it. It is group dynamic at work that you see in these forums.

An additional aspect is that these group dynamics are, apparently, sometimes used by marketing. They do not do it openly (it would probably be illegal), but some rumors are too damaging to some markets at a too appropriate moment to be simply the product of random luck. Some people on some forums as well are too strange, active and manipulative to be normal users...

maurus_e said:

As a long term lurker I can say there is one thing here one quickly understands: Knowledgeable photographers move in - and often very quickly out again. It's not too difficult to figure out why.

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Yes, but not only on the Sony forum. Actually, I think that knowledgeable photographers move out of most forums, whether they are defined by a camera brand or not.

BTW, and on brand fandom: many answers to your questions will articulate around the following theories:

-"people here are free thinkers, this is why they chose a brand which is a less obvious choice than Canon or Nikon, so they are different"

-"Sony is a great company, capable of semi miracles, and Canon and Nikon users feel threatened, so we have those users coming here to attack us"

-"Sony is a great company, capable of semi miracles, but is not doing enough (why no A700 successor?) and people are discontent and grumpy".

or any combination of the above.

jerome_munich said:

maurus_e said:

As a long term lurker I can say there is one thing here one quickly understands: Knowledgeable photographers move in - and often very quickly out again. It's not too difficult to figure out why.

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I think this is a typical 'snob' comment, implciitly denigrating forum posters as un-knowledgable. Nothing could be further from the truth in my opinion. If you look at the range of samples posted and questions asked and answered here you'll see a vast diversity of talents and applications. Only those with a very deep chip on their shoulder and a distorted sense of reality could state that there are no knowledgable photogs here.

mike_2008 said:

mike_2008 said:

maurus_e said:

As a long term lurker I can say there is one thing here one quickly understands: Knowledgeable photographers move in - and often very quickly out again. It's not too difficult to figure out why.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I think this is a typical 'snob' comment, implicitly denigrating forum posters as un-knowledgeable. Nothing could be further from the truth in my opinion. If you look at the range of samples posted and questions asked and answered here you'll see a vast diversity of talents and applications. Only those with a very deep chip on their shoulder and a distorted sense of reality could state that there are no knowledgeable photogs here.

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Chips aside , that view is only acceptable if you are prepared to deliberately misunderstand what Maurus wrote. He did not say there are no knowledgeable photographers here but that they tended to come & go with some haste & I think that is true.

I have been a user of these forums since they were first created & the current standard of contributions is relatively poor compared to the past but that is not just an observation about the Sony DSLR forum but all forums.

How true this feeling is depends on the individual & I guess it is also a sign that perhaps some of us have been here too long ?
--
Keith-C

KEITH-C said:

I have been a user of these forums since they were first created & the current standard of contributions is relatively poor compared to the past but that is not just an observation about the Sony DSLR forum but all forums.

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I've been here since 2008 and see only an improvement in the quality of images and a vast improvement in understanding of the physical principles of digital photography. Finally now people understand the difference between pixel level noise and image level noise, for example, and that increasing sensor resolution can be good for noise control. In 2008 this was absolutely not the case.

I think there are some here who have a totally exaggerated sentimental nostalgia for a fictititious past, and that almost of all these people are ex-minoltians. Get over it for crying out loud and instead of incessant whingeing try to contribute positively to this forum instead of denigrating it.

Which sometimes peaks into barking mad threads.
--
Ralf
http://RalfRalph.smugmug.com/

--
Ralf
http://RalfRalph.smugmug.com/

mike_2008 said:

I've been here since 2008 and see only an improvement in the quality of images and a vast improvement in understanding of the physical principles of digital photography.

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Indeed, on forums like this one, you'll find people with some technical knowledge. You'll also see pretty pictures. But technical knowledge and pretty pictures are not enough to make a knowledgeable photographer.

May I suggest that you buy some photography books, not the kind which are written like a course but the kind presenting pictures which you would find in a museum or gallery? I have done just that, and realized how little I knew. Then, of course, I never pretended to be a knowledgeable photographer.