G3 and more CA...sadly

K-motion

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hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more sample images i found online...

unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...

http://www.senners.de/g3.htm

especially this one shows the same halos as the church pic in steves review...(was it steves...i think so)



I really wanted to buy this cam... however now i'm seriously in trouble...no peace of mind anymore ...
 
hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the
site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more
sample images i found online...
unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...
Yep, that's pretty nasty. Looks like blooming to me. Reminds me of
the strong purple fringing on some of the Oly XXXX series cams.

RH
 
Yes, this image you display when shown at full resolution dose display CA and blooming. What you are not doing is judging how bad the problem is. If you look at the photo so that it fits on your screen it looks normal and this is what matters.

Morris
hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the
site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more
sample images i found online...

unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...

http://www.senners.de/g3.htm

especially this one shows the same halos as the church pic in
steves review...(was it steves...i think so)



I really wanted to buy this cam... however now i'm seriously in
trouble...no peace of mind anymore ...
 
C'mon, guys. We keep saying this. :-)

This shot was taken at F2.0. And it was at a shutter of 1/20s. Two things that are bound to bring out the Purple In Your Eyes.

This problem could have been avoided. But I suppose he needed the faster shutter speed. I doubt many cameras at this level would have handled it much differently. At least for Canon cameras.
hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the
site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more
sample images i found online...

unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...

http://www.senners.de/g3.htm

especially this one shows the same halos as the church pic in
steves review...(was it steves...i think so)

http://www.senners.de/gImg_0012.jpg

I really wanted to buy this cam... however now i'm seriously in
trouble...no peace of mind anymore ...
--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

 
this photo was not taken by me...i just found it on the web...

i'm really sorry that i haven't got enough knowledge about Digital Photography... but the Canon was my only choice to dive into this matter... and i was almost thinking of not buying it... but now i read your post and i wonder if this shot would have been possible without the CA...and blooming and stuff... if the photographer would have been better...

i really hope it is a users fault...i could live with months of learning how to operate the camera...but not with a camera that produces this no matter what i do...

so could someone please explain...what one can do, to get the same image without the CA and blooming

i'd be really thankful for that...
 
so could someone please explain...what one can do, to get the same
image without the CA and blooming

i'd be really thankful for that...
you could....

buy a D60 for $2200 (assuming you can find one for that price) and spend another $5000 on some high quality "L" lenses

or...

accept that any sub $1500 camera would have exhibited similar CA in this shot at F2.0.
 
k-motion, I'm sincerely sorry. My post was meant with a bit of laughter, not bitterness at all. Sorry if it sounded harsh. That's not the way it was intended.
this photo was not taken by me...i just found it on the web...
Understood.
read your post and i wonder if this shot would have been possible
without the CA...and blooming and stuff... if the photographer
would have been better...
The problem partly is that a lot of users and a lot of reviews will just put a camera into Auto mode (Program AE), and let the camera decide the settings that it will use. Well, guess what? In a situation like a poorly lit mall, the camera will often choose the widest aperture that it can and then adjust the shutter accordingly and shoot.

But a wide aperture is for CA like feeding fuel to a fire.

If you want to help cut down on the CA, you can minimize it by using a narrower aperture. Set your camera to something like F4.0 or F5.6. Now, the down-side is that you will need a slower shutter speed. If this is the case, then don't let your camera force you to play the choosing game. Take control. Use a flash if need be. Use an external flash if need be. That's what they're there for. Won't work for ALL shots, of course, but it's one idea.

I'm sure others will jump in here and give you more Canon-specific advice. I hope so. I'd like to hear other thoughts myself. :-)

--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

 
I'll even go so far as to say that even some of the "L" lenses are not totally immune to this problem. Although they come about as close as you can get. :-))))

heheheh... acceptance is a mighty big pill, ain't it? :-)
buy a D60 for $2200 (assuming you can find one for that price) and
spend another $5000 on some high quality "L" lenses

or...

accept that any sub $1500 camera would have exhibited similar CA in
this shot at F2.0.
--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

 
hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the
site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more
sample images i found online...

unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...

http://www.senners.de/g3.htm

especially this one shows the same halos as the church pic in
steves review...(was it steves...i think so)



I really wanted to buy this cam... however now i'm seriously in
trouble...no peace of mind anymore ...
FWIW

here is a full 15 second night shot I just took with the G3, being an owner of a D60 as well I can tell you that the G3 hadled it pretty well.

http://www.pbase.com/chrisdallas/canon_g3

Cheers
Chris
 
Chris -

Thank you for this solid sample. Surprisingly sharp for this shutter speed.

Could I impose upon you to do us a favor? I'm unfamiliar with the Canon Aperture priority mode, but my idea is this.

Set your camera to Av mode. Choose F2.0
Shoot a similar parking lot scene with bright lights such as these.
Switch to F4.0 and shoot the same scene.
Switch to F8. and shoot the same scene.

I'm trying to see if we can see evidence of lessening CA in the G3 when changing apertures.

Hopefully the G3 will allow enough range in its shutter speed when working in Aperture priority mode so as to get reasonable exposures.

Is this do-able by you or someone else here with a G3 ?

--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

 
Chris -

Thank you for this solid sample. Surprisingly sharp for this
shutter speed.

Could I impose upon you to do us a favor? I'm unfamiliar with the
Canon Aperture priority mode, but my idea is this.

Set your camera to Av mode. Choose F2.0
Shoot a similar parking lot scene with bright lights such as these.
Switch to F4.0 and shoot the same scene.
Switch to F8. and shoot the same scene.

I'm trying to see if we can see evidence of lessening CA in the G3
when changing apertures.

Hopefully the G3 will allow enough range in its shutter speed when
working in Aperture priority mode so as to get reasonable exposures.

Is this do-able by you or someone else here with a G3 ?

--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

Give me a few min, I'll go back out to my balcony for those shots requested.

BRB, have patience & you will be able to see the results.

Chris
 
Chris -

Thank you for this solid sample. Surprisingly sharp for this
shutter speed.

Could I impose upon you to do us a favor? I'm unfamiliar with the
Canon Aperture priority mode, but my idea is this.

Set your camera to Av mode. Choose F2.0
Shoot a similar parking lot scene with bright lights such as these.
Switch to F4.0 and shoot the same scene.
Switch to F8. and shoot the same scene.

I'm trying to see if we can see evidence of lessening CA in the G3
when changing apertures.

Hopefully the G3 will allow enough range in its shutter speed when
working in Aperture priority mode so as to get reasonable exposures.

Is this do-able by you or someone else here with a G3 ?

--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

Give me a few min, I'll go back out to my balcony for those shots
requested.

BRB, have patience & you will be able to see the results.

Chris
The tests are up but there is really no justice to pictures taken at 15 seconds & an AV mode of 2.0-6.0.

The best results are at AV8.0 or even 6.0 is OK.

Chris
 
There is some CA in this image but compared to the blooming it is not significant.

The blooming on the other hand is totally out of control. Looking at the ceiling lights there is a very large blue ring of bloom. This is NOT a lens problem, but is a sensor problem.

I have just finished looking through about 2000 G2 pic's I have taken and I can not find a single example that is this bad and almost none with blooming at all.

CA can be "fixed" in an editor, there are programs that will adjust for it. The basic way of doing that is to magnify the blue and red channel until they match the green. The cause of CA( simplified version) is the lens having different magnifications for each color. So, if you apply the opposite magnification on each channel in an editor you can correct the aberration and salvage the pic.

The problem with blooming - is the effect is local to the bright light source and so adjustments must be made to each area independently. Thats a bummer to do - especially in a pic like this one with many affected areas.

I have looked at many examples of G3 pics now and often they exhibit blooming, and just as often many people call it CA.

It appears that Canon either:

1. Is using a new sensor with the G3 (not the same one in the G2) and this sensor has a design or manufacturing flaw.

2. Is using the same sensor as the G2, but has a bad batch - if so, we should see some new owners of G2 complaining of the same issue - and so far I have seen none.

3. The circuitry driving the sensor is changed and somehow affects blooming. (I don't know enough about the electronics involved to know if this could be possible.)

In any case, I would NOT buy a camera with this defect. I frequently print pics from my G2 at 8x10 or even 11x17 (and on the rare occasion 13x19) and this blooming would stand out and distroy the image.

I would suggest trying a few G3s at stores and see if you can find one that does not exhibit this. It could be a few bad apples in the startup of the production - or it could be a new sensor design with a serious flaw. We want know for sure until they start shipping in volume.

Frank
hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the
site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more
sample images i found online...

unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...

http://www.senners.de/g3.htm

especially this one shows the same halos as the church pic in
steves review...(was it steves...i think so)



I really wanted to buy this cam... however now i'm seriously in
trouble...no peace of mind anymore ...
--
I plan on living forever - so far so good!
 
Chris -

Thank you for this solid sample. Surprisingly sharp for this
shutter speed.

Could I impose upon you to do us a favor? I'm unfamiliar with the
Canon Aperture priority mode, but my idea is this.

Set your camera to Av mode. Choose F2.0
Shoot a similar parking lot scene with bright lights such as these.
Switch to F4.0 and shoot the same scene.
Switch to F8. and shoot the same scene.

I'm trying to see if we can see evidence of lessening CA in the G3
when changing apertures.

Hopefully the G3 will allow enough range in its shutter speed when
working in Aperture priority mode so as to get reasonable exposures.

Is this do-able by you or someone else here with a G3 ?

--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

Ok, I updated the Gallery to what I believe you needed to see.

Enjoy.

Chris
 
Chris -

Thank you for this solid sample. Surprisingly sharp for this
shutter speed.

Could I impose upon you to do us a favor? I'm unfamiliar with the
Canon Aperture priority mode, but my idea is this.

Set your camera to Av mode. Choose F2.0
Shoot a similar parking lot scene with bright lights such as these.
Switch to F4.0 and shoot the same scene.
Switch to F8. and shoot the same scene.

I'm trying to see if we can see evidence of lessening CA in the G3
when changing apertures.

Hopefully the G3 will allow enough range in its shutter speed when
working in Aperture priority mode so as to get reasonable exposures.

Is this do-able by you or someone else here with a G3 ?

--

Ulysses
Repository of Some of My Stuff
http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=4291269101

I'm an uncle!!!

Ok, I updated the Gallery to what I believe you needed to see.

Enjoy.

Chris
As you can see the blooming in my shots is not preesent as it is in the picture posted by the originator.

Chris
 
there was purple fringe or blooming at f4 250 shutter in daylight.....
The blooming on the other hand is totally out of control. Looking
at the ceiling lights there is a very large blue ring of bloom.
This is NOT a lens problem, but is a sensor problem.

I have just finished looking through about 2000 G2 pic's I have
taken and I can not find a single example that is this bad and
almost none with blooming at all.

CA can be "fixed" in an editor, there are programs that will adjust
for it. The basic way of doing that is to magnify the blue and red
channel until they match the green. The cause of CA( simplified
version) is the lens having different magnifications for each
color. So, if you apply the opposite magnification on each channel
in an editor you can correct the aberration and salvage the pic.

The problem with blooming - is the effect is local to the bright
light source and so adjustments must be made to each area
independently. Thats a bummer to do - especially in a pic like this
one with many affected areas.

I have looked at many examples of G3 pics now and often they
exhibit blooming, and just as often many people call it CA.

It appears that Canon either:

1. Is using a new sensor with the G3 (not the same one in the G2)
and this sensor has a design or manufacturing flaw.
2. Is using the same sensor as the G2, but has a bad batch - if so,
we should see some new owners of G2 complaining of the same issue -
and so far I have seen none.
3. The circuitry driving the sensor is changed and somehow affects
blooming. (I don't know enough about the electronics involved to
know if this could be possible.)

In any case, I would NOT buy a camera with this defect. I
frequently print pics from my G2 at 8x10 or even 11x17 (and on the
rare occasion 13x19) and this blooming would stand out and distroy
the image.

I would suggest trying a few G3s at stores and see if you can find
one that does not exhibit this. It could be a few bad apples in the
startup of the production - or it could be a new sensor design with
a serious flaw. We want know for sure until they start shipping in
volume.

Frank
hi.. i'm newly registered to this forum... However, I visit the
site very often... and I just registered to let you see some more
sample images i found online...

unfortunately many of them show CA or blooming...not sure...

http://www.senners.de/g3.htm

especially this one shows the same halos as the church pic in
steves review...(was it steves...i think so)



I really wanted to buy this cam... however now i'm seriously in
trouble...no peace of mind anymore ...
--
I plan on living forever - so far so good!
 
I have just finished looking through about 2000 G2 pic's I have
taken and I can not find a single example that is this bad and
almost none with blooming at all.
Yeah but in 2000 shots did you just point at a light bulb like this?

I like that the general exposure was not effected by the strong few lights.
--
Memory fades - digital media does not
 
Hi,

As I was hoping to get the G3, this blooming problem is a concern. As I didn't know if it's really that bad in everyday shots I thought I'd try out my A40. It's a pity I can't take direct comparison shots between the A40 and the G3 to see how the G3 handles these shots, but from what I've seen in the other samples, there is cause for concern.

If this level of blooming is "normal" for the G3, then I don't think I'll be getting one.

Have a look at these 2 A40 samples I just took.
(You'll need to add jpg to view them).

http://www.users.bigpond.com/rpant/img_1020 .

http://www.users.bigpond.com/rpant/img_1021 .

I think my A40 handled these quite well. These lights are very bright and glary. There is some evidence of blooming around the downlights, but very little considering I was only about 3m (10ft) away. As these were handheld without flash, please forgive any motion blur.

Do you think the G3 would be any worse?

Rob
 
Tom, no disrespect, but the Powershot S110v (Ixus V2) did not have this problem.
  • Raist
so could someone please explain...what one can do, to get the same
image without the CA and blooming

i'd be really thankful for that...
you could....

buy a D60 for $2200 (assuming you can find one for that price) and
spend another $5000 on some high quality "L" lenses

or...

accept that any sub $1500 camera would have exhibited similar CA in
this shot at F2.0.
 

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