New P&S for video enthusiast

Hi all!

My last camera, a Canon SD780is, had an unfortunate run-in with a dryer the other day. The dryer won.

So now I am looking for a replacement. I do a lot of point-and-shooting (the camera comes out nearly every day), but have managed to stay largely ignorant of varying camera features and their implications on photo quality (I just learned about ISO... I'm working on it, folks). My use of manual settings is usually limited to exposure adjustment, though I plan to improve upon that.

HD Video capability is 100% must-have. I use it all the time. I would really, really like an upgrade in image quality (the noise level, particularly in low light, was a frustration with the SD780). Pocketable/purseable important as well - I've been spoiled with the smooth, tiny body of the SD780, which is about the only reason the SD1400 has become a contender despite its just-okay photos on imaging-resource.com. Would like to keep it under $300.

I was largely happy with the SD780, short of some occasional image quality frustrations.

I'm mostly familiar with Canon, but am absolutely not married to the brand. I've been looking extensively through dpreview.com and imaging-resource.com (as well as customer reviews on various retail sites) and mostly settled on the Canon SX210is (the zoom capability was a perk, not a necessity). Went to Best Buy to test it out and was underwhelmed by the image quality (noise/graininess) BUT I do realize this could be a function of the LCD screen - again, I'm not as knowledgeable as I should be. It's too easy to get confused by spec lists, sample photos and conflicting reviews.

Any guidance would be GREATLY appreciated! The forums here have already been a great resource, but I decided it was time for interactive help. Thank you very much in advance.

Check out Canon SD4000 IS and Canon S95. They both have f/2.0 lenses enabling good low light performance. They both do 720p video. The S95 is a little over your $300 price range but it gets really good reviews.

miss-sprout wrote:
[snip]

miss-sprout said:

I'm mostly familiar with Canon, but am absolutely not married to the brand. I've been looking extensively through dpreview.com and imaging-resource.com (as well as customer reviews on various retail sites) and mostly settled on the Canon SX210is (the zoom capability was a perk, not a necessity). Went to Best Buy to test it out and was underwhelmed by the image quality (noise/graininess) BUT I do realize this could be a function of the LCD screen - again, I'm not as knowledgeable as I should be. It's too easy to get confused by spec lists, sample photos and conflicting reviews.

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The noise/graininess is due to trying to use a P&S camera indoors without flash. It has nothing to do with the LCD and you will get the same results with just about any P&S.

If you want slightly better low light performance will will need to look at something like the Canon S95 or G12.

If you want much better low light performance you will need to look at hybrid cameras like the Olympus Pen series.
--
Chris R

I too had a Canon Powershot (but SD870IS), and decided to upgrade mostly with the complaints you had. I was going to stick with Canon (brand loyalty?), but after much research, I came across Panasonic Lumix LX5. The video capabilities are far superior than Canon G12 with autofocusing, optical zoom, color schemes, etc.

Edit: I forgot to add, it's over your $300 budget. I bought it for $400 on amazon.

the canon s95 will do 720p, but it only records at 24fps, and is reported to be a bit jerky. the lx5 does nice video, and has nice IQ, but has limited zoom range, and is bulky for easy pocketablility and a bit spendy.

i would recommend the lumix ZS7, which ranks at the top of nearly every review i have read. oddly, dpreview rated it middle of the pack, choosing the sony hx5 as a better chocie - in some conflict with the findings of dcresource, imaging resources, steve's digicams, and other reviewers.
--
jnorman
sunridge studios
salem, oregon
D2x, nikon 12-24mm ED-IF AF-S DX, 18-70mm DX
Cambo 45NX, nikkor SW 90/8, 135/5.6, 210/5.6
Graflex Crown Graphic 4x5 (1948 model)

Thanks everyone for the replies so far. I'll check out the suggestions and probably return with questions

I'm back!

Collected some review links for what seem like the top contenders for my needs and budget. Would still love feedback as to whether I'm on the right track in comparing them.

Current front runners:

Canon SD4000is: ~$280
http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/cameraDetail.php?cam=1558 (specs only)

http://www.steves-digicams.com/camera-reviews/canon/powershot-sd4000-is/canon-powershot-sd4000-is-review.html
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canonsd4000is/
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/SD4000IS/SD4000ISA.HTM

Canon SD980is: ~$250
http://www.steves-digicams.com/camera-reviews/canon/powershot-sd980-is/
no dpreview
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/SD980IS/SD980ISA.HTM

Panasonic DMC-ZS7: ~$300
http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/panasonic/dmc_zs7-review
no stevesdigicams review
no dpreview
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/ZS7/ZS7A.HTM

--The SD4000 and SD980 seem like close competitors, with the SD980 having the edge with slightly more zoom and faster max shutter speed... or maybe the SD4000 has the edge with wider aperture (f/2.0 vs. f/2.8)? The price difference is negligible, as is the size difference (SD4000 has a very slight edge).

http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_PowerShot_SD4000_IS-vs-Canon_PowerShot_SD980_IS

--The panasonic has a much higher zoom (not incredibly important) and boost ISO (I'm betting I won't appreciate this given my issue with noise), shoots faster than the SD980 but not the SD4000, and supports longer exposures (60 vs. 15 seconds).

--Something cool about the SD4000 is that it records high-speed movies, "capture events too fast for the naked eye and play them back in super-slow motion." Snapsort says it has better maximum light sensitivity and has a much wider aperture.
http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_PowerShot_SD4000_IS-vs-Panasonic_Lumix_DMC-ZS7

.
.

Also possibilities, but perhaps more camera than I need (or would be able to appreciate):

Canon S95: ~$400
http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/canon/powershot_s95-review
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/q42010highendcompactgroup/ (weird combo review)
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/PS95/PS95A.HTM

Panasonic DMC-LX5: ~$400
http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/panasonic/dmc-lx5-review

http://www.steves-digicams.com/camera-reviews/panasonic/lumix-dmc-lx5/panasonic-lumix-dmc-lx5-review.html
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/q42010highendcompactgroup/
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/LX5/LX5A.HTM

--The Panasonic seems to win out if I'm pitting it against the S95, the reviews seemed to indicate that it's a more full-featured camera but intended for those who will make use of said features. Perhaps would be good motivation for me to educate myself.

Oh whoops, my pricing info is outdated.

Current pricing:

Canon SD4000is: ~$250

Canon SD980is: ~$170 (eBay), ~$200 (Amazon)

Panasonic DMC-ZS7: ~$240

.

Canon S95: ~$360

Panasonic DMC-LX5: ~$400

If video and low light are priorities, maybe you should add the Sony DSC-WX5 to your list (hmm, I think they just listed it's replacement the wx10 on dpreview today, but that means it's cheaper...I'm not sure what the new model really adds).

On paper at least, it's very impressive. 1080i @ 60fps video. f2.4 lens is not quite as good as the s95 and sd4000, but it's only half a stop worse which is not a huge difference. Undoubtedly way better than the sd780.

Thank you for replying, PaulRivers. I'll add it to the research list!!

After reading the reviews over at dcresource, I wonder if I should also be considering Sony Cyber-shot DSC-HX5V and Fuji FinePix F80EXR ?

So this is the list I'm currently working with - cameras are ordered by price, not preference. Is there anything that anyone thinks I can/should eliminate?

Canon SD980is

Fujifilm F80EXR (I read in a couple of reviews that the low-light performance is really solid)

Panasonic DMC-ZS7
Canon SD4000is
Sony DSC-WX5
Sony DSC-HX5V

Budget stretches:
Canon S95
Panasonic DMC-LX5

There's 2 factors in low light performance -
1. Sensor performance at high iso's
2. The aperture the lens can do - the lower the f-stop number, the better.

f1.8 is the best aperture you can find on a semi-compact camera, f2.0 (not a big difference between that and f1.8) is the best you can currently find on a compact.

miss-sprout said:

So this is the list I'm currently working with - cameras are ordered by price, not preference. Is there anything that anyone thinks I can/should eliminate?

Canon SD980is

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I don't see anything very interesting about this camera in either category.

miss-sprout said:

Fujifilm F80EXR (I read in a couple of reviews that the low-light performance is really solid)

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If your priority is zoom it's probably good, but it's f3.3 lens is not a good choice for low light.

miss-sprout said:

Panasonic DMC-ZS7

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I think this camera has a pretty good reputation for video, though again it's f3.3 lens has zoom but not great for low light.

miss-sprout said:

Canon SD4000is

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f2.0 lens - about the best lens you can find. 720p video @ 30fps is decent. It has autofocus during video but it's...interesting. Some people complain that the autofocus can constantly do it's thing during the video destroying the video. On the other hand, a whole bunch of other people complain when a camera doesn't have autofocus, and this one does.

miss-sprout said:

Sony DSC-WX5

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It's f2.4 lens is very respectable for low light. It's video specs (1080i @ 60fps) are very good. Though I don't know what kind of reputation it really has for video though.

miss-sprout said:

Sony DSC-HX5V

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Another "lots of zoom, not as good in low light" choice because of it's f3.5 lens. It's 10fps full resolution shooting burst sound pretty cool.

miss-sprout said:

Budget stretches:
Canon S95

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The best compact camera you can currently buy for low light (well, it ties with the lx5). Still not as good for low light as a dslr, though. f2.0 lens. It's video specs are the absolute minimum for hd video though - 720p @ 24fps.

miss-sprout said:

Panasonic DMC-LX5

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Larger and more expensive than the s95. Here's a pic -





Whether it matters or not depends on how you carry the camera (in a purse it's not as important, in a jeans pocket it's a huge difference). Has a physical lens cap you have to take on and off when you use the camera.

Video is 720p @ 30fps, and lets you have more manual control over the video than the s95. I think it lets you zoom and autofocus during video as well (which the s95 does not).

I guess the bottom line is that unfortunately there's no perfect camera for me to recommend. I would take the SD980is off the list. If low light performance is important to you, I would take the f80exr and hx5v off the list to, and probably the zs7.

In my opinion, it would come down to the Canon SD4000is, Sony DSC-WX5, s95 or lx5.

I know living in Minnesota we have a local camera store called National Camera Exchange that lets you bring your memory card in and shoot pictures and video with your camera and take it home and view them. Maybe you should try that and see if all the cameras produce acceptable results.

Paul, thank you SO much for the incredibly thorough, helpful post! You've really helped me put the list in perspective.

I feel good about those as the final three options, and will do some more image and video comparing.

Lots of reading and comparing later, I settled on the S95.

Thank you all for contributing to my search! I really appreciate the help. Now to make sure I educate myself in order to take advantage of my new cam