Upgrade fr Sony H5 to HX1 - question

I am considering upgrading my DSC- H5 to the more recent DSC- HX1. Reason is a bit longer reach, faster focusing and better video mode. My concern is the quality of the images? I have no gripes about the image quality on my current model. I just don't wish to go backwards in that regard.

Is there anyone on this forum who has upgraded from my model who might comment on the image quality between the two or have other advice regarding an upgrade.

I am taking a trip in June and don't want to wait to see if a newer model might be in the works for later this year.

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~ Mary

Mary, if you go to my Flickr album, that has a link in my Signature line and do a search on it for the H5 and the HX1, you will see many examples from both cameras. On my Vimeo album there are videos from the HX1.

The H5 takes sharp photos and shows less noise in its fullsize photos than the HX1. However, the HX1 has many more features and the Anti-Motion Blur mode and the Twilight Mode use six rapid-fire exposures to overlay into one photo, that takes away most visible noise. The HX1 also focuses faster and better and has exceptionally good HD video, with amazing performance in dim light.

I don't show fullsize photos from my HX1, but first re-size them to about 1600 X 1200 or less. I do this on the Sony PMB program and use the highest quality level of 6 for the re-sized photos. This further reduces the visible noise. I also use the 6.7 Megapixel 16:9 mode for photos, as it uses 5 bits-per-pixel for encoding, while the fullsize 9 Megapixel mode uses only 4 bits.

I don't think you'll be disappointed with the HX1, once you learn how to make the special features work for you. If you want one, better act fast, as they're getting scarce and won't be available much longer.
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Steve McDonald
http://www.flickr.com/photos/22121562@N00/
http://www.vimeo.com/user458315/videos



http://video.yahoo.com/people/4019627

Camera upgrades are hard decisions. Stephen has given you some solid advice, with good tips on working with the HX1, along with a whole stable of pictures to back up what he has indicated. He also has pointed to some of the more outstanding strong points of the HX1 when considered against the H series on the whole. However, nothing substitutes for your own personal interaction experience in real time with any cam. Since you can order these cameras with money back guarantee, I do not see how you could not be moved forward in the decision-making process by getting an HX1 in your own hands and taking her out for a spin.

Personally, I had the H1 and loved the cam. However, I have moved on to the HX1. I think almost any cam you really like that you retire for a later model will always leave you with some longing for one reason or another that will vary from person to person. I still use my 717 for some portrait shots, for example. However, I am glad to have and use the HX1 for the strong points Stephen has pointed out alone.
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Jerry (Gerald L. Stevens)

Steve and Jerry,

You guys are wonderful. My thanks for taking the time to offer this very helpful information on the differences between the two cameras. One day I think I'm going to order the HX1, the next day I think I should keep my H5 and use my little pocket camera for video for now. I thiink the faster focusing and the video are probably the biggest differences for me between the two models. I don't really need the longer reach although it would certainly be nice for the few times I might need it. My outdoor shooting involves mostly flowers and butterflies so the reach of the H5 is OK for those objects. I especially like the feel of the HX1 and the way it handles. Coming from the H5, the menu's etc. fell right into place for me. Still haven't made a decision but as Steve says, better make up my mind quickly!

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~ Mary

First let me say I do not shoot video. But I do shoot lots of flowers and I found that the H5 just gives a much better photo with less work than the HX1. It also takes nice pictures with the Sony 1.7x tele-convertor, for some extra reach.

I don't print large but I do crop occasionally and I found the smearing an issue with the HX1.

Although i shoot with quite a few cameras the H5 has remained my flower camera!

For other pictures your miliege may definitely vary.

The majority of pictures in my flower galleries are from the H5.

http://digitalman.smugmug.com/Flowers
--
When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras. - Ockham's Razor Principle

http://digitalman.smugmug.com/

-> a bit longer reach, faster focusing and better video mode. My concern is the quality of the images? I have no gripes about the image quality on my current model. I just don't wish to go backwards in that regard.

like for me this BSI sensor is BullShitImaging sensor as it looks pretty nice on the paper and straight out of camera but not enlarged; it can produce very nice pictures with the right exposure but if you want decent IQ I guess you will find EXR as better one

anti blur mode is very good and it allows to capture great moments

this camera is well suited for amateur video caps and you can really get some decent results as no zoom noise is noticeable, AF is fast and accurate and stabilization works;

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F717 and HX1 proud owner

looking for adapter to use filters on HX1 ???
visit my site : http://hx1-adapter.tk

Hey Steve,

Your galleries are gorgeous! What a wonderful gift you have in capture and processing flower shots. The artistic frames are innovative too. Nice work!

Given your great eye and skillful shooting, I was curious the conditions under which you made your comparisons of the H5/HX1. That is, first of all, did you actually have the HX1 in hand and make one-to-one shots in real time at the same time as you made equivalent H5 shots so that the comparisons were on a level playing field? In a similar vein, were they both handheld using IS or tripod with IS off? I ask about tripod, because flower shooters regularly use tripods.

Secondly, I was curious what settings were you using? Manual? Program? Most especially, did you make any set of your comparison shots based upon the technological strength of the HX1, that is, its layering technique in Twilight mode, in which case noise reduction is off completely (no smearing at all), and inherent noise averaged away beautifully as the 6 shots are blended together? I wonder about this, because you complain about noise reduction smearing of the HX1. Such an effect could not possibly be Twilight mode. If you did not use the HX1's Twilight mode, your critique of what the HX1 is capable of producing in a flower shot does not seem to be fair.

I would hate for you to make critique of the HX1 that did not actually access the strengths of the cam, especially when those strengths suit your shooting style perfectly. Just a friendly curiosity about the parameters surrounding your critique.
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Jerry (Gerald L. Stevens)

Hmmm. Interesting comment. The HX1 does not use BSI technology in the first place.
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Jerry (Gerald L. Stevens)

thinking of upgrading my wifes camera h5 to the hx1 also, any other opinion besides the good thanks ones mentioned, or is there another camera to consider, i did look at canon dslr's a while back, should i wait for hx2?

Dale L Hamblin said:

thinking of upgrading my wifes camera h5 to the hx1 also, any other opinion > besides the good thanks ones mentioned, or is there another camera to consider, i > did look at canon dslr's a while back, should i wait for hx2?

Click to expand...

i dont think there will be a HX2 as Sony has put his priority on other types of camera's NEX and SLT's, it has been to long if you look back in history for a replacement ( i could be wrong ).

A DSLR is a totaly different approach you're bying into a system and no comparison should be made its a different class.

what will serve you best only you can decide.

i'm using P&S APS C and Full frame all have there strong and weeks and cover a different part of my shooting needs.

--
All my Post Processing is done with Capture NX2

http://www.flickr.com/photos/marti58/

I am happy with my HX1. I stumbled upon it by virtue of dumb luck, but post purchase research and experience with the camera has proven that the guy at the camera store sold me what I needed. I was simply tired of paying for brochures when I bought the camera, but it has rekindled my interest in photography which has been dormant for 10+ years. The dark room went away with the second kid, pieces of the camera system were lent, sold, and stolen, and by 10 years ago I occupied my time with other interests.

HX1 does so many things. The panorama is a functional although not quite aesthetic substitute for an ultra wide lens. The zoom goes almost twice as far as my old 100 to 300mm Canon. The HHT gives functional and sometimes beautiful shots of static subjects in low light. No chemistry. No hours toiling in oppressive darkness. No waiting for labs to see if you got a shot or not. After reading all the reviews and forums, I may upgrade to a DSLR for fun, but for work HX1 is all I need. Even if I get a DSLR, I will keep my HX1 because it is light and does everything with one item.
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Ed Rizk

Dale,

I own a HX-1 and my situation is comparable to Ed's...I was a dormant SLR film user for years and played in darkrooms when I had the time before my gear was either stolen or loaned out permanently to friends or relatives..My wife purchased a Sony P-200 in 2006 and I found that the little P&S camera was being utilized more than my remaining film camera--an era 1974 spotmatic..

I have no regrets in purchasing the HX-1...The 20x zoom and HHT are fantastic and I

have been able to capture events/images not possible with previous cameras...For these reasons alone I would recommend the HX-1 to you...In capable hands, I feel that it would surpass images taken by the H5 and posted in this forum...Remember,

many H5 users have been using their cameras for years and are well versed in their operations..This is not necessarily the case with HX-1 users...If you want to upgrade further, look at the a55 and be prepared to purchase a bag and expensive lens for this DSLR...Maybe in the future--LOL.
Bill

so everyone agrees that moving up from dsch5 to hx1 is a smart move, right! if ao thanks

In good light the H-2 or H-5 is rather hard to beat. In contrast the HX-1, was the first to offer some real technology innovations. I still use my H-2 and H-5 along side my HX-1, based on which light I have to shoot in that day.
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Sarah Joyce

This is a photo from my "senior citizen's" folder. However, it does show what the HX-1 can do in terms of image quality. It does very well indeed.

This shot was taken from a distance of almost 20 feet using the HX-1's built-in flash unit. At that distance, I still got some help from the flash, and the image sharpness is a tip of the hat to the Sony G Lens.

Comments are alway happily received and welcomed.



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Sarah Joyce

Stephen, have you had a chance or interest in comparing the new Panasonic fz100 , Canon fx30 to the Sony hx1 for Still and Video quality....??? You have mastered the hx1 and i am wondering how you feel about the new superzooms out now....????

NS3HX said:

Stephen, have you had a chance or interest in comparing the new Panasonic fz100 , Canon fx30 to the Sony hx1 for Still and Video quality....??? You have mastered the hx1 and i am wondering how you feel about the new superzooms out now....????

Click to expand...

I've paid some attention ro the new Canon SX30, but not the Panasonic model. The SX30 seems to take passably good pictures, despite its handicap of having 14 MP crammed onto its sensor. Some people have expressed a disappointment with its color, but others say it is actually more color-accurate. Raising the color intensity in the Menu might satisfy those who want more than natural color levels.

The video of the SX30 is limited to 720p and uses the same MOV format of the previous SX models, which requires a high bit-rate. There is a CHDK program for the SX30 being developed, that will change the video bit-rate and also restore the ultra-fine photo mode. Possibly, the CHDK program might also allow 1920 X 1080 video, but this has not been specifically mentioned by its developer. You could visit the Canon forum and read some of the discussion about this program.

By having such a high magnification power in its lens, any camera will be more susceptible to artifacts such as barrel-distortion and color-fringing. I doubt that the SX30 will produce results that are as clean, bright and undistorted as the HX1. For the extra-high reach of the SX30, an amount of quality-loss would have to be tolerated.

At $400. (U.S.), the SX30 is too cheap for its feature-set and you shouldn't expect marvelous results and long-term durability at that price. If Canon can deliver good quality at that price, that's fine, but I'd feel more confident in buying it, if it cost $500. or $600.

--
Steve McDonald
http://www.flickr.com/photos/22121562@N00/
http://www.vimeo.com/user458315/videos



http://video.yahoo.com/people/4019627

The HX1 does NOT use a BSI-CMOS imager. I think that lets it escape some of the "glitches" that we have seen in the BSI-CMOS imager camera.

While it is older (released in Jan'09) it is still a very competent camera that does still images very well indeed, albeit somewhat slowly when compared to today's speed standards. It video is somewhat not standard, but none the less effective.

I shoot with the HX1 and love it.
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Sarah Joyce

Stephen McDonald said:

I've paid some attention to the new Canon SX30, but not the Panasonic model. The SX30 seems to take passably good pictures, despite its handicap of having 14 MP crammed onto its sensor.

Click to expand...

I actually gave myself a Christmas present today -- a new HX1. The SX30 with its monster 35x zoom got me interested in the superzoom segment again (I've had a few, from Canon and Panasonic), and I'll be glad to describe my thought process regarding winding up with the HX1.

But let's get through Steve's message, first....

Stephen McDonald said:

By having such a high magnification power in its lens, any camera will be more susceptible to artifacts such as barrel-distortion and color-fringing. I doubt that the SX30 will produce results that are as clean, bright and undistorted as the HX1. For the extra-high reach of the SX30, an amount of quality-loss would have to be tolerated.

Click to expand...

I think that the current crop of 14-megapixel "teensy" sensors have absolutely "tossed the baby out with the bathwater." I don't care who makes the sensor -- these high-pixel-density teensy sensors just produce so much noise that the manufacturers have to employ utterly outrageous amounts of noise reduction processing to deal with it -- and you just wind up with mush. Nothing but mush.

But beyond that, the SX30 images I've seen quite possibly have more color fringing than anything I've ever seen in about a decade's worth of using digital cameras. Canon has always been prone to produce color fringing in its cameras, but the SX30 takes it all to a level beyond horrifying. Why they don't follow Panasonic and deal with that with some in-camera processing, I will never understand. Anyway, add in the high pixel-density mush, and there's just no way I could live with that thing.

Most everything else in the segment, according to the reviews, exhibits relatively the same amounts of high pixel-density mush. Some do better (or not) in regards to color fringing. I kind of like the 30x Olympus SP-800 UZ, since I don't really want or need the EVF and the bulk it requires, but the reviews have been critical of its image quality, and in some "in-store" usage, it was almost impossible to get a stable shot at its full zoom.

I've looked at the HX1 seriously a number of times over the past year or so, and I finally decided I'd better get one before Sony replaces it with yet another 14-megapixel monstrosity.

The reasons that really made me settle for "only" a 20x zoom are the following:

• Lower pixel density sensor.

• Lack of lens distortion at both ends of the zoom range.

• Full features, including image quality settings including noise reduction.

In the end, it really is the only camera with the "Exmor technologies" that provide any image quality adjustments at all, and of course, those settings are really very comprehensive. I compared the "on the LCD" results with the hand-held twilight mode as compared to the Olympus, and the difference was laughable -- just very high-quality results with the Sony, versus "couldn't get a stable shot with a dozen attempts" with the Olympus.

Plus, of course, there are a bunch of other positives such as the articulating screen. It all really adds up to a superzoom camera that I think I can get far better results with as compared to the "out of their freaking minds" high-megapixel competition. And, most of all, the Sony cameras with the "Exmor technologies" are just downright FUN cameras to use -- gosh, why not get one with that long zoom range, plus a bunch of adjustability that you just can't get in any of the subsequent models Sony has produced since the HX1 hit the market.

So, we'll give it a workout. When I say "I got it today," it was really just a couple of hours ago -- the battery is charging. I'll try to give it a workout over the holidays, and we'll see what happens.

Tom Hoots
http://thoots.zenfolio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tomhoots/
http://www.dpreview.com/galleries/4330317199/albums

I always find your comments to be honest and objective Tom so I'm looking forward to what you have to say about the HX1. I am debating between the HX1, the FZ100 and possibly even the Nikon P100 for my next bridge cam. The Panasonic issues with WB always concern me though and I have already read that complaint in 3 different pro reviews of the FZ100. :/