What happened to all D100 softness posts??

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit. Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to (gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Casey, apparently, taking "sports" pictures now. Maybe someone will post some of the "softer" sex a little later on.

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break
from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new
members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same
things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital
SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just
didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I
have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit.
Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good
amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a
positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute
regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't
take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Click to expand...

--

XG1
http://www.pbase.com/image/6279465/large

People who like the camera love what they get from it and you can look at their galleries to see exactly how good some of the images are. People who don't like it probably never will and should look elsewhere instead of filling the forums with negative posts. As for me, I love my D100 even though I can't afford all the high priced lenses!

In short, shoot RAW or High Sharpening Jpegs and you won't have a softness issue.

--
http://www.pbase.com/elterrible

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break
from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new
members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same
things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital
SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just
didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I
have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit.
Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good
amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a
positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute
regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't
take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Click to expand...

Hi,

I think some of the guys found the time to read the manual. On a D-SLR you can select different types of in camera sharping. I use a D1 so I can´t talk about the D100 but I think the main problem is that people who change from a consumer digital camera are surprised that post processing is needed.

I shoot jpeg because a hate to go through all that nef - tif - jpeg stuff and a use a very low in-camera-sharping. Reason: the less the camera sharpens the image the less jpeg-artefacts you get and you also have more room for post processing in PS.

Joachim
http://www.joachimgerstl.com

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break
from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new
members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same
things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital
SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just
didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I
have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit.
Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good
amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a
positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute
regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't
take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Click to expand...

--
joachim

The debate shifted to "good out of the camera", vs. "soft vs. tack sharp". But it's pretty well understood now that NEF eliminates any issue of "soft" images. And the discussion has raised awareness of the other limitations of JPEG ... like artifacts, 8-bit color and fixed white balance/color casts. It's widely understood and agreed that the Nikon D100 has less than ideal JPEG algorithms, probably built into its hardware and possibly not addressible through firmware. However, the diminished sharpness of JPEG vs. NEF also brings with it less noise and little artifacting. For those doing sophisticated sharpening in post-processing, it's not a bad deal, using JPEG on the Nikon D100. For those playing with simple USM, I'm not so sure.

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break
from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new
members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same
things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital
SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just
didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I
have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit.
Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good
amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a
positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute
regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't
take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Click to expand...

Joachim Gerstl said:

Hi,

I think some of the guys found the time to read the manual. On a
D-SLR you can select different types of in camera sharping.

Click to expand...

You really believe that only idiots were complaining about the softness issue? Or do you really believe that we should be politically correct even here and avoid any negative comment on Nikon or the D100?

Fact is that yes, the D100 is not as sharp as we wish but people unhappy with the softness in jpeg still like other features of the machine and decided (like me) to work around the problem.

Is pathetic who is saying that Nikon "decided" to keep the pictures as they come from the CCD rather than having artificial sharpness. If that was true we wouldn't have 3 sharpness setting in the first place and the jpeg would be just like the NEF, identical. That is not the truth, Nikon is softer since they don't have a very good jpeg scheme otherwise it would be impossible to explain why jpeg out of PS7 is sharper even with the same file size. The D100 is also softer since they decided to put more low pass in front of the CCD, I respect this as a design decision while the jpeg issue is not a design decision, it is a design mistake.

This camera however is having a few features that in my opinion just kill the D60 and the Fuji, so the people like me, not too happy with the out of the camera quality did some homework and now the camera is the best compromise among the three although not as good as expected. This is the reason why not too many are complaining anymore. People just got around the problem, but that doesn’t mean that this camera is as sharp as it should.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Click to expand...

If you haven't been on the forum for awhile, you might have missed this:

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

NIKON IMPROVES D100 EXPERIENCE WITH NEW SOFTWARE PRODUCT

MELVILLE, NY April 1, 2002--Nikon today responded to customer complaints about soft JPEG images on the recently introduced D100 digital SLR by providing a free software package, Digital Viagra.

"You want hard edges, we'll give you hard edges," said digital products manager **** LoLima. "Look, when the Canon D30 came out, everyone oohed and aahed over the detailess images that came out of that camera; some even thanked Canon for helping them finally get that diffusion filter off the front of their lens." LoLima went on to say that since it's generally known that Canon knows exactly what customers want, Nikon decided that their next digital SLR needed some serious softening.

Digital Viagra is a free download (www.nikonsatire.com) that works in conjunction with Nikon View 5.1.0.3.2.11 on your PC to remove the "soften mask" information that's stored in the EXIF data for all JPEG images taken with a D100. (A Mac version is promised, but not yet ready.) By removing the mask, edges are restored to those seen by the CCD. LoLima cautions, "but if you're a wedding photographer and the bride complains about her complexion, don't get mad at us--just stop using Digital Viagra!"

LoLima also noted that Nikon was investigating whether to create Digital Sunlight, which would remove the "underexposure mask" information stored with all images taken with the D100. "First we'll see how Digital Viagra is received," said LoLima.

--
Thom Hogan
author, Nikon Field Guide
author, Nikon Flash Guide
author, Complete Guide to the Nikon D100
author, Complete Guide to the Nikon D1, D1h, & D1x
http://www.bythom.com

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break
from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new
members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same
things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital
SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just
didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I
have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit.
Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good
amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a
positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute
regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't
take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Click to expand...

Casey

They all pre-ordered Kodak 14n and went to the Kodak forum, and since no one has any files from the 14n, it must be sharp!

Boris
http://public.fotki.com/borysd/

Hi...

Well, my feeling concerning the D100 in general are ambiguous...

I think the sharpness is only a point in print sizes above 5x7.

The handling is great and possibly the only benefit of this camera.

When it comes to the exposure topic I only can say, that I am dissapointed. I didn't analyze this from a "GaGa" standpoint and I feel the D100 is not at all a professional tool. Exposure is more like a surprise than something that can be professionally predicted with the well known methods of metering. It is a toy instead of a tool. It does simply not work as expected. Indeed, the inconsistencies I am starting to discover in my own system drive me crazy.

Some days ago I thought I had made peace with the exposure topic unless I changed to a different lens to proove my settings... and... 8)= Nothing more to say here... Today I tried some more lrnses in brief and all I did before seemed to be pretty usless, another lens and nothing works as evaluated before...

I am beginning to doubt about the value of the total N* system, especially the digital bodies...

Regards, A. Schiele

Gabriele Sartori said:

Joachim Gerstl said:

Hi,

I think some of the guys found the time to read the manual. On a
D-SLR you can select different types of in camera sharping.

Click to expand...

You really believe that only idiots were complaining about the
softness issue? Or do you really believe that we should be
politically correct even here and avoid any negative comment on
Nikon or the D100?

Fact is that yes, the D100 is not as sharp as we wish but people
unhappy with the softness in jpeg still like other features of the
machine and decided (like me) to work around the problem.

Is pathetic who is saying that Nikon "decided" to keep the pictures
as they come from the CCD rather than having artificial sharpness.
If that was true we wouldn't have 3 sharpness setting in the first
place and the jpeg would be just like the NEF, identical. That is
not the truth, Nikon is softer since they don't have a very good
jpeg scheme otherwise it would be impossible to explain why jpeg
out of PS7 is sharper even with the same file size. The D100 is
also softer since they decided to put more low pass in front of the
CCD, I respect this as a design decision while the jpeg issue is
not a design decision, it is a design mistake.

This camera however is having a few features that in my opinion
just kill the D60 and the Fuji, so the people like me, not too
happy with the out of the camera quality did some homework and now
the camera is the best compromise among the three although not as
good as expected. This is the reason why not too many are
complaining anymore. People just got around the problem, but that
doesn’t mean that this camera is as sharp as it should.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Click to expand...

Hi!

Thom Hogan said:

NIKON IMPROVES D100 EXPERIENCE WITH NEW SOFTWARE PRODUCT

Click to expand...

(-;

Thom Hogan said:

...Digital Viagra.

Click to expand...

Does this work for digital zoom too ??? LOL...

Thom Hogan said:

"You want hard edges, we'll give you hard edges,"

Click to expand...

tirili, tirila,... 8)=

Thom Hogan said:

LoLima also noted that Nikon was investigating whether to create
Digital Sunlight, which would remove the "underexposure mask"
information stored with all images taken with the D100. "First
we'll see how Digital Viagra is received," said LoLima.

Click to expand...

There my humour ends, it took me more than lots of days to search any consistency between graycard (or comparable) meterings and any graypoint in the historgram of D100 shots, evaluating custom curves, etc. but the system is simply not accurate concerning traditional metering techniques (and this is still a positive description...). In addition with every different lens behaviour changes again... a tool? a professional system??

If I meter something (especially spot) I expect to get gray there not sometimes -1.0 sometimes -0.7 and sometimes 0...

Regards, A. Schiele

Thom Hogan said:

--
Thom Hogan
author, Nikon Field Guide
author, Nikon Flash Guide
author, Complete Guide to the Nikon D100
author, Complete Guide to the Nikon D1, D1h, & D1x
http://www.bythom.com

Click to expand...

Maybe that:

1. The people who want sharpness controlled to their liking are shooting RAW and post processing with NC3 and other tools.
2. Shooting JPEG with high sharpening.
3. Dumped their D100 on ebay and gone back to P/S digicams.

I shoot RAW exclusively and use NC3 and PS7 with lots of 3rd party actions for sharpening, effects, etc. Of course its a time sink, but an enjoyable hobby. Certainly beats a smelly chemical and film darkroom!

b52 s

Casey Cheung said:

A few months ago, the Nikon SLR forum was flooded with posts about
the D100 producing "soft" images. It seemed that every other post
was the same thing over and over again.

I was actually turned off by these posts, and sort of took a break
from this forum for a little while. There have been so many new
members with all kinds of esoteric code names all saying the same
things for awhile. I realize that the advent of the $2,000 digital
SLR has brought in many new members, which is a good thing, I just
didn't expect so many to keep asking the same ol' same ol'.

However, as I recently look at the latest postings and headlines, I
have noticed that the D100 softness issue has died down a bit.
Things now appear to be "normal" again, in terms of having a good
amount of diverse topics to discuss about. I think this is a
positive change.

So whatever happened to all the softness posts? Did the D100 users
simply get smarter and learned to deal with it? Did they convert to
(gasp!) Canon users instead? Did they give up and went back to
their Coolpix P/S cams?

Okay, I realize I have nothing of significance to contribute
regarding this post, I was just making a casual observation. Don't
take anything I wrote too seriously--no harm meant.

Regards,
Casey

D1x & D100 owner

Click to expand...

b52 s said:

I shoot RAW exclusively and use NC3 and PS7 with lots of 3rd party
actions for sharpening, effects, etc. Of course its a time sink,
but an enjoyable hobby. Certainly beats a smelly chemical and film
darkroom!

Click to expand...

Here ya! I feel EXACTLY the same

I just don't understand the discussions. I went through this a couple years ago with the F5 and don't plan to go through with D100 anytime soon! With the F5 it was underexpose, it was slowness, it was always something. I just adjusted and all was fine. I plan to do the same here. Otherwise your alternative is to get a Canon (horrors!)
--
Ross Frid
http://users.netonecom.net/~rsfrid/

Gabriele,

Who said anything about idiots? I said some people love the camera and some don't... I also said those that don't probably never will but you can look at the pictures coming from the ones who love it to show that it is a good camera.

As for not being sharp, if you set the sharpening to high or auto when shooting jpeg most shots are usually fairly sharp with the need for a slight white balance adjustment. If you shoot RAW and set the sharpening to auto you'll get crisp pictures everytime but that isn't alway the setting you want to keep your camera at.

--
http://www.pbase.com/elterrible

Gabriele Sartori said:

Joachim Gerstl said:

Hi,

I think some of the guys found the time to read the manual. On a
D-SLR you can select different types of in camera sharping.

Click to expand...

You really believe that only idiots were complaining about the
softness issue? Or do you really believe that we should be
politically correct even here and avoid any negative comment on
Nikon or the D100?

Fact is that yes, the D100 is not as sharp as we wish but people
unhappy with the softness in jpeg still like other features of the
machine and decided (like me) to work around the problem.

Is pathetic who is saying that Nikon "decided" to keep the pictures
as they come from the CCD rather than having artificial sharpness.
If that was true we wouldn't have 3 sharpness setting in the first
place and the jpeg would be just like the NEF, identical. That is
not the truth, Nikon is softer since they don't have a very good
jpeg scheme otherwise it would be impossible to explain why jpeg
out of PS7 is sharper even with the same file size. The D100 is
also softer since they decided to put more low pass in front of the
CCD, I respect this as a design decision while the jpeg issue is
not a design decision, it is a design mistake.

This camera however is having a few features that in my opinion
just kill the D60 and the Fuji, so the people like me, not too
happy with the out of the camera quality did some homework and now
the camera is the best compromise among the three although not as
good as expected. This is the reason why not too many are
complaining anymore. People just got around the problem, but that
doesn’t mean that this camera is as sharp as it should.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Click to expand...

alfred_schiele said:

Some days ago I thought I had made peace with the exposure topic
unless I changed to a different lens to proove my settings...
and... 8)= Nothing more to say here... Today I tried some more
lrnses in brief and all I did before seemed to be pretty usless,
another lens and nothing works as evaluated before...

Click to expand...

I have the same situation. Nothing that is not fixable with PS but clearly is also bothering me. I don't think that this camera is a toy but if you consider the cost they should have done a better job. The major inconsistency is using different brand of lens. It is funny but while Nikons underexpose a little Sigma overexpose a little. I had a curve in the camera and it was working very well with my 24-120 but when I put my 15-30 it is too bright. The default curve is not exciting but is a sort of compromise and both lenses kind of work OK.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Pete Perry said:

Gabriele,

Who said anything about idiots?

Click to expand...

You didn't, my post was to both of you, according to Joachin the people didn't know that this camera has 3 modes so according to him they are clearly idiots.

You on the contrary were the one indicatin that we shouldn't critique Nikon in this forum. You are the one that I indicated as the "politically correct" guy.

Member said:

As for not being sharp, if you set the sharpening to high or auto
when shooting jpeg most shots are usually fairly sharp with the
need for a slight white balance adjustment. If you shoot RAW and
set the sharpening to auto you'll get crisp pictures everytime but
that isn't alway the setting you want to keep your camera at.

Click to expand...

yada yada yada. I got this Camera since the 4th of July when they came out. I know all that and it is what I do. Is that right? No! It is just a workaround. I need to buy more flash memory, a portable storage device, NC3, and put extra work on my photos in order to have crisp pictures.

With Canon all that is not necessary. I applaude people like Apolinario for their effort with the curves and fortunately sharpness is not a big issue unless you go after 8x11" or bigger. I can't say I'm 100% happy though and I'm offended by people that proclame that only morons can't get great photos out of this camera.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Thom Hogan said:

NIKON IMPROVES D100 EXPERIENCE WITH NEW SOFTWARE PRODUCT

Click to expand...

Thom Hogan said:

LoLima also noted that Nikon was investigating whether to create
Digital Sunlight, which would remove the "underexposure mask"
information stored with all images taken with the D100. "First
we'll see how Digital Viagra is received," said LoLima.

Click to expand...

By a professional like you Tom.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Gabriele Sartori said:

Pete Perry said:

Gabriele,

Who said anything about idiots?

Click to expand...

You didn't, my post was to both of you, according to Joachin the
people didn't know that this camera has 3 modes so according to him
they are clearly idiots.

Click to expand...

You really don't need to put words in peoples mouths. You are the one who ASSUMES they are idiots, by reinterpreting his words.

Digitom

Digitom said:

You really don't need to put words in peoples mouths. You are the
one who ASSUMES they are idiots, by reinterpreting his words.

Click to expand...

May be you don't get it, but if someone assume that I spend 4000$ in gears and I cry because isn't sharp without knowing that is possible to set in-camera sharpening he is insulting me OK?!

I'm not putting word on anybody mouths I just say it as it is!

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

I don't know about you guys, but I'm a complete amateur and I bought D100 as a toy camera to play around and perhaps learn something about photography. I don't think I would consider it at all for professional work...

Gabriele Sartori said:

Thom Hogan said:

NIKON IMPROVES D100 EXPERIENCE WITH NEW SOFTWARE PRODUCT

Click to expand...

Gabriele Sartori said:

LoLima also noted that Nikon was investigating whether to create
Digital Sunlight, which would remove the "underexposure mask"
information stored with all images taken with the D100. "First
we'll see how Digital Viagra is received," said LoLima.

Click to expand...

By a professional like you Tom.

--
Regards
Gabriele Sartori

Click to expand...

Lighten up Gab......sounds as if you are overdue for your enema again!
--
Dan