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Canon 1Ds price too high? Nope.

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Actually, all these well thought out arguments don't change the fact that for me the price is simply too high. The D60 will pretty much do what this camera will do only far, far cheaper. I think you would have to be crazy to pay $8000 for a digital camera that is sure to be eclipsed within 3 years by some $3000 new wonder camera. I've known a couple of people who sunk 10s of thousands into the DCS line of cameras, only to see the likes of the D30 give them extremely stiff competition at a fraction of the cost. You have to sell a heck of a lot of prints to pay for an $8000 camera.

It's more interesting to speculate on what this price will do against the possibility of new Nikon and Nikon-clones that may offer the same size sensor for half the price. Canon is giving Nikon an opening here. I expect them to close it up by coming out with a D60 successor within a year or two that will offer a full 35mm sensor. They normally come out with the cheaper version first but this time they changed their strategy. I wonder if it will turn out to be a good move?
 
But I have an idea. Since obviously you don't understand English very well, try another photography forum in a different language.

Canon's not trying to steal from or deceive anyone, Thomas. That's what you just refuse to understand, language-wise.

--
http://community.webshots.com/user/jeffreybehr
 
Jeffrey Behr said:
But I have an idea. Since obviously you don't understand English
very well, try another photography forum in a different language.

Canon's not trying to steal from or deceive anyone, Thomas. That's
what you just refuse to understand, language-wise.
Click to expand...
Now the insults begin because I won't come around to your way of thinking. And I suppose you're going to continue to dog me until I agree with you? I understand, sit down and shut up or agree with me because I'm not going to allow you to have a differing opinion.

Get a grip, I'm not going to agree with you.

In my opinion, Canon is ripping people off with the price they're charging for this camera body. If someone wants to let themselves be ripped off, that's fine. If pros want to pay WAAAAAAY to much for a camera body, that's fine. If you think that the price for the 1Ds if a fair price that's fine. And if I want to think that people like you are being foolish, that also is fine.

Just buy the camera body and be happy. You aren't going to get my seal of approval.
 
Jeffrey Behr said:
You're still wrong, Thomas, but you're just not honest or smart
enough to admit it.
Click to expand...
Ahhhhh! The dogging insults continue.

You don't know for a fact if I'm right or I'm wrong. You're guessing, as you don't know how much it costs to manufacture, promote and/or sell the 1Ds and turn a profit, nor do I. The only way you could know if I'm wrong is if you are part of the Canon business chain and are privy to Canon's manufacturing development costs of the 1Ds. Are you a part of Canon's business chain?

And now because I refuse to agree with you, I'm being disingenuous as in dishonest and I lack the intellectual ability to understand the error of my thinking.

If you continue to dog me then my original premise about you being a controlling personality will be borne out by your actions.

My, my, my!
 
Of course your right, Canon should charge $15k for the body and then $1k for each firmware revision. I guess that would be better?

--
Theo

Don't anthropomorphize cameras. They don't like it.
redman said:
For years Nikon has been charging MORE for their lenses (and
bodies) than Canon. Anyone doubt that Canon lenses are not as
good? Forget about IS leadership. Just craftsmanship and optical
quality. I don't hear anyone giving Canon credit for being "under
market". But if a body comes out at a price that seems
unreasonable (compared to what?) listen to the screams. I have
owned a Kodak 660 and 760. Batteries cause more grief that those
cameras were worth. And talk about "service"? How much were they?
Too much.

The 1D is a wonderful camera. The price isn't questioned because
there is NOTHING else to compare it to. Ever look into the photo
pit at any sporting event? Nikon does NOT have a pro 11-14
megapixel camera to compare to the 1Ds, so why guess what they will
sell it for. The new Kodak is the 1st camera they have ever sold
for a "reasonable" price. But who wants to buy it? All I hear is
"I'll wait for the next Nikon". Good luck. Next summer those of
us who bought a 1Ds will have shot and worn out our Canons. If you
shoot to make money, one can't afford to sit on the sidelines. If
you shoot for fun, the D100, D60, Fuji make a lot of sense.

I can't wait to get my hands on a new 1Ds. I'm losing sleep
waiting. Sure it is expensive. But imagine how ticked off you
would be if they charged $4000 and you had to wait 2 years to get
one.

http://www.jannard.com
Click to expand...
 
I understand there is quite a waiting list already for this camera. I guess they must have really missed the mark with pricing.....
Theodore said:
Of course your right, Canon should charge $15k for the body and
then $1k for each firmware revision. I guess that would be better?

--
Theo
Click to expand...
 
Where is the rip off? We are talking about a LUXURY product here, not prescription medicine or bread for crying out loud.

Sure it is a lot of money, but so is a Lexus or a Ferrari. The margins on a Convertible Mercedes are HUGE. But that doesn't mean it is a rip off.

It is only a rip off if you believe that you DESERVE a camera like this and some corporate puke is keeping you from getting one by pricing it high.

If that is where you are coming from, then you are right to believe that someone at canon corporate is trying to rip you off.

In the mean time, they will sell all the cameras they can produce at this price and the reviews will come back from those owners that it is a great camera.
Thomas Gardner said:
Jeffrey Behr said:
But I have an idea. Since obviously you don't understand English
very well, try another photography forum in a different language.

Canon's not trying to steal from or deceive anyone, Thomas. That's
what you just refuse to understand, language-wise.
Click to expand...
Now the insults begin because I won't come around to your way of
thinking. And I suppose you're going to continue to dog me until I
agree with you? I understand, sit down and shut up or agree with
me because I'm not going to allow you to have a differing opinion.

Get a grip, I'm not going to agree with you.

In my opinion, Canon is ripping people off with the price they're
charging for this camera body. If someone wants to let themselves
be ripped off, that's fine. If pros want to pay WAAAAAAY to much
for a camera body, that's fine. If you think that the price for
the 1Ds if a fair price that's fine. And if I want to think that
people like you are being foolish, that also is fine.

Just buy the camera body and be happy. You aren't going to get my
seal of approval.
Click to expand...
 
bfall said:
If that is where you are coming from, then you are right to believe
that someone at canon corporate is trying to rip you off.
Click to expand...
No, that's not where I'm coming from but it's okay if you want to believe that.

Why is it okay to agree with you but if you desent then you've commited a crime.

I think it's a rip. That's my opinion and no matter how much you and others dog me, that's still going to be my opinion.
 
Michael Porter said:
Please pardon my temerity.
Click to expand...
I'm not challenging you! You're welcome to speak up. If ridiculing other's serves a purpose, then have at it.

I have no problem with those that disagree with my opinion. But what I don't understand is the need for someone to dog opinions that differ from their's.

Why don't you come right out and say it.

Sit down and shut up because your opinon is out of step with mine.
 
redman said:
I understand there is quite a waiting list already for this camera.
I guess they must have really missed the mark with pricing.....
Click to expand...
My comment was of course tongue-in-cheek, however, are you sure that the waiting list wasn't because of the pre-orders, taken before pricing was announced?

I was looking forward to this camera, no sweat off my back though, Canon can set whatever price they want, I'll just vote with my wallet. I'll probably pick up a 1D, and buy this camera in a year or two, no hurry.

Of course, there's also the chance that another vendor might "woo" me away, it'd have to be substantial though, as I am invested in Glass and accessories, but that's what eBay is for! (90%+ of retail on quality camera equipment)

--
Theo

Don't anthropomorphize cameras. They don't like it.
 
bfaul said:
It's more interesting to speculate on what this price will do
against the possibility of new Nikon and Nikon-clones that may
offer the same size sensor for half the price. Canon is giving
Nikon an opening here.
Click to expand...
Nikon does not yet have a competing camera. Canon probably cannot produce eough cameras to meet the demand at a price of $8,000 so pricing the camera lower would just be leaving money on the table.
bfaul said:
I expect them to close it up by coming out
with a D60 successor within a year or two that will offer a full
35mm sensor. They normally come out with the cheaper version first
but this time they changed their strategy. I wonder if it will
turn out to be a good move?
Click to expand...
Given how expensive the !Ds sensor probably is, putting it in a cheap body would be foolish. The D30 was a $3000 camera in a $400 camera body. A full frame D30/60 would be a $6000 camera in a $400 camera body.

I doubt your really need a full frame DSLR. I suspect you could get by with a 16-35 of 14mm lens and perhaps an Elan 7 for when you really need to go ultra wide.
 
And so is Porsche, Mercedes, BMW, Audi ... why don't we all buy Neons? Or Yugos? Why pay several grad - even some 100k's for a car?

The D1s is overpriced in my mind - nevcerthless who ever want's to spend the ,money and think it's woth it - feel free to do so and enjoy life. There is only one.

amen, christian.
redman said:
For years Nikon has been charging MORE for their lenses (and
bodies) than Canon. Anyone doubt that Canon lenses are not as
good? Forget about IS leadership. Just craftsmanship and optical
quality. I don't hear anyone giving Canon credit for being "under
market". But if a body comes out at a price that seems
unreasonable (compared to what?) listen to the screams. I have
owned a Kodak 660 and 760. Batteries cause more grief that those
cameras were worth. And talk about "service"? How much were they?
Too much.

The 1D is a wonderful camera. The price isn't questioned because
there is NOTHING else to compare it to. Ever look into the photo
pit at any sporting event? Nikon does NOT have a pro 11-14
megapixel camera to compare to the 1Ds, so why guess what they will
sell it for. The new Kodak is the 1st camera they have ever sold
for a "reasonable" price. But who wants to buy it? All I hear is
"I'll wait for the next Nikon". Good luck. Next summer those of
us who bought a 1Ds will have shot and worn out our Canons. If you
shoot to make money, one can't afford to sit on the sidelines. If
you shoot for fun, the D100, D60, Fuji make a lot of sense.

I can't wait to get my hands on a new 1Ds. I'm losing sleep
waiting. Sure it is expensive. But imagine how ticked off you
would be if they charged $4000 and you had to wait 2 years to get
one.

http://www.jannard.com
Click to expand...
 
Theodore said:
--
Theo

Don't anthropomorphize cameras. They don't like it.
redman said:
For years Nikon has been charging MORE for their lenses (and
bodies) than Canon. Anyone doubt that Canon lenses are not as
good? Forget about IS leadership. Just craftsmanship and optical
quality. I don't hear anyone giving Canon credit for being "under
market". But if a body comes out at a price that seems
unreasonable (compared to what?) listen to the screams. I have
owned a Kodak 660 and 760. Batteries cause more grief that those
cameras were worth. And talk about "service"? How much were they?
Too much.

The 1D is a wonderful camera. The price isn't questioned because
there is NOTHING else to compare it to. Ever look into the photo
pit at any sporting event? Nikon does NOT have a pro 11-14
megapixel camera to compare to the 1Ds, so why guess what they will
sell it for. The new Kodak is the 1st camera they have ever sold
for a "reasonable" price. But who wants to buy it? All I hear is
"I'll wait for the next Nikon". Good luck. Next summer those of
us who bought a 1Ds will have shot and worn out our Canons. If you
shoot to make money, one can't afford to sit on the sidelines. If
you shoot for fun, the D100, D60, Fuji make a lot of sense.

I can't wait to get my hands on a new 1Ds. I'm losing sleep
waiting. Sure it is expensive. But imagine how ticked off you
would be if they charged $4000 and you had to wait 2 years to get
one.

http://www.jannard.com
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I think that Canon is suck your money until Nikon release D2x, in PMA 2003?
And then drop price of the 1Ds.
I have a D60, and don´t see enought Price/performance of the 1Ds to upgrade.
I will wait for price drops or next 1Ds.
8 K$? HEY CANON WHAT HAPEN
 
Because you do not see the value in this camera, you see it as a rip off. There are aspects of this camera that many people will find great value in. Others not. In your case, you do not see $8000 worth of value in it for your self. You are then equating this to not having $8000 worth of value for ANYONE.

Me, I see $6000 to $6500 worth of value in it, so for me it is priced to high. If I was better or able to make a living at this, the value would be much higher.

So say, "I think the camera is priced to high for me for the value I get." Don't refer to other people as not seeing this as a rip off because they do see value in what the 1Ds offers.

Steven
Thomas Gardner said:
bfall wrote:

No, that's not where I'm coming from but it's okay if you want to
believe that.

Why is it okay to agree with you but if you desent then you've
commited a crime.

I think it's a rip. That's my opinion and no matter how much you
and others dog me, that's still going to be my opinion.
Click to expand...
--
---
My really bad Fall Adventures:
http://www.pbase.com/snoyes/fall_adventures_2002
 
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