A700 Revisited....

WaltKnapp said:

All I'm asking is for a camera I can like that will be able to do the photography I do. That is not the SLT, and several of the reasons why the SLT is not the camera for me are basic to it's design and therefore something that cannot be tweaked away.

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That may well be true of the A33/A55 (indeed, there is no way I would even begin to think of them as replacements for my A700) but you have absolutely no idea what the A77 - or whatever it is called - will bring. Some of us are open-minded enough to wait and see (even though we might say we prefer an OVF, but based only on what we know about existing, not future, technology).

WaltKnapp said:

It's a matter of choice, I'm for choice, the SLT folks are not, wanting to force everyone into their choice.

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A dreadful generalisation, which sums up everything that is obnoxious about your attitude. Many SLT users (the majority I would say) have suggested that they would be happy to see parallel EVF/OVF lines continued.

because I was disappointed with the A100 in low light conditions when jumping fron KM A2. And with A700 I had much better results. But now I am again willing to jump (better low light behaviour, life view, EVF) and waiting for A7x.

Lyle From Canada said:

The reality you are owed nothing, you got what you paid for with no promise of future compatibility.

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And yet when he predicted that that compatability was about to end, he continued to invest in the system. There's no accounting for some folks' investment decisions.

dlkeller said:

Walt and several others here at least have a stake in our complaints and please to Sony to continue the A700 OVF legacy. I don't understand your stake in this. You evidently are getting the SLT cameras you want. If Walt is wrong and Sony continues to offer high end OVF cameras I'm sure he will be very happy about it, as will I. Would that adversely affect you in any way other than seeing Walt pleased?

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Will he? Can you explain to me this:

You do not like the direction SONY is going.. OK.

You want OVF... OK

What does bashing the SLT has to do with it? And more importantly, what do you think someone will accomplish by simply making up BS and spreading false rumors about "Lack of contrast on every SLT picture"?

I am sorry, I see 0 credibility in someone posting the above lies (simply, that's what it is) in every forum he visits to accomplish what? Make the SLT look bad so SONY will go back to OVF?

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/evangelos_k/

The review did move me into staying with the A-mount, I could have switched at that point, but more importantly the opinion and pictures of people who bought it here on the Forum convinced me to go for it.

As for the future...I'm waiting, there is no serious replacement at the moment and I'm not willing to go FF at this point, although I might if they bring out a new FF camera and no real a700 replacement. I'd switch platforms before downgrading to an a55, a77 I might consider if it would have a proper size.

Fortunately for now I'm perfectly happy with my a700.

Actually Sony never said that they'll stop the OVF. And they did release 2 OVF cameras along with the SLT's. But Walt complains, all day, all time in almost every SLT posts. And if Sony comes up with 2 versions of the a700 replacement, one with EVF and one with OVF, Walt is going to start saying all other the net, that Sony did this because of him, because of Walt. It's just all about himself and his arrogance.
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When your current system does not satisfy you, it is better to switch than to cry and whine on the forums.

It is my understanding that the A9xx will be OVF so it is not like Sony is abandoning the AA and Pro.

Samsolar said:

It is my understanding that the A9xx will be OVF so it is not like Sony is abandoning the AA and Pro.

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The rumor that Sony is abandoning the AA and pro is just BS from Walt and nothing else.
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When your current system does not satisfy you, it is better to switch than to cry and whine on the forums.

Hope your right, time will tell. The long wait for information makes decisions difficult thought. Really don't want to go full frame.

I am not selecting you out only responding to your statement nor am I claiming everyone shares my view or at lest I hope they don't.

evangelos k said:

dlkeller said:

Walt and several others here at least have a stake in our complaints and please to Sony to continue the A700 OVF legacy. I don't understand your stake in this. You evidently are getting the SLT cameras you want. If Walt is wrong and Sony continues to offer high end OVF cameras I'm sure he will be very happy about it, as will I. Would that adversely affect you in any way other than seeing Walt pleased?

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Will he? Can you explain to me this:

You do not like the direction SONY is going.. OK.

You want OVF... OK

What does bashing the SLT has to do with it? And more importantly, what do you think someone will accomplish by simply making up BS and spreading false rumors about "Lack of contrast on every SLT picture"?

I am sorry, I see 0 credibility in someone posting the above lies (simply, that's what it is) in every forum he visits to accomplish what? Make the SLT look bad so SONY will go back to OVF?

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No, He's bashing the Sony stated belief that the SLT is good enough for all 7 series users. Again, Sony could offer choice like they do in the 3 and 5 series cameras. They have had no problem releasing multiple versions of entry and mid range cameras, but at the level where there are different opinions as to what is best, and I will say that both camps know what they want and why, Sony has decided that there will be no choice. Of course we read here that if they release 2 versions of a 7 series camera Sony will go out of business, while over a dozen versions of entry and mid level is a brilliant business decision.

If Sony released both an SLT and a DSLR at the 7 level, then they could tell us that in the next version which one was the undisputed winner, and that's why Sony is going that way. If they are basing their decision on the A700 sales -- their first try, flawed at entry, and uncompetitive in features with other brands at the time it was released, combined with zippo advertising (every day I learn on TV why I should buy a Nikon or canon, I have never seen any Sony camera advertised except a couple of cybershots), they are really cooking the books.

tom

mzd said:

Actually Sony never said that they'll stop the OVF. And they did release 2 OVF cameras along with the SLT's. But Walt complains, all day, all time in almost every SLT posts. And if Sony comes up with 2 versions of the a700 replacement, one with EVF and one with OVF, Walt is going to start saying all other the net, that Sony did this because of him, because of Walt. It's just all about himself and his arrogance.
--

When your current system does not satisfy you, it is better to switch than to cry and whine on the forums.

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Mr.Cybershot-san did say that the A700 replacement would be SLT. After that they would evaluate the FF market and decide what to do. I hope he was misquoted, but there has never been any clarification from Sony, and their country managers keep saying the same thing.
tom

tom said:

mzd said:

Actually Sony never said that they'll stop the OVF. And they did release 2 OVF cameras along with the SLT's. But Walt complains, all day, all time in almost every SLT posts. And if Sony comes up with 2 versions of the a700 replacement, one with EVF and one with OVF, Walt is going to start saying all other the net, that Sony did this because of him, because of Walt. It's just all about himself and his arrogance.
--

When your current system does not satisfy you, it is better to switch than to cry and whine on the forums.

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Mr.Cybershot-san did say that the A700 replacement would be SLT. After that they would evaluate the FF market and decide what to do. I hope he was misquoted, but there has never been any clarification from Sony, and their country managers keep saying the same thing.
tom

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They also never said that they will not released an OVF SLR along with the SLT. And honestly, what does make a DSLR an advance Amateur model or a pro model? The OVF?
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When your current system does not satisfy you, it is better to switch than to cry and whine on the forums.

beakydave said:

Mike CH said:

Order of degree, I'd say.

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I wouldn't. There are those that are open-minded as to what Sony's future holds, whilst accepting that a switch may be necessary, and there are those that have closed their minds to the possibility of a replacement Sony camera that will fit their needs. Two quite different viewpoints.

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They are closer to each other than they are to the competing 'Rah Rah Sony can do no wrong' standpoint.

But yes, it can be argued.

beakydave said:

If you think that analysis amounts to name-calling, I'm guilty as charged.

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Sorry, that wasn't directed at you. And the sentence should have read 'And we will get the name calling again, as usual', as a prediction, not as a specific accusation.

Regards,
Mike
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I'd prefer my DSLR without video, thank you.
I know it has uses, but not for me.
I like the NEXes, but they are too small for my hands.

Tell me exactly how Walt is doing what you said by making up BS and spreading lies. Please do because you did not even come close to answer my very specific question.... unless you thing making up BS is for the good of the "advanced" amateurs, and spreading lies in every forum is to "protect" us from SONY's evil decision.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/evangelos_k/

I certainly hope this is true. I want a traditional DSLR that can do a little video with contrast detect. I'll either get it in the A7xx or I will get it in a FF camera. I just wish Sony would announce their intentions so I can make my plan. After messing with a µ43 GF1 for a while, I know that I want a larger sensor, not smaller--so FF sounds attractive.

Samsolar said:

It is my understanding that the A9xx will be OVF so it is not like Sony is abandoning the AA and Pro.

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--
Steve W
weather photos: http://home.comcast.net/~scwest/atmo/

And they are their books to do with as they please.

Sony, from what i can tell has decided to try a different approach. To make what no one else is making, this being SLT cameras. They seem to believe that this is their best best at gaining market share. Time will tell. If they lose a few oldtimers along the way that seems to the price they are willing to pay. Its their business, its their choice.
Walt running around like a 5 years making crap up isnt going to change that.

As for the choice in the lower end models I have to believe these models were already production ready and thus pointless not to release. I would bet you never see another 3 series camera with a conventional mirror from sony ever again, same goes for the 5 series as well, and most likely the 7.

Its a chance Sony seems willing to take. Now its up to the consumer to decide if this is something they want or dont want. Based on how fast the 33 and 55 are selling I would say thjings are going in the right direction from Sony's point of view.

Personally I dont care either way. I like what comes next I buy it, I dont like it, I dont buy it. It may cost me some money, but then again no one promised me anything, so as always it caveat emptor.
they are really cooking the books.

tom55604 said:

tom

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Sony a700 - Minolta 24/2.8 - Sony 35/1.8 - Sony 50/1.8 - Zeiss 16-80 - tamron 70-200/2.8 - extension tubes - Kenko teleplus300 1.4TC - HVL42 (x3)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lylegenykphotography/

Actually Best Buy tipped the scale for me but not because of the blowout. I bought long before that.

Best Buy gave me the opportunity to compare the A700 side by side with the Canon 40d and the Nikon d300.

The Sony was better than the Canon for just a few dollars more and almost as good as the Nikon for a lot less.

However, if I had known this is how things would end up I'd have gone with the Canon or the Nikon.

I've stopped buying lenses and accessories for the A700 but I can't bring myself to put my system up for sale and take the loss.

ovlov said:

with that little blowout of theirs. I was pretty blown away by the a700 when I first handled one. It made my a100 feel very antiquated. :/
--
My flickr page
http://www.flickr.com/photos/33412421@N08/

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No, its clear that you don't get it. Photography is unlike washing machines or TV sets or CD players.

The customer and the manufacturer share a bond. There is an investment in a system and a trust in the manufacturer.

Canon gets it.

Nikon gets it.

Pentax gets it

Sony said they got it, but that only lasted until they figured out they couldn't compete with Canon and Nikon.

You still don't get it.

Lyle From Canada said:

I am not "for" slt, or "for" ovf. I just happen to uderstand that Sony is a business, and is in that business to make money. They will go what ever route they choose if they feel it will bring in the most money. This isnt about what I like, or what you like. This is what you dont understand. You are all, me, me, me. It isnt about you, or anyone. Sony makes consumable products, they will either make a product you like or they wont. Simple as that. You have a choice, just not one you like. If you approve of Sony's direction or not is irrelevant, and only shows your own arrogance towards the whole subject. You spent your money and now feel you are owed. The reality you are owed nothing, you got what you paid for with no promise of future compatibility.

So the choice is yours, but dont expect Sony to change its plans for you, they would be fools to do so.

WaltKnapp said:

dlkeller said:

Walt and several others here at least have a stake in our complaints and please to Sony to continue the A700 OVF legacy. I don't understand your stake in this. You evidently are getting the SLT cameras you want. If Walt is wrong and Sony continues to offer high end OVF cameras I'm sure he will be very happy about it, as will I. Would that adversely affect you in any way other than seeing Walt pleased?

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I'm quite pleased with my a700 system, that probably makes him unhappy.

Yes if Sony continues the a700 OVF DSLR line with full R&D, continued improvement then I will be quite happy. I will say if no one complains that will never happen. Now is the time to try and get across to Sony that we want choice, we are not all the same. There are those of us who do not approve the direction they are going.

All I'm asking is for a camera I can like that will be able to do the photography I do. That is not the SLT, and several of the reasons why the SLT is not the camera for me are basic to it's design and therefore something that cannot be tweaked away. I studied the SLT design from when it first appeared on the horizon, did not make a sudden decision about it.

It's a matter of choice, I'm for choice, the SLT folks are not, wanting to force everyone into their choice.

Walt

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Sony a700 - Minolta 24/2.8 - Sony 35/1.8 - Sony 50/1.8 - Zeiss 16-80 - tamron 70-200/2.8 - extension tubes - Kenko teleplus300 1.4TC - HVL42 (x3)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lylegenykphotography/

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Some of us are open-minded enough to wait and see (even though we might say we prefer an OVF, but based only on what we know about existing, not future, technology).

So foolish. Being "open minded" and "wait and see" have very little to do with each other.

All it would take is for Sony to articulate their plans for advanced amateurs and pros.

We all know what Canon and Nikon will do. Sony is the unknown and the fact they won't clarify is what is disturbing, especially when compared to Canon and Nikon.