M9 Titanium £19,800 ... M9 Neiman Marcus Edition $17,500 ...

This is obscene. It seems Leica no longer cares for serious photographers but prefers a clientèle of vulgar money people looking for status symbols. But as Rolex, Rolls Royce and others have found out in the past, a clientèle that consists almost entirely of collectors, football players, Russian oligarchs, pimps and other criminals, does great harm to the reputation of a brand name. I think it quite possible that at some point in the future any sincere photographer would cringe at the thought of being associated with Leica. Being seen with the red dot would be just too embarrassing ...

Actually the NM version is in keeping with that store's identity. For years the Xmas catalogue had a two page spread with "unique" gifts in the 6 or 7 digit area (your own island near Tahiti, one of a kind cars, etc.) Offering things that appeal to the desire for conspicuous consumption is part of the NM caché.

I can understand NM cars, but a camera is supposed to be a goddamn tool, not a fashion icon.

A car can be considered a tool too, but let's be honest, a Toyota Camry will get you place to place just as good as the BMW or Jaguar, you're buying the expensive one at least partially for the status.

For a car I prefer my Toyota Prius.

This Leica is not for us, maybe for stinkin' rich people that do not have a problem spending money.
And why not?
If Leica can get money from this and use them to develop fine cameras, why not?

I will not even buy an regular M9 but I am sure is a fine camera, titanium or not.

--
Regards,
Zeev
Simon = family name so... call me Zeev!
http://public.fotki.com/zeev-simon/
http://picasaweb.google.com/zeev.simon

SheikYerbouti said:

This is obscene. It seems Leica no longer cares for serious photographers but prefers a clientèle of vulgar money people looking for status symbols. But as Rolex, Rolls Royce and others have found out in the past, a clientèle that consists almost entirely of collectors, football players, Russian oligarchs, pimps and other criminals, does great harm to the reputation of a brand name. I think it quite possible that at some point in the future any sincere photographer would cringe at the thought of being associated with Leica. Being seen with the red dot would be just too embarrassing ...

Click to expand...

Obscene may be a bit strong but distasteful it certainly is, in my opinion. Leica has always made special editions at silly prices and I dare say there have always been some in the company who have held their nose as they bank the income from them. Don’t get it out of proportion, though. There are only 500 of the M9Ti and only 50 of the N&M Edition. It doesn’t represent a major shift of focus away from serious photographers.

For some of us Leica users the image of itself that Leica promotes through these special editions is, as you say, an embarrassment. As I expect you know, there is a high price to pay for being a Leica user and it’s not only a cash price. Putting up with this kind of nonsense is also part of it. I wish they wouldn’t do it but, as someone else put it, it’s low-growing fruit. Parting the wealthy from their money in this way is just too easy and profitable to resist. It would be a shame if it put anyone off considering the standard production M9. It is a very fine camera for those who can get on with rangefinder photography and enjoy a back-to-basics style of shooting.
--
Robert

My DPR gallery (Leica and Pentax)
http://www.dpreview.com/galleries/3786625366/photos/slideshow

Hello S-y-B,

A bit ott! But yes, "celebs" have collected cameras, cars , and other objects and will probably continue to do so.

The late Peter Sellers would have been champing at the bit, waiting for his special M9! How long the appeal would have lasted - who knows? It used to be joked that every time he filled the ash-tray he would buy a replacement Rolls-Royce.

Not exactly a capital offence?

Cheers, Alistair

Just because they are wealthy enough to purchase a 20k camera in no way makes such clientele vulgar, criminal or pimps. Just because you are poorer doesn't make you sophisticated or superior in anyway.

You don't like the Leica camera or don't have the money for it? then don't buy it. But let others do what they please with their own money. Refraining from purchase is fine, slandering is not appropriate.

SheikYerbouti said:

prefers a clientèle of vulgar money people .... a clientèle that consists almost entirely of collectors, football players, Russian oligarchs, pimps and other criminals, does great harm to the reputation of a brand name.

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That is certainly a jaded view of it.

My cousin was a minority owner in a company. The company grew and another company approached them in buying it. The buyout made him an instant multimillionaire. But this was at the cost of working 7 day weeks quite routinely for 10 years of growing the business. He made a honest buck and can now go spend it on what he likes. When you have millions, a special addition Leica is expensive, but it certainly is within their means if they want to purchase it.

SheikYerbouti said:

This is obscene. It seems Leica no longer cares for serious photographers but prefers a clientèle of vulgar money people looking for status symbols. But as Rolex, Rolls Royce and others have found out in the past, a clientèle that consists almost entirely of collectors, football players, Russian oligarchs, pimps and other criminals, does great harm to the reputation of a brand name. I think it quite possible that at some point in the future any sincere photographer would cringe at the thought of being associated with Leica. Being seen with the red dot would be just too embarrassing ...

Click to expand...

Most of us have been guilty of snobery of some kind.

I understand your feelings and to a large extent agree with them. A digital camera is a tool, albeit a not a blunt instrument but a technically advanced and sophisticated one. You (and I) can console ourselfs that possibly most owners of status symbol cameras (or staus symbol anythings), can't produce the same high quality results that owners of modest equipment gear can - so they own a 'hollow' status symbol - something they can brag about at (say) dinner parties, but would have a limited knowledge of how to use, in a proficient way. The same thinking applies (as you mentioned) to many other types of products. I'll take the watch as an example. Many years ago I was with friends on an evening which happened to be a leap day. One wore a Rolex, the other a Breitling and I had a $30 Casio. My Casio beeped to tell me that it had been successfully adjusted to recognize the correct date. My friends, had to scramble to manually re-set their $$$$$ timepieces to the date change.

In an increasinlgly transparent and connected world, the gap between the super rich and ultra-poor appears to widen, and without getting philosophical on a camera forum,I find this disturbing. A friend of mine (not a snob) eventuaully died after a crash in his Porche (one of many hi-profile meams of transport he owned aged 34) I, at nearly 63 ,am contiuing to enjoy life with what I have. Thanks be to ....sence?

Andrew

All kinds of companies do over-the-top lunacies for this catalog. The point is that it's a ton of publicity for relatively little cost to them (compared to a full scale ad campaign). Are they going to sell a lot (or even one) of these? No, probably not. But it gets their name out to a lot of people who might not otherwise have Leica on their radar these days. (Does Leica make digital cameras now? I had no idea they were still in business, etc. etc.)

And the people who actually pay attention to that silly catalog are mostly not people who can afford anything in it, you know.

A camera may be a tool to you, but to a lot of people it isn't. If that's all it were those silly little P&S cameras in funky colors wouldn't be so popular. (And I might add, the folks here wouldn't have those silly debates about black vs. silver, either.)

But who was Neiman Marcus.