Is the 28/1.8 similar to the 85/1.8?

Well said, I couldn't say it better myself.

I don't care to argue back-n'-forth. I find it amusing that zealot will even twisted MATH to fit his argument. When I present the DOF calculated based on 10m away from the subject. He when about twisting math with weird 28/100 division. The truth is when I'm 10m away from my subject, I am 10m away from my subjects, no amount of wishful thinking is going to change that. He also post photo of of a lens taking near its MFD to throw background into defocus. Any lens can produce bokeh shooting near MFD, but again, where are this bokeh photo when they are taken 10m away?
What you can learn about these fora or anywhere else are simple things that validate some opinions or POV. For example, in terms of posts, you will find that some lenses have a lot of positive feedback by more than 2-3 dozen people. That alone shows you one indicator if the lens is good. Couple that with the same zeal through time, and you don't have to 2nd guess that lens. An example of that is the 70-200 f2.8L IS (mk-1). Another is the 17-40L, or 85 f1.8 usm (and 100 f2 usm). Another is the 35 1.4L Sure, you will see some detractors, but in essence, the ratio of those who don't like them vs those who do is small. That's a sure clue to you where that lens really stands. Even the 50 f1.8 mk-2, in spite of its poor construction is up there when it comes to optical performance. All opinions and even test confirm this.

Go to Fred Miranda site, and read the user lens review. You'll see a trend there and that is very accurate too. I bet you're going to find out that it basically matches the opinions here.

The other indicator is when a store stocks it. Or how often it goes out of stock. You'll see how popular some lenses can be. It's also not a popularity contest. Because at these prices, if the lenses are no good, even if they are cheap, they don't move off the shelves.

Looking at the 28 f1.8 usm, you should now have a clear picture of how it really stacks up. One can praise the lens, but without a doubt, the that lens is not as good as a sigma 30 f1.4 or a 35L or 24L. Very hard to argue about those. And there are sites w/c already reviewed and compared them with picture comparisons to boot! So, I can assure you, that the opinions rendered here, can be cross-matched with some pictures of the same subjects and that is a better way to know about a lens.

But if you want to be safe, since you seem to like wides and primes, go for the 24L. It will cost you more, but you will be happy with that. There's nothing worse than having bought a not so cheap (the 28 f1.8 usm is not cheap) and for a lens not to be stellar considering it is a prime. Remember, the 50 f1.8 is cheap but it is stellar. So is the 85 f1.8. Even the 35 f2.0, with all it's fault is very good. The 28mm is neither here nor there. So, if it were me, and I like a prime for my wides, I'd go for the 24L. Until they update that 28 f1.8 usm, it's one of those lenses that very few people like to own. And that is for a good reason. If it were so good, then the opinion would not be so divided. Unfortunately, that alone shows the true status of this lens. For me, that is not as clear as mud. That is as clear as it goes on sparkling spring water on a sunny day.

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  • Caterpillar
'Always in the process of changing, growing, and transforming.'
 
That is as clear as it goes on sparkling spring water on a sunny day.
Haha, awesome ending to a great post. Does it come with the $1000 required to cover the cost difference between the 28/1.8 and 24L? Seriously, I really appreciate your insight and it cements exactly how I feel about the 28/1.8. If it was $250, I'd be all over it. At $460... that's big money, maybe better spent towards a 5D or 24L or 35L.

One further question: do you really think the Sigma 30/1.4 is significantly better received than the 28/1.8? My take from reading perspectives of others is that IF the focus is correct, the Sigma can produce great images. But, in my book, that is a big IF, and knocks it down into the same territory as the 28/1.8 for me: big money, but not 85/1.8-esque stellar performance.
 
One further question: do you really think the Sigma 30/1.4 is significantly better received than the 28/1.8?
For those (of us) that manage to use it... for everyone else, complaints about the focus. Of course, the results matter, and as a small, cheap lens, it gave me years (and 10k+) of excellent pictures. Even the 85/1.8 is not as good.

And no, I wouldn't have paid a $1000 premium over the 28/1.8 just for the 24L on crop. At least, I can't imagine the 28/1.8 being that much worse ... the L being in the same ballpark as the 30/1.4 (just a huge hunk of glass in comparison).

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-CW

よしよし、今日も生きのいい魂が手に入ったな
 
That is as clear as it goes on sparkling spring water on a sunny day.
Haha, awesome ending to a great post. Does it come with the $1000 required to cover the cost difference between the 28/1.8 and 24L? Seriously, I really appreciate your insight and it cements exactly how I feel about the 28/1.8. If it was $250, I'd be all over it. At $460... that's big money, maybe better spent towards a 5D or 24L or 35L.
No, it does not come with the balance for you to get the 24L. But you can insist on the 28 f1.8 usm now and be done and over with. I won't convince you otherwise. It's your money. It's your happiness. But it seems that at U$400, the lens is suspect. So, I ask you, are you willing to risk U$400 to get the lens and find out the rude reality of it all? Or are you willing to take my word for it, Fred Miranda's reviews, and some other sites who have done tests with the lens?

I'll digress here and tell you my story. Most photographers dream of the 70-200 f2.8L IS. But it was and is so darn expensive especially the mk-2. So, I guess like you, I looked for options. I got the gist of all possible substitutes - 70-200 f2.8 non-IS, f4 non-IS, 75/70-300's IS, and later on the 70-200 f4L IS. I even considered the old 50-200 f3.5-4.5L. In the end, there are always compromises. The question is can you live with those compromises or work around them? And if you can't, how can I afford the 70-200 f2.8L IS or find a way to get it?

Now, mind you, I know it would take me 5-7 years to save up for it. So, I tried compromising with the 75-300 IS (that was the earlier and less sharp version prior to the 70-300 IS). It was limited, but I did enjoy it for its limitations and it gave me shots that I would not have had if I didn't have that FL. It served me well for 2 years. In time, the 70-300 IS came w/c was better. But I have been there already so I know that the original plan was still the one. But then came the 55-250 IS ef-s. Nice. Cheap for a temp unlike the 75-300 IS. So, I got that. I knew it would be limited like my first, but at least I know I have something to tide me over. Eventually I knew I would sell these interims and I did sell them. I might get the 55-200 later on again if only because it is light and good for travelling.

Then one day, an opportunity happened. Someobody is willing to trade his f2.8L IS for a 24-105L + cash. I went for it. It took 5 years and it finally happened! A couple of years passed and darn, they came out with a mk-2. But then again, my copy of the mk-1 is good already. So, I don't feel short or feel itchy to upgrade. I am happy and content.

The moral of that story is if the lens or gear you want is the one to do the job, don't compromise. It may be expensive, but if it is the lens, then it's the lens. Well, you can get something in the interim till you can get your dream lens. 2-5 years is a long time to be out of that FL you want. Now, if you think that the 28mm f1.8 usm is your dream lens, well, then you shouldn't be confused. Go for it! Nobody's pointing a gun in your head not to get it!

But since we all know that the 24L will beat it hands down, then obviously the 28mm isn't the best. IF 24-30mm is your favorite range, and you know you will use this often, and be happy in that range, then it just makes sense for you to get what will make you happy. It's not that complicated. If you cannot afford it now, wait. Save up for it. The 70-200 f2.8L IS was U$1,600 in it's heyday, and used it is U$1,400. A hefty sum for me. But eventually, I was able to get it. So can you if you get the 24L.
One further question: do you really think the Sigma 30/1.4 is significantly better received than the 28/1.8? My take from reading perspectives of others is that IF the focus is correct, the Sigma can produce great images. But, in my book, that is a big IF, and knocks it down into the same territory as the 28/1.8 for me: big money, but not 85/1.8-esque stellar performance.
I don't think if the sigma 30 f1.4 is better. I have seen at least 2 sites with matching pictures of the 28mm and the sigma and the sigma is miles ahead. You can google for those and I'm sure you'll find those sites. It's not a big IF as far as this one goes, unless those sites are messing around with their tests, w/c I doubt. But if there's anything wrong with the sigma is QC and AF issues. And that lens is for crop bodies not 35FF sensors.

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  • Caterpillar
'Always in the process of changing, growing, and transforming.'
 
I don't care to argue back-n'-forth. I find it amusing that zealot will even twisted MATH to fit his argument. When I present the DOF calculated based on 10m away from the subject. He when about twisting math with weird 28/100 division. The truth is when I'm 10m away from my subject, I am 10m away from my subjects, no amount of wishful thinking is going to change that. He also post photo of of a lens taking near its MFD to throw background into defocus. Any lens can produce bokeh shooting near MFD, but again, where are this bokeh photo when they are taken 10m away?
You are ignoring the fact that different focal lengths are useful for different things. Why would you be using the same focal length from the same distance? If you are 10m away from the subject, would you not switch lenses? What if you are 1m away, you going to keep using your 85mm?
 
Just buy one used on Ebay. If you don't like it, sell it for the same price you bought it. You're out about 6-8 bucks in Ebay fees.

If you do like it, then you have a lens you like!

Or for convenience's sake, you could rent one.

Question: with all the talk about the optical quality of this lens, can I assume you'll be doing some heavy pixel peeping?

By the way--I own a 28mm 1.8. I don't own the 85, but I do own the 50 1.4.

I love my 28mm--it gets me the shots I need.
 
Use DPR's own DOF Calculator:
  • 1. 80mm f/1.8 = 0.285 m total DOF winner
  • 2. 50mm f/1.8 = 0.738 m total DOF
  • 3. 50mm f/2.8 = 1.157 m total DOF
  • 4. 28mm f/1.8 = 2.489 m total DOF big increase in DOF
...yeah, but um...it's a wider lens. You're not taking the same photos at 28 that you are at 85.

I do understand what you're saying--but some people (me) need it to take pictures in low light (for me, it's TV/movie sets), not for ultra-thin depth of field.
 
Just buy one used on Ebay. If you don't like it, sell it for the same price you bought it. You're out about 6-8 bucks in Ebay fees.
While I agree with you, it must have been 10 years since you sold on ebay. a $400 lens would run about 10% total feels including the paypal payment they force you to accept. So I would say it would be closer to $40 in fees + the shipping you paid to receive it. $50 is a cheap long term rental, though.
 
I agree with the others. You'll find the IQ fine till you compare it to good lenses, like the 85/1.8 or a decent L.

 
Just buy one used on Ebay. If you don't like it, sell it for the same price you bought it. You're out about 6-8 bucks in Ebay fees.

If you do like it, then you have a lens you like!

Or for convenience's sake, you could rent one.

Question: with all the talk about the optical quality of this lens, can I assume you'll be doing some heavy pixel peeping?
Even without pixel peeping, the lens is good. But so is my 17-50 f2.8 tamron, or 24-105L at the same aperture and FL. And that is the rub with this lens. It does not wow me. It may for you, but not for me. Sure, it is sharp, but so are the zooms and they even have better contrast, and resist flare better (due to modern coatings and baffles).

At f1.8-2.0 it isn't stellar. It's ok. And that's that if you want f1.8 and f2.0. Use it for those because that's the only lens except the Sigma 30 f1.4 that can give you those apertures. But the sigma won't work with 35FF sensors.
By the way--I own a 28mm 1.8. I don't own the 85, but I do own the 50 1.4.

I love my 28mm--it gets me the shots I need.
That's what I did. Not at ebay, but someone who owns it sold it to me really very cheap (the price of used kit lens). So, it was no harm for me to try it and give it a shot. Gave it a shot for 1.5 years. It was good. but then again, it rarely gave me a wow that my other lenses did. Even my 50 f1.8 mk2 can wow me. My 50 f1.4 usm wowed me. My 70-200 f2.8L IS wowed me. My 100 f2 usm wowed me. My 24-105L wowed me. My 10-22 wowed me. My 55-250 wowed me. Only this lens does not. It was very good and good. But it never made me pause to stop and say, "darn, that's a nice shot!" It was ordinary.

So, in the end I sold it and even made profit off it. I recommend the OP, as you also suggested, find a used copy and go from there. If it does not pan out, at least he's not out and lose too much in the process. If it works for him, well, he still has managed to save a hefty chunk of cash.

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  • Caterpillar
'Always in the process of changing, growing, and transforming.'
 
My hyperbole gets me in trouble again!

Actually, it's been about 2 hours since I've sold on Ebay. A $455.00 item did, in fact, net me a final value fee of $28.00

BUT STILL--like you said, look at it as a rental fee if you don't like the lens.
Just buy one used on Ebay. If you don't like it, sell it for the same price you bought it. You're out about 6-8 bucks in Ebay fees.
While I agree with you, it must have been 10 years since you sold on ebay. a $400 lens would run about 10% total feels including the paypal payment they force you to accept. So I would say it would be closer to $40 in fees + the shipping you paid to receive it. $50 is a cheap long term rental, though.
 
Just buy one used on Ebay. If you don't like it, sell it for the same price you bought it. You're out about 6-8 bucks in Ebay fees.

If you do like it, then you have a lens you like!

Or for convenience's sake, you could rent one.

Question: with all the talk about the optical quality of this lens, can I assume you'll be doing some heavy pixel peeping?
Even without pixel peeping, the lens is good. But so is my 17-50 f2.8 tamron, or 24-105L at the same aperture and FL. And that is the rub with this lens. It does not wow me. It may for you, but not for me. Sure, it is sharp, but so are the zooms and they even have better contrast, and resist flare better (due to modern coatings and baffles).
I have the 17-50 Tamron too! I like it. Incidentally, it's for sale on Ebay right now because there's a piece of gear it doesn't work with (a Jacobson Sound Blimp).
At f1.8-2.0 it isn't stellar. It's ok. And that's that if you want f1.8 and f2.0. Use it for those because that's the only lens except the Sigma 30 f1.4 that can give you those apertures. But the sigma won't work with 35FF sensors.
By the way--I own a 28mm 1.8. I don't own the 85, but I do own the 50 1.4.

I love my 28mm--it gets me the shots I need.
That's what I did. Not at ebay, but someone who owns it sold it to me really very cheap (the price of used kit lens). So, it was no harm for me to try it and give it a shot. Gave it a shot for 1.5 years. It was good. but then again, it rarely gave me a wow that my other lenses did. Even my 50 f1.8 mk2 can wow me. My 50 f1.4 usm wowed me. My 70-200 f2.8L IS wowed me. My 100 f2 usm wowed me. My 24-105L wowed me. My 10-22 wowed me. My 55-250 wowed me. Only this lens does not. It was very good and good. But it never made me pause to stop and say, "darn, that's a nice shot!" It was ordinary.
I don't necessarily disagree with you on any of your above points. However, I don't know what the OP is shooting, or what conditions he is shooting under, but I CAN say that the 28mm gets me shots that none of the above mentioned lenses couldn't--but then again, I shoot under very specific conditions on cramped movie sets.
So, in the end I sold it and even made profit off it. I recommend the OP, as you also suggested, find a used copy and go from there. If it does not pan out, at least he's not out and lose too much in the process. If it works for him, well, he still has managed to save a hefty chunk of cash.

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  • Caterpillar
'Always in the process of changing, growing, and transforming.'
 

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