finally the voice of reason... Canon EVIL-ish

From Canon Rumors...

Masaya Maeda spills the beans

Canon’s head of their Image Communications Products has told Reuters that Canon is working on an EVIL/Small DSLR camera.

Maeda also said the company was working on a smaller version of its upmarket single-lens reflex (SLR) cameras in a bid to compete with the new breed of mid-range so-called “mirrorless” cameras launched by Sony Corp, Olympus Corp, and Panasonic Corp.

Maeda went a few steps further.

“It’s not a question of whether or not you have a mirror. There is a consumer need for good-quality cameras to be made smaller,” Maeda said. “We will meet this need.”

No time table was mentioned.

http://www.canonrumors.com/2010/07/canon-evil-on-the-way-cr3/

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Still waiting for the Canon FF/APS compact...

Hopefully Canon already has it for release this August – September. I can’t see Canon waiting next year to bring these to market. Nikon also released information that they will be releasing one or two soon. Canon can’t allow itself to fall behind but you can never tell what they will really do – sales are the important issue.

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NewYorkEd



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I'm not sure if a small DSLR would meet the customers needs. I don't think that Canon could reach eg. the Sony NEX formfactor with a mirror, providing a APS-C sensor too.

And nobody would like to have smaller sensors, what could shrink the DSLR's size.

I am so close to buying a Nex-5 now after trying one at the weekend and being very impressd but I am hanging on for as long as I can for whatever canon are brining out. I don't want a small dslr I want a compact that takes my ef primes whilst being discreet in the body when travelling around. Worst case Nex-5 and adapter but I am really hoping Canon don't disappoint on this. One thing I think is by coming along last to the Evil type cam they have had time to gauge what people want and need from these little marvels. If canon don't deliver what I need I am also interested in what Nikon will be offering. The micro 4/3 cams are great but there is still too much high iso noise for what I am wanting.

Bengdogg said:

I am so close to buying a Nex-5 now after trying one at the weekend and being very impressd but I am hanging on for as long as I can for whatever canon are brining out. I don't want a small dslr I want a compact that takes my ef primes whilst being discreet in the body when travelling around.

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I agree ... 100%.

I cancelled my NEX-5 order, not because I don't like the camera any more, but the delivery date was too late for me. So I can wait for Photokina and see what competitors will show.

My dream camera would be a NEXish Canon that is in some aspects better than the NEX (menu, flash) and compatible to my Canon lenses and my flashes.

JakobH said:

My dream camera would be a NEXish Canon that is in some aspects better than the NEX (menu, flash) and compatible to my Canon lenses and my flashes.

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Now your talking!

=)
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The only reason the current 4/3 cameras have high ISO noise is that the sensors are made by Panasonic.

Panasonic has never been able to make a low noise sensor. Panasonic and Olympus have done a pretty good job trying to contol the noise but you're right, it's still there.

Even the small sensor S90 produces less noise, at ISO 800 and below, than the current micro four thirds cameras.

Because of sensor size, the micro four thirds cameras are better at ISO 1600 than the S90 but pictures will still need to be run through a noise reduction program.

this and previous rumors/leaks suggest this is in development and will not see release before 2011. not a matter of waiting but having something ready to market. yes, canon has indeed fallen behind on this one, and it appears even nikon will have their version released before canon does.

NewYorkEd said:

Hopefully Canon already has it for release this August – September. I can’t see Canon waiting next year to bring these to market. Nikon also released information that they will be releasing one or two soon. Canon can’t allow itself to fall behind but you can never tell what they will really do – sales are the important issue.

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i have my doubts as well. i also wonder how it could possibly be price competitive.

smaller sensor? maybe, but then there will be yet another proprietary mount. but a least this way it can be canon-to-canon, then later third party canon-to-whatever.

either way, i am very interested in what canon comes up with.

JakobH said:

I'm not sure if a small DSLR would meet the customers needs. I don't think that Canon could reach eg. the Sony NEX formfactor with a mirror, providing a APS-C sensor too.

And nobody would like to have smaller sensors, what could shrink the DSLR's size.

Click to expand...

They can certainly make a mirror in a compact. Anybody ever have an original Olympus pen F or a pentax 110 slr? Both very small and both had mirrors and associated optical viewfinders.

neither were a full 35mm.

RAL said:

They can certainly make a mirror in a compact. Anybody ever have an original Olympus pen F or a pentax 110 slr? Both very small and both had mirrors and associated optical viewfinders.

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Nobody is talking about full frame 35mm. Original Olympus Pen was 18x24mm, that's a bit larger than APS-C and two bits larger than 4/3. The Pentax 110 SLR had a format of 13x17mm and that is much more than the tiny sensors in compact cameras.

sneakerpimp said:

RAL said:

They can certainly make a mirror in a compact. Anybody ever have an original Olympus pen F or a pentax 110 slr? Both very small and both had mirrors and associated optical viewfinders.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

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if not too late.

The most relevant story came from the DSLR movie guru Philip Bloom. He told that when the designer of the 5D II sensor saw the movies that Bloom had shot with that camera, the japanese engineer started to cry. The poor guy hadn't realized what his own creation was capable of.

In other words, Canon does not understand their own products nor their market any more. They don't understand that still photographs are a media for paper, not iPads or computer screens. When paper goes, it takes stills with it.

In the very near future there will be little use for enormous still pic files, enormous resolution or enormous cameras. There will be a lot of use for videos, sound and yes, occasional still picture when it can display some point better than a moving picture.

So the future belongs to cameras that can capture moving reality and display it in multimedia files that have good enough image quality for an electronic screen.

When Canon says that they will stick with mirrors in order to maintain higher still image quality, they are making a big mistake.

Regards,

Ravalls

The mirrorless cameras show that the removal of the mirror creates a much, much smaller camera. I have always said that if a relatively tiny company like Sigma can put an APS-C sensor in the DPx cameras, then Canon can surely put one in a compact the size of the G10. Easily.

Imagine that: a large sensor compact the size of the G10/G11, with image quality like the 400/450/500D. Canon can do it. They already have the technology and experience. They are just not thinking about the market, or are too worried about losing sales of their entry level DSLR's. If Canon are doing this to compete with the mirrorless cameras, then they must think they are losing those entry level sales already.

The introduction of mirrorless cameras now makes it more difficult for companies with mature DSLR and lens lines to feed people into that area. The only choices for cameras used to be small sensor compacts, prosumer zooms and DSLR's. Buying even the most basic entry level DSLR usually wedded a person to that brand, funneling them into that company's upgrade path and lens line. But with the new option of mirrorless cameras, people have an alternative which would not necessarily lead them into the bigger and potentially more lucrative product lines.

Perhaps this is why Canon want to make smaller DSLR's, rather than another type of camera altogether. Assuming that it would accept EF/EF-S lenses, it would still give Canon the chance to snag people into their upgrade path, and at less cost than developing a new lens mount and lens line.
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I understand Canon is not rushing with EVIL to the market, they have cornered the small DSLR market with Nikon, why would they be interested in killing their own golden goose? First top 10 camera selling almost everywhere are either C or N, no wonder they taking small steps. Let's assume Canon will come up with killer EVIL with APS-C sensor. First how much they should sell it for? Less then 550D, between 550D and 7D, more then 7D? Any price would be either killing 550D or 7D or they wouldn't sell enough to make it worthwhile. Also what lenses are they gonna to make for those camera? Full lineup like EF and EF-S series? I believe (read:hope) they will come up with larger sensor (APS-H, while moving D series to FF sensor), premium price and some sort of adapter to use existing lenses, while introducing new line for EVIL. EVIL Canon in 1700-2200 range with APS-H sensor with choice of OVF/EVF and adapter for EF lenses would be their best entry in my opinion. They would still keep their cameras separated (something Canon is obsessed with), enter the market with only few lenses and keep their customer base happy. Anything else would seriously jeopardized their profit from Rebel/XD line. But that's only my couple pennies on it, as I am usually wrong during my wishful thinking

I think the obvious solution is to make the camera more expensive than the entry level dSLR.

Kind of a high end elitist large-sensor compact.

Then it does not eat into low end dSLR sales. It is more of a companion to the 1D and 5D users.

Price it at or above the 7D. Make the build quality more like the 1D. Then I don't really see any interference with their existing line-up.

It's what I've been yearning for all along.

However, if they release some feature crippled plastic mini dSLR... that's not gonna fly.
Will be buying a Nikon or Panasonic for the first time in my life.
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Still waiting for the Canon FF/APS compact...

Thanks for the explanation. My point exactly. We were not talking about full frame 24x36mm here I didn't think.

I was so exited by the sony nex on paper and so disappointed by it's image quality, that I can't wait to see what canon will come up with.
if it is going to look like this manipulated, I guess, picture



is not going to be as cool as the nex, but hopefully the IQ will be much better.