Canon must make mirrorless camera or else it's compacts will be 2nd tier

antoineb said:

I fully agree with you that the SLR design is obsolete and all manufacturers need to go mirrorless interchangeable lens camera.

This being said I've played with the existing offering (mostly m43) and the fact is that a good compact w a 5x zoom range (not to mention a 10x zoom range) is still much more convenient and focuses just as fast. And the video is just as good but it has motorized zoom to boot.

So I agree with you on mirrorless but I for one am not, not buying a compact, because of a mirrorless camera.

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So why are you buying a mirrorless camera ? because it offers good IQ and performance in a small and light body, I suppose ? Am I wrong ?

If I'm right, then : MFT system cameras are lighter and smaller because they are mirrorless : since they don't have the Pentaprism needed for the VF, they are lighter and smaller; since the flange distance between the rear of the lense and the sensor can be much smaller and thus you can make smaller lenses and smaller bodies, so the whole system becomes smaller and lighter.. in the end, MFT cameras are smaller because they are mirrorless. Just think to the FT format : the bodies and lenses had to be bigger to accomodate the mirror and these cameras were not taking the full advantage of the smaller sensor.
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rrr_hhh

ELTY4 said:

The Micro 4/3 cameras must be seriously hurting the Canon compact sales especially the G11 type. Advanced photographers looking for a quality compact to replace the DSLR have been buying the micro 4/3s.

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EVIL cameras are taking dSLR sales because EVIL cameras, with lenses, are larger than what most people want in a P&S camera - small. You mention "quality compact" yet EVIL cameras are hardly compact when compared to a camera such as the s90 or even Canon's SD lines that are quite small with good IQ.

Try putting a NEX-3 with 18-55 lens in your pocket! lol, that camera with lens is huge compared to a typical P&S camera of today!

RedFox88 said:

EVIL cameras are taking dSLR sales because EVIL cameras, with lenses, are larger than what most people want in a P&S camera - small. You mention "quality compact" yet EVIL cameras are hardly compact when compared to a camera such as the s90 or even Canon's SD lines that are quite small with good IQ.

Try putting a NEX-3 with 18-55 lens in your pocket! lol, that camera with lens is huge compared to a typical P&S camera of today!

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. . . The reality is that the majority of m4/3 buyers ARE p&s upgraders who want something better but aren't interested in a DSLR. It doesn't matter that a m4/3 camera with a standard kit zoom is larger than a S90 and can't fit in your pants pocket. What does matter is that it's still smaller and much lighter than an equivalent DSLR & standard kit lens. The form factor of the PENs and GF1 are more familiar to upgraders as well which is a big attraction compared to the intimidating to some 'complexity' of a DSLR.

. . . It doesn't matter whether everyone understands this here at DPR. Out in the real world of brick and mortar retail sales, it's what's happening. Just look at the recently introduced EPL-1. Its got p&s upgrade written all over it. DPR's review says it too. DSLR users might like it as well but that isn't its intended market at Olympus. Sony is going after the same buyers but the larger lenses with its APS-C sensor is going to make it a hard sell in my opinion.

E lectronic V iewfinder I nterchangeable L ens cameras have an electronic viewfinder. These cameras are like the Panasonic G1 and G2. The Olympus Pen cameras are not EVIL because they do not come with a viewfinder of any kind. All they include is a rear LCD. If you want a real electronic viewfinder, you have to pay another $250US.

How about a new designation...

S mall B ody B ig S ensor... I don't care what kind of viewfinder it has or has not.

C'mon Canon... just make it!!!

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Still waiting for the Canon FF/APS compact...

Cedarhill said:

E lectronic V iewfinder I nterchangeable L ens cameras have an electronic viewfinder. These cameras are like the Panasonic G1 and G2. The Olympus Pen cameras are not EVIL because they do not come with a viewfinder of any kind. All they include is a rear LCD. If you want a real electronic viewfinder, you have to pay another $250US.

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. . . Correct usage of EVIL has evolved to an all-inclusive term for live view only compact cameras with large sensors. The LCD itself can be described as a viewfinder if you want to really start splitting hairs.

BTW . . . I just ordered the Panasonic LVF-1 external viewfinder for my GF1 a few days ago from Amazon for $132 and with free shipping!

Graystar said:

Anchor72 said:

Canon could recapture more lost sales right in an easier way.

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WHAT LOST SALES???

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I think that was pretty clearly stated. The SX210 is selling way behind other cameras in its class such as the ZS7 and HX5V. I don't usually agree with Anchor72 but on this point, I do agree. Canon has missed the mark within that class numerous times now. I certainly don't think they're starving though as they are still a leader in higher end cams, but they would certainly benefit from paying attention to the competition and releasing something more appealing to the average consumer traveler.

If the original meaning of the acronym has been corrupted then that is truly unfortunate. The presence of a real viewfinder, or at least the availability of one as an extra cost option, is of vital importance to me and a lot of other people. There needs to be a term to describe such cameras.

Cedarhill said:

If the original meaning of the acronym has been corrupted then that is truly unfortunate. The presence of a real viewfinder, or at least the availability of one as an extra cost option, is of vital importance to me and a lot of other people. There needs to be a term to describe such cameras.

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For me, a LCD live view image is equivalent to an EVF. Unlike some other people, I don't have a problem with cameras lacking a 'real' viewfinder, electronic or optical. I would gladly trade the lack of one for the reduce cost and size.

Well, I have a Canon G9 that has a nearly useless optical viewfinder. I use the LCD on it almost exclusively, but it isn't my preference. There are a lot of people who feel like you do but there are also a lot of people who feel otherwise. For those who started out with a P&S, the LCD is what they are accustomed to. I started out with a waste level TLR and eventually went to SLRs. I don't like having to hold the camera out in front of me because the posture is unstable compared to either pressing a camera against the face or holding it at waste level. I am also not fond of the unavoidable glare on the LCD in bright sunshine.

I'd trade the lcd on the back for a good optical viewfinder. Where do we go to make these trades. I would need something to let me change settings somehow though. I got along just fine for 40 years or so without an lcd on the back of my camera.