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5DII vs 40D Testing Low ISO Banding.
- Thread starter enfi
- Start date
Vibrio
Senior Member
so true
Enter the strange concept known as "people who don't know how to take photographs" ... If we knew how to expose and use software properly we would not be complaining about such rubbish
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John
enfi
Well-known member
Hey...I'm not stupid, of course I will never push fill shadows a 100% in my normal shooting...like I said:
"...This is something that I would do normally, but I wanted to exaggerate the results in order to be able to tell the difference between the two cameras...."
Read the post first
However I do sometimes push fill shadows to 50 % in certain situations, where is purposely underexposed to avoid blown highlights. I have noticed that in those situations (although not this extreme, of course... this was just a test) my new camera was showing some noise and artifacts, I'm just trying to find out if there was something wrong with my model or not.
Enzo Figueres
http://flickr.com/photos/efigueres/sets/721576024179324
59/
"...This is something that I would do normally, but I wanted to exaggerate the results in order to be able to tell the difference between the two cameras...."
Read the post first
However I do sometimes push fill shadows to 50 % in certain situations, where is purposely underexposed to avoid blown highlights. I have noticed that in those situations (although not this extreme, of course... this was just a test) my new camera was showing some noise and artifacts, I'm just trying to find out if there was something wrong with my model or not.
--Enter the strange concept known as "people who don't know how to take photographs" ... If we knew how to expose and use software properly we would not be complaining about such rubbish
--
John
Enzo Figueres
http://flickr.com/photos/efigueres/sets/721576024179324
59/
JackM
Veteran Member
Enfi, read it again! You said "This is something that I would do normally" !!!!!!
And then you quoted yourself saying it again!
enfi
Well-known member
Sorry, my apologies!, I meant to say " I wouldn't "
English is not my native language, apologies to all
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Enzo Figueres
http://flickr.com/photos/efigueres/sets/721576024179324
59/
English is not my native language, apologies to all
--
Enzo Figueres
http://flickr.com/photos/efigueres/sets/721576024179324
59/
John Sheehy
Forum Pro
Nonsense. Banding makes shadows far worse than they would otherwise be, especially if the image is to be displayed at a small size, because banding does not integrate as well as 2-D random noise.From everything I've seen, these patterns only show up when the noise is so bad that the image is already ruined. You have to face it - some shots are so poorly executed that nothing/nobody/nowhere/nohow can make them right. Of course, that doesn't mean the operator won't complain.
--
John
John Sheehy
Forum Pro
Well, the inside of lens caps should be black. If you see something there, other than the occasional "lucky" or flourescent photon, something is wrong.Great idea
and then we can all shoot the inside of our lens caps and push the shots to 18% gray and complain about it.
It is unrealistic to expect nothing wrong at this point in progress, but this level of banding is more akin to negligence than it is to necessity.
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John
bronxbombers
Forum Pro
the 40D was part of the 1Ds3,1D3,40D generation where canon had low ISO banding under perhaps the best control it ever has
the 5D2 is part of the 5D2,50D generation where canon had the worst control of low ISO banding
because of this, the 5D2 effectively gives back most to all of it's low iso DR advantage over the 40D, at least with many copies. there are ways to process that make it not rear up as easily in ACR. I use a hyper low contrast custom profile (while the default for ACR had a pretty high contrast default for the darks, at least pre-ACR v6 which id dint check out yet)
the 5D2 is part of the 5D2,50D generation where canon had the worst control of low ISO banding
because of this, the 5D2 effectively gives back most to all of it's low iso DR advantage over the 40D, at least with many copies. there are ways to process that make it not rear up as easily in ACR. I use a hyper low contrast custom profile (while the default for ACR had a pretty high contrast default for the darks, at least pre-ACR v6 which id dint check out yet)
bronxbombers
Forum Pro
it shows up whenever you need to shoot a scene that has very high dynamic range and contains certain colors/certain lighting temperatureFrom everything I've seen, these patterns only show up when the noise is so bad that the image is already ruined. You have to face it - some shots are so poorly executed that nothing/nobody/nowhere/nohow can make them right. Of course, that doesn't mean the operator won't complain.
it definitely can show up under entirely legit cicumstances, although there are certainly plenty of shots for which it won't matter at all
one thing to keep in mind, i've seen some people cry that they miss the DR of film and then turn around and say that pattern banding in low iso is a non-problem, can't haveit both ways, either you don't really care about extreme DR or you do (not saying this applies to you, although judging by your handle I wonder if you are one of said people haha)
This is worrying.
I am new and moved from 40D too.
How come cheaper camera has better image quality
I am new and moved from 40D too.
How come cheaper camera has better image quality
I read a lot in this forum about the low ISO banding issue with the 5D Mark II. I also noticed myself some banding when bumping up the brightness of underexposed areas in some of my pictures….that’s why I decided to test this camera against my old 40D.
For this test I took a two stops underexposed images and I increased the fill light option in Lightroom (3 Beta) to 100 %. This is something that I would do normally, but I wanted to exaggerate the results in order to be able to tell the difference between the two cameras
In this case the 5DII is showing much more banding and chroma noise than my 40D, after the “torture test”. I have to say that I find this rather disappointing because although I never do this normally I sometimes have to bump up the brightness of shadow areas in order to increase dynamic range and although this adjustments are not that extreme I have noticed some unpleasant banding when doing this.
First:
Canon 40D
Full Image:
100 % crops:
Second
Canon 5D Mark II
Full Image:
100% crops
I wonder if this is “normal” or if there is something wrong with mu camera and I should send it to repair
I’m using firmware 2.0.7 in the 5DII
--
Enzo Figueres
http://www.flickr.com/photos/efigueres/sets/72157602417932459/
59/
Yeah, we all know about this.I agree 100%, no more needs to be said, we all know it is an issue, we just need to wait until Canon steps to the plateI don't know about him.
But I've used and compared 5D2 to 40D.
Low iso banding is a trade-mark of 5D mark II
Canon should do something about this
mark 3 ????
Come on Canon, do something, are you dumb ?
Fingers cross
Bleguk Banget
Well-known member
I have tested 7D too, beside 5DII and 40D.
And 7D has banding too.
But 40D doesn't have it.
Strange
And 7D has banding too.
But 40D doesn't have it.
Strange
I read a lot in this forum about the low ISO banding issue with the 5D Mark II. I also noticed myself some banding when bumping up the brightness of underexposed areas in some of my pictures….that’s why I decided to test this camera against my old 40D.
For this test I took a two stops underexposed images and I increased the fill light option in Lightroom (3 Beta) to 100 %. This is something that I would do normally, but I wanted to exaggerate the results in order to be able to tell the difference between the two cameras
In this case the 5DII is showing much more banding and chroma noise than my 40D, after the “torture test”. I have to say that I find this rather disappointing because although I never do this normally I sometimes have to bump up the brightness of shadow areas in order to increase dynamic range and although this adjustments are not that extreme I have noticed some unpleasant banding when doing this.
First:
Canon 40D
Full Image:
100 % crops:
Second
Canon 5D Mark II
Full Image:
100% crops
I wonder if this is “normal” or if there is something wrong with mu camera and I should send it to repair
I’m using firmware 2.0.7 in the 5DII
--
Enzo Figueres
http://www.flickr.com/photos/efigueres/sets/72157602417932459/
59/
landmarks4711589173
Leading Member
This is not the first time I see people comparing 5D2 to other cameras and in particular to 40D.
And the results were consistent, 5D2 has banding at low iso,
which is the most important iso for anything,
especially for landscape photographers.
bronxbombers
Forum Pro
don't worry too much, overall the 5D2 has much better image qualityThis is worrying.
I am new and moved from 40D too.
How come cheaper camera has better image quality
the only thing is don't expect a huge INCREASE in DR at low ISO like you would expect, the effective DR is probably only about equal to the 40D, maybe a small bit worse (the 40D has worse SNR in shadows though which is what evens things up, if not, then the 40D definitely would have better low ISO DR)
bronxbombers
Forum Pro
yeah the 40D,1D3,1Ds3 basically have the least low iso banding of all the canon models
the 7D does pretty well in terms of high iso banding though
(of course keep in mind the SNR of the 40D is lower than the 5D2 so that even things out a lot at low ISO)
landmarks4711589173
Leading Member
I shoot low iso 90% of the time.
I have used 5D2.
landmarks4711589173
Leading Member
What's from 40D comparison test?
The point is, 5D2 is not in accordance with Canon standard of dynamic range and quality.
And even the 5D2 dynamic range is LESS than what Advertised by Canon,
because the banding ruined the shadows area.
landmarks4711589173
Leading Member
I have tested it on Passport Photo size print, I can not see the banding
John Sheehy
Forum Pro
Actually, if your exposure is dark enough, a passport-sized photo brightened to subject visibility will be almost all banding, with almost no random noise, and a relatively weak signal. Banding does not integrate/dissolve with small image display, like random 2-D noise does.
--
John
landmarks4711589173
Leading Member
I saw you have proven what you said here
I think we are at the same boat, waiting for Canon to fix these iso 100 bandings
thank's John
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John
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