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Cougar1320

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Using a K100 at the moment. It is going to be upgrade time for me soon. AF is a big deal for me.

Will I see a good improvement in AF speed when I upgrade. I'm at the point where I need to decide to commit to Pentax or start looking at Cannon or Nikon.
 
Even the K10D can feel more reliable and faster in terms of AF than the K100D, but the K100D is very battery sensitive. You get the best AF performance with it if you use CR-V3 batteries or AA lithiums instead of AA NiHms.

The K-7 is even better so if you seek the best in terms of Pentax AF, then the K-7 is the way to go. However, the K-x is also better than the K100D (and faster than K10D and K20D) quite similar to the K-7 in daylight and in medium light. The K-7 has higher accuracy in tungsten light thank's to colour sensitive sensor, and with heavy big glass with screwdriven AF it is also better, but with standard zooms the K-x is fast and cheerful even in continous AF.

--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
 
Not the response I expected at all. What are some of the differences between the K20 and K7. It has been a while since I've really gone through this forum, but I thought that the K7 has been around for quite sometime. However, on a quick search I just found out it does have a live feed. Also, I exclusively use Energizer Lithiums in my K100 as my camera is used almost exclusively for work (they comp me for batteries). I've done some pretty extensive work researching K20's, but at a glance what are some of the differences between the two bodies?
 
The K-7 was introduced last summer. The K20D entered the market in spring 2008. K20D is the old body, K-7 the new. :)
K-7 has all the things the K20D have - plus:
  • Colour sensitive AF, which means higher accuracy in tungsten light.
  • Improved AF algorithms, makes for speedier AF.
  • Separate green AF assist beam (K20D uses the flash for AF assist, like the K100D).
  • 100% viewfinder (K20D has 95%)
  • Faster continous shooting, up to 5.2 fps (K20D does 3 fps)
  • 77 multisegment metering instead of 16 segment in the K20D (and K100D). This improved metering also gives more reliable flash exposures, since flash uses this metering.
  • Improved auto white balance with adjustable tungsten correction (strong, weak or none).
  • Improved HDR function, now it really can take 3 images and combine them to one.
  • More adjustable highlight and shadow correcton.
  • Distorsion and CA correction in camera (note, this takes processing power so it slows down shot-to-shot performance).
  • Improved LiveView function.
  • Video recording (HD compatible) with stereo sound, can also record via external microphone.
  • Cold protected weather sealing, works in lower temperatures than the K20D.
  • Improved back LCD, larger with more pixels and better readabilitiy in bright light.
  • More compact design.
  • Full magnesium alloy body (K20D is aluminium chassi with plastic outside).
Well, that was the most important parts...

As an alternative, I strongly recommend the Pentax K-x which I have myself.

It has the same AF algorithms as the K-7 so it is indeed faster and more reliable in low light than the K100D. Same excellent auto white balance and much of the same menu system with image tones etc. Not separate AF assist.

It uses the same AA batteries as the K100D (K-7 has special type). It was voted best entry level DSLR by TIPA this year. Excellent image quality, especially at high ISO up to 6400 perfectly usable. Compact and cheerful.
Not weather sealed, more menu driven and with same viewfinder as you have today.
But, lower price than the K-7.

--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
 
I'm confident that you will see more K20D supporters come online. There's a lot to like about a K20D if you can find one at a good price:

1. Its got a nifty AF adjustment procedure for up to 20 lenses, just like the D300 and K7.

2. One can use the AF adjustment procedures to adjust for the tungsten light for indoor work - i've done that.
3. It basically has the same high resolution sensor that the K7 has

4. When i upgraded from the K10 to the K20, the improvement in AF response and improved resolution was like "WOW" What a difference.

5. I rarely have problems with K20D AF locking a focus. I shoot a lot of night pictures, walking around the city streets and across bridges to get some gritty shots. Also do a lot of tripod work. Also am one of the designated photographers to shoot portraits and dress rehearsal publicty photos for a local playhouse. Recently shot Checkhov's Seagull play, side by side with a guy who had the latest Nikon D300s and i can tell you it has a louder shutter and all kinds of beeps going on that i could hear 20 feet away. His images right out of the camera were better than mine, but once i applied NR, I can't tell them apart. He did have a better technique, he just left the camera on at 3200 iso while i was trying to avoid 3200 iso and shoot at 1600 with my F2.8 zoom, which was faster than his. Since then, i've tried out the new LR Ver 3. Beta, and am convinced from my testing that it will let me shoot my K20 quite comfortably at 3200 ISO. So for the theatre work i need it to do, my $600 can keep up with a $2600 D300s. Talk about a bang for the buck.

6. I usually like Mabo's posts, but his comment about HDR being one of the advantages of the K7 over the K20 is dead wrong. The onboard HDR on the K7 is not something that any serious user of HDR would even look at twice. What the K20 and K7 have in common is the really great 5 shot and 3 shot automated bracketing that is needed for advanced HDR software. This automated bracketing is easily turned on by a dedicated button on the K20 and initiated only by One shutter click. Thats something that the majority of Canon and Nikon SLRs cannot do, except for their high end models. The Canon 7D, the Nikon D300 for example can do some of that, but too many SLRs are limited to only 3 shot bracketing which is not adequate for high contrast situations.

7. If you think that the K20D can't shoot pictures, do a search on the Paris fashion photographer benjikan on the Pentax Forums. For years he has shot with several K20 on hand and some backup k10's. he's probably has moved on to something else by now but he was master of stage lighting and dramatic photos.

8 Having said all that, if the only camera work i was going to do was theatre work, I'd probably buy the new Kx. Its high ISO capabilities to 6400 ISO really tempt me. It only has a 3 shot automated bracketing for HDR, but there's a technique one can use to squeeze 5 shots out of it.

Best wishes for your choice. Pentax is on a roll and has lot to offer. I can't believe the number of beautiful lenses I have squirrelled away in my closet. Most bought at very low cost compared to canikon equivalents.

--
Phil B
K20D, K10D
 
Camera Lens Rentals has a K7 for rent if there is no stores near you that stock Pentax bodies for you to try out.
http://www.cameralensrentals.com/category.asp?catid=16

I have a K100DS and a K20D. The auto focus of the K20D over the K100DS is better but not a whole lot IMO.

I've read of K7 and Kx users saying the auto focus of those models are a LOT better than the K20Ds auto focus but still lacks the tracking focus of the Nikon and Canon bodies.
 
Hello
Cougar1320 said:
Using a K100 at the moment. It is going to be upgrade time for me soon. AF is a big deal for me.
Click to expand...
The K20D is a pretty large improvement over the K100D - I made that switch in November of 2008 after having used the K100D Super for a little over a year. I used the K20D until March of this year when I bought a K-7.
Cougar1320 said:
Will I see a good improvement in AF speed when I upgrade.
Click to expand...
You will see an improvement. I saw as much improvement going from the K100D Super to the K20D as I did going from the K20D to the K-7. The screw drive is significantly 'stronger', and you will feel this as you focus it - it is faster and less noisy (though still noisy depending on the lens). The K20D is a moderate improvement in low-light focusing speed - when compared the K100D. The K20D is also a moderate improvement in AF-C speed. All in all - I found the AF more responsive, more accurate, and more decisive; firmware improvements seemed to 'refine' the AF and the screw drive is robust and reliable. I cannot speak for the merits of SDM (Pentax's sonic motor system).
Cougar1320 said:
I'm at the point where I need to decide to commit to Pentax or start looking at Cannon or Nikon.
Click to expand...
Keep glass in mind - even if you can't afford it now. If you really get into shooting and you save up later for a lens, you'll want to be able to buy what you want that fits your body (lens mount). Pentax has all the primes you could ever want - and some very good ones at that. It does have zooms, but doesn't offer the abundance, availability, or reliability that several other big-namers do. It does have in-body SR though - which you won't get with Canon or Nikon; very cool and applies to every lens you will ever use on that body.

Best of luck.

-Mouse

--

The Mouse Gallery
http://www.photobucket.com/andy_allen

'My boss just quit the job, says he's goin out to find the
blind spots and he'll do it ... the 3rd planet is sure
they're bein watched, by an eye in the sky that can't
be stopped - when ya get to the promised land ...
you're gonna shake the eyes hand.'
 
Thanks for all the responses. My current meager arsenal of lenses recently grew with the addition of the Pentax 50-200. I will probably mostly deal with zoom lenses, and I knew going in that my selection would be limited, but have heard great things of the 50-135, very likely a lens for me next year. I will still get use of the long side of the 200 lens where the 135 just won't cut it for those of you wondering while I'll be buying two lenses in that distance in just two years. I shoot action more or less exclusively which puts me in a small minority, but so far have not had any issues whatsoever with my gear (just errors in the operator from time to time). My fixed 50 is great once the sun begins to go down and my kit lens with my Super seems to perform just fine.

The main reason I am looking at a K20 atm is because there is an open box special at a local store for just 630 dollars, about 140 bucks above a KX. This year I'll probably buy either a K20 or K7 and will also get a back up in the form of a KX or similar model to replace my K100 Super.

Please keep the responses coming I appreciate all input!
 
I agree with the previous comments about the K20D being a bit of an upgrade from the K10D in terms of AF performance. I have both of those cameras, and that has been my experience. The price you mentioned for the K20D sounds very reasonable to me - I believe they're selling for higher than that on Amazon and eBay.

I am looking closely at upgrading to the K7 but am waiting for now. I know it's a step up from K20D in terms of AF speed and burst rate, but I would guess that for 95% of the shots you're likely to take, the AF on the K20D is fast enough.

Not to sidetrack your post too much but this is one of my recent posts if you care to take a look. All shot with K20D, DA 300 and handheld using continuous focus. Not professional, but hopefully gives you some perspective. There are plenty of other better shooters, such as Mousehill - you may want to check some of his posts - he's way out of my league, and I believe also shoots with K20D and K7.

Hope that helps.

Pete

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=35300771
 
Philnw2 said:
6. I usually like Mabo's posts, but his comment about HDR being one of the > advantages of the K7 over the K20 is dead wrong.
Click to expand...
The automatic HDR in the K-7 is basically a combination of the multiple exposure with auto bracketing. It takes 3 bracketed shots and combines them into one. On the K20D you have to combine them into the post processing software if you use auto bracketing, or you have to bracket manually if you use the function multiple exposure.

I don't see how this function can be a disadvantage to the K-7 vs the K20D.

You don't have to use it if you don't want to, and those that finds this helpful has another feature to play with - so what is so dead wrong with that? Why being so upset about a feature that you don't have to use if you don't want to? No one is forcing you.

It is like saying "No one serious about photography uses JPEG's so it is a disadvantage that the K-7 can do JPEG's".

--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
 
Based on what you've posted, Gordon (Flash1100) is probably the one you should check out. His motorcycle racing shots are probably the closest to what you're shooting (that I've seen here). I believe he shoots with either K20D or K7, and the Sigma 100-300.

I've attached one of his recent posts. You may want to send him a note - he can certainly give more insight for these type of shots than I can. He's very good.

Good luck,

Pete

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=35259160
Cougar1320 said:
Very impressive. I imagine if you can get that, I'll probably be okay. Just to give you an idea of what I normally shoot...
Click to expand...
 
Cougar1320 said:
Thanks for all the responses. My current meager arsenal of lenses recently grew with the addition of the Pentax 50-200. I will probably mostly deal with zoom lenses, and I knew going in that my selection would be limited, but have heard great things of the 50-135, very likely a lens for me next year. I will still get use of the long side of the 200 lens where the 135 just won't cut it for those of you wondering while I'll be buying two lenses in that distance in just two years. I shoot action more or less exclusively which puts me in a small minority, but so far have not had any issues whatsoever with my gear (just errors in the operator from time to time). My fixed 50 is great once the sun begins to go down and my kit lens with my Super seems to perform just fine.

The main reason I am looking at a K20 atm is because there is an open box special at a local store for just 630 dollars, about 140 bucks above a KX. This year I'll probably buy either a K20 or K7 and will also get a back up in the form of a KX or similar model to replace my K100 Super.

Please keep the responses coming I appreciate all input!
Click to expand...
Bear in mind that DA* 50-135 is one of the lens that has a very good IQ even compared to some primes but one of the slowest in term of Auto Focus.
If you're looking for speedy AF for long lens, look for other option.

I have this lens and my FA*80-200 is faster in AF but that one is with screw motor.

I owned K100D before and K20D now. I'd say, if you can afford it or wait a little longer until the end of this year and get the K-7 or whatever new camera will come up.

K20D is a lot of camera compared to K100D. Stronger motor to AF but still not a speed demon. Yes it's faster to lock focus but still not up to the new cameras like K-7 or K-x.

--
'SEE BEYOND WHAT YOU SEE'

'I will treasure every moment in my life!'
Herman
 
Cougar1320 said:
Using a K100 at the moment. It is going to be upgrade time for me soon. AF is a big deal for me.

Will I see a good improvement in AF speed when I upgrade. I'm at the point where I need to decide to commit to Pentax or start looking at Cannon or Nikon.
Click to expand...
--
Equipment list in profile.

Since you say that AF is a big deal, I would check out Nikon & Canon. However, I went from a K100 to the K10D and saw a nice improvement. Not so much when I went from the K10D to the K20D and there is debate about going from the K20D to the K7 as it basically still uses the same AF system. I have used the Canon 40D and with USM lenses and it's much faster than the K20D. If you don't have a large investment in Pentax lenses, now is the time to look around. There are many reasons to stay with Pentax whichconsitutes a long list and you can find those reasons on this forum. I would encourage you to do your homework before making a change which should include pricing out all of the lenses that you need along with those you might want down the road. Also, compare what it costs for IS lenses with Canon and VR lenses with Nikon versus using Pentax lenses on a body that has SR. Sometimes the economics wins out over what we perceive as being important. And lastly, go to shops and check out all your options.

Regards, Jim
 
Cougar1320 said:
Using a K100 at the moment. It is going to be upgrade time for me soon. AF is a big deal for me.

Will I see a good improvement in AF speed when I upgrade. I'm at the point where I need to decide to commit to Pentax or start looking at Cannon or Nikon.
Click to expand...
Since you say that AF is a big deal, I would check out Nikon & Canon. However, I went from a K100 to the K10D and saw a nice improvement. Not so much when I went from the K10D to the K20D and there is debate about going from the K20D to the K7 as it basically still uses the same AF system. I have used the Canon 40D and with USM lenses and it's much faster than the K20D. If you don't have a large investment in Pentax lenses, now is the time to look around. There are many reasons to stay with Pentax which consitutes a long list and you can find those reasons on this forum. I would encourage you to do your homework before making a change which should include pricing out all of the lenses that you need along with those you might want down the road. Also, compare what it costs for IS lenses with Canon and VR lenses with Nikon versus using Pentax lenses on a body that has SR. Sometimes the economics wins out over what we perceive as being important. And lastly, go to shops and check out all your options.

Regards. Jim

--
Equipment list in profile.
 
topgun2007 said:
Since you say that AF is a big deal, I would check out Nikon & Canon. However, I > went from a K100 to the K10D and saw a nice improvement. Not so much when I > went from the K10D to the K20D and there is debate about going from the K20D > to the K7 as it basically still uses the same AF system.
Click to expand...
The K100D, K10D, K20D and K-7 all basically uses the same AF system.

But there are differencies between them. The AF layout and sensor and name is different, still they have different performances as you have discovered yourself.

The K-7 has improved AF algorithms which helps it being faster than the K20D, especially in low light. Also helped by external AF assist lamp and colour sensitive sensor. That is why the K-7 has a "Plus" version in it's version name of the AF system compared to the system used in the K100D, K10D and K20D.

Even the K-x has faster AF than the K20D, and it uses the same new AF algorithms as the K-7 (but still uses the same SAFOX version number, and it doesn't have the colour sensitive sensor as the K-7 has).

--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
 
In one of your posts you state you 'shoot action more or less exclusively'.

What, specifically, are you photographing? Not all action is the same and different types of action require different gear. If you can provide more specifics about the action you shoot (give as much detail as possible - i.e. don't just say baseball - specify what level of play, day or night, where you shoot from (stands vs. on field, etc) and what your expectations are (web use only, 4x6 of your kids for scrapbook, prints for sale or newspaper) etc.

Answers to those questions will help determine what gear is beneficial for you. Then you can start gathering information on which of that gear is available in Pentax / Canon / Nikon and how much it is likely to cost.
 
Sorry, I've been out of town...

Some samples...



Usually I shoot from the starting line, but I wanted to try out my 50-200



this is a much more traditional shot for me, although I'm often partial to a full side view of the car taken at around 20-24 mm.
 
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