Considering E-PL1, would like to hear real world E-PL1 color comments from owners

Foreword:

I do not own an E-PL1, but I'm becoming interested in buying one... I already played with one at shop.

My love says Canon 5D is too big for her to use only the "green rectangle" mode (=auto)... and hates RAW it's processing time or whatever it is. But she would like to play with a real camera.

For me would be a lighter vacation camera... jpeg mostly with F-2 included for my shooting preferences:

• big viewfinder (the best thing about my 5D)
• it would be nice to shoot, review, play with menus without taking the eye of the viewfinder (can you comment on this also?)

Regarding my small kids and an slow AF, probably it's me or FF DoF, but I also have several not focused frames of them with 5D and L lens: they are really fast moving targets; their best shots are with them stand still and wide open (shallow DoF)

What I will miss on the E-PL1 is not-so-shallow DoF... if I'm learned the things correctly, If I attach a 50mm F1.8, I get a 100mm 1.8 on aperture but equiv DoF of 3.6. UWA will not be a problem: 9-18 will be available.
I'll loose the dials, but I'll I have two customizable buttons (AE lock and MF?)

Overall:

I think Olympus did a very good job: it seems that they made a "perfect enough" vacation camera, i.e. on almost all vacation pics I would not distinguish IQ from my FF: I don't make huge prints and I'm not a pixel peeper. It's more than "good enough": I don't feel I will practically compromise IQ with the smaller size.

Notes:
Even if I buy E-PL1, I won't sell the 5D

Buying a Canon S90? No, size is pocket perfect there is no shallow DoF and I have a "good" camera phone

Now Regarding color:

Steve Huff says best JPEG camera ever ( http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2010/04/07/the-olympus-e-pl1-review-the-best-jpeg-camera-ever/ )

It seems consistent with what almost everyone say: only good reviews about (jpeg) E-PL1 color rentition... all but one: ephotozine ( http://www.ephotozine.com/article/Olympus-EPL1-12973 ):

• yellow = fine
• red = disappointed
• blue = pale (said the same about E-P2)

I think it is a matter of taste, do you (partially) agree with ephotozine?

How did the Panasonic GF-1 fair in your comparison to Apples to Apples in the 4/3's class of cameras?

I'm not exactly sure what you're looking for... I only saw two questions in the post.

For the first question, yes, you can shoot, review, and change menus in the EVF with the camera to your eye - under default handling, all of the u4/3 cameras use the EVF exactly the same as the LCD when it is active.

One of my favorite unexpected finds on getting the GH1 was how helpful having a momentary (1 sec) instant review on is for most of my shooting. It doesn't disrupt my flow (it's be different in fast action circumstances, of course,) and doesn't require moving the camera or pausing, but it does tell me when I've screwed something up - exposure, white balance, blur, gross focus - in time to take a second picture immediately.

On the second question, I'm satisfied with the Olympus colors. I did notice at the Philly flower show that it had trouble with some of the deep purples under the artificial light - they came out quite a bit bluer than IRL. But I've seen that with most cameras I tried, and I haven't noticed any other color issues. With flash, this shot came close, but is still a little blue from my recollection:
Walter

I did and got two reasons:

1. small reason IS : I have my Canon lenses and IS is a must for me. In Body IS is a must to reuse those lenses (and other ebay/legacy ones), even with its setting caveat (I'll probably stick to primes)

2. big reason TIME : "Everyone" is saying that GF-1 images require RAW and "tuning" to achieve its best. Regarding Olympus "everyone" seems to say the opposite. My love wants the pictures out of camera ASAP, and to be honest I'm also tired of tuning photos.

I'm taking too much pictures and want a camera to slow me down: less pictures but better pictures. More pictures in RAW is (much) more time to select and process.

With my Canon is:
1. take one,
2. look at histogram,
3. push "to the right",
4. shoot two or three to get one sharp focus.
This is a minimum of 4 pics per real picture (If I nail the push to the right).

I'm counting on live histogram to reduce to 3 pics and instant preview to reduce even further. HighDef EVF is a "must" here

GF-1 for my requests even on specs is not good enough. I did hand holded one and found AF pretty fast (for a CD AF). olympus with kit lens is not that fast.

And almost everyone is saying Olympus JPEG is "perfect".

For my vacation pics JPEG is perfect enough, and camera has RAW for my "are-you-shooting-those-crazy-pics-again" photos. And is also good to recover pics (If I found time).

But, hey, It's me. Everyone has its own shooting methods (caveats?)

BR,
greyhat

Thank you very much.

Camera goal is to be the vacation's camera. If I go 3 weeks to New Zealand, Azores, Norway or Scotland I'll probably take the 5D, but for Japan or for the weekend on the beach/country E-PL1 seems better (=lighter).

My personal main goal is spend more time outdoor photographing than inside fixing images.
It was good, as a learning process, to do some digital darkroom.

The color:

As mentioned I'm interested on Out Of Camera JPEG Image Quality: It will be my love's camera. And that's the one thing it must do best.

Yes it seems that "everyone" finds OOC JPEG (much) better than average. Probably with a borrowed X-Rite color checker I can tune it If I become really picky on a particular photo (certainly not as workflow) , but for what I read it won't be necessary.

The EVF:

Of course my beloved can use the LCD with few simple tips to make "impressive" photos (histogram, live guide, some composing rules), but my personal taste is VF-photography.

The live histogram (preferable on EVF) is a practical must : on my 5D - no live view and rather old/slow camera - I shoot, put camera down, wait 1-2 secs for histogram, put camera back on shooting position to take more photos.
If it's a scenery picture it slows me down.

If it's my family pics, when I look again on the viewfinder I never find the same relative's smile level; after the second time I don't find any smile at all...

I love the 5D viewfinder (and hated the 350D because everything looked "in focus" and was really difficult to see).
This I don't want to compromise.

When I compared 5D VF to VF-2 sizes, I found the latter smaller ( 4/5 inches vs 1 inch) but bigger than "pro" 7D. And eye relief seems to be good (from reviews only - didn't try - it was not available to test).

Bonus Points:
1 - Base price (with kit lens)

2 - It's a pay-as-you-grow approach, I prefer that, even if I will probably buy VF-2...

3 - Another thing that convinced me when reading its user manual is the two RESET settings (RESET 1 an RESET2) this allow to have camera configuration just for me (and another one for my love.

Thanks again,
greyhat

If IBIS and great jpegs are very important for you then that´s clearly Olympus. The E-PL1 has the best jpegs of any m4/3 and the Olympus jpegs are far superior to the Panasonic jpegs. The Panasonics have other strenghts but only shine in RAW.

All imo.

You might find this link interesting where Steve Huff calls the E-PL1 possibly the best jpeg-camera ever:

http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/...mpus-e-pl1-review-the-best-jpeg-camera-ever/

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What´s that noise?

From one of the Canon Forums:

'I just came back from my first holiday with the 5D II (I think my wife was there as well). '

Thanks.

No opinion on JPEG but it was The Steve Huff link together with ephotozine review that made me start this thread.

I do not own either Panasonic or Olympus. I'm considering E-PL1.
I just have first handling (at shop) impression:
Olympus pros:

• not that small but it is on the small size and smaller than GF-1,
• yes it is possible to bounce flash
• live histogram is wide (good for "push to the right") but only luminance
• optional : better VF-2 (though didn't play with it)

Panasonic pros:

• faster kit lens (but to start I prefer a zoom )
• faster AF
• better LCD
• has a more useful dial (for me)

All I think I prefer Olympus: IBIS and JPEG apparent better JPEG Image quality was important.

The Olympus-Panasonic alliance recover something somehow forgotten: two brands making lenses and cameras that are all compatible. This was good but brought additional comparisons/discussions.

IMO in photography there are no common best solutions. Everyone has its own brain that work slightly different from the others. There are no 100% good or bad system to all.

Examples:

1. Some will prefer Panasonic and will think they will never have such a lower spec'ed LCD from Olympus, other will see LCD as a composing tool only and trust focus beep or upgrade it with VF-2.

2. Some will prefer 100% accurate focus but slow (Olympus apparently) other because they use statistcs to get sharp photos will prefer a faster but not so accurate to be able to take more pictures "per moment".

And I don't want to wait forever, I would like to use this summer (not after Photokina or other "launch season").

It will make me a better photographer If I spend more time taking pictures, with more time per picture , than reading specs or waiting for a camera... If I think I fount a "perfect enough" camera
I think E-PL1 is "perfect enough".

Additional picky question/curiosity : can someone confirm that E-PL1 live histogram is luminance and not green channel?

(Reason: I have experienced some really blown up sunset reds on 350D and noticed that only at home)

BR,
greyhat

greyhat said:

What I will miss on the E-PL1 is not-so-shallow DoF... if I'm learned the things correctly, If I attach a 50mm F1.8, I get a 100mm 1.8 on aperture but equiv DoF of 3.6.

Click to expand...

If you're at the same distance to the subject, you still get the same DOF as on FF. Difference is that you only capture a smaller crop from the imaging circle.

I you move back to capture the same scene (angle of view) as with the same lens on FF, you will indeed get a wider DOF, like you describe above.

So if you use FF lenses on a m4/3 body, they in fact become different lenses. Your 50mm f/1.8 will be a great portrait prime. But for a useful standard prime, you'll want a fast 24mm or 28mm. These are usually f/2.8 which might not be fast enough for your use. The 20mm f/1.7 could be better for this purpose, depending of course on what you're able to spend.

Damien

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/bilgy_no1

Thank you very much for detailing my explanation.

Note: This thread is filling some of my E-PL1's spec / real world use doubts.
Thank you all.

"last" real world info request : How easy/practical is IBIS setting for non 4/3 lenses (MF) ? It is practical to set for zooms or I should just forget and use primes or stick to a focal length (e.g. 300mm on a 70-300mm lens)?

BR,
greyhat

I've used a lot of brands and models of digital cameras over the years (Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Sony, Sigma, Olympus etc) and my experience has been no one else has quite the consistent quality of Olympus OOC JPEGS. Using Olympus gear allows me to shoot JPEG only most of the time (RAW+JPEG for particularly important stuff) and really minimizes my PP efforts so it was a big factor in my m4/3 decision. The E-PL1 seems to be no exception here and produces Olympus's typically excellent JPEGs.

I've also owned a lot of glass from the same set of manufacturers and in my experience Olympus glass is usually top notch - at or near the best quality in a price range, and often exceeding the quality of much more expensive glass from other manufacturers. This has actually been a bit of a disappointment in m4/3 for me as the only Olympus glass available for m4/3 so far is kit grade and to me is not quite the quality of previous Olympus kit lenses (although its on par with most kit lenses). So far the only outstanding lens I've seen in m4/3 so far is the 20mm F1.7 but I hope that will change with time.

With all of the focus speed complaints I've heard around the PEN system, I must say I was pleasantly surprised with the E-PL1. It seems to focus with the 14-42 kit lens at a speed and reliability in between my Canon G11 and my Olympus E-510 (nowhere near as fast as my E-3 though).

So far I'm a bit of a skeptic on m4/3 but found it interesting enough to try. I've only had the E-PL1 for a week or two now and not much time to play so I have not used it enough to say how good or bad I think it is. I have a 45-200 lens and VF-2 viewfinder arriving today so they will give me enough of the system to tell me if I'm going to like it or not.

Its definitely capable of great quality images with a significant size and weight savings over a traditional DSLR. But so far its expensive, the lens quality and selection is not what I'd want it to be, and every body seems to have different but significant flaws or omissions that fail to meet all my needs. The kit I've ended up with is so far the best compromise I've found in that system but everyone has different needs and expectations.

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Regards
Jim

greyhat said:

• live histogram is wide (good for "push to the right") but only luminance

Click to expand...

The histogram can't be moved that I can find - it's always bottom center - but it has a couple of other benefits I haven't really seen before (and that I don't have on the GH1.) First, you can set clipping levels in the custom menu for it. Second, there's a little green section in it - that shows the histogram of the focus point that is selected.

I'm not sure how relevant/useful setting the histogram clip levels is (in the otherwise white bar, it raises a red top or a blue bottom when clipping starts) - but I was definitely pleased to discover the focus point data.
Walter

The "push to he right" is the exposure tuning to get more information from image: you should push the curve as to the right as possible, without clipping, to get more IQ and less noise.

Thanks for the additional histogram info that I was not aware of.

It seems that this camera is a geek's dream for it's setings details and customizations but (from another post) it is the fast shooter's nightmare.

I want m next camera to slow down the fast shooter that lives inside of me, I.e. to produce less images from camera - increase my IQ average and rely less on catalog applications to pick the best of two seconds' set (all about the same moment).
That's why I'm leaning for E-PL1.

BR,
greyhat