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Better noise performance for Alpha cameras?

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tbcass

tbcass

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This should be of interest

http://www.photoclubalpha.com/2010/03/31/high-iso-noise-fix-for-image-data-converter/

"High ISO Noise fix for Image Data Converter
31st March 2010, 10:29 am

SONY has released a new alogrithm for raw conversion (deBayer) which offers improve high ISO noise. IDC (Image Data Converter) is the program issued with all Sony DSLRs. Up to now, no maker has ever revised their ‘house’ converter to offer high ISO improvement as a specific feature. The new version can be downloaded free by existing users (download link is provided at end of story).

What is more important for owners is that IDC has always copied, replicated or matched the behaviour of camera firmware. If Sony has acquired or written new deBayer algorithms, either future DSLRs will have much improved high ISO performance – or firmware upgrades are in the pipeline which could transform existing gear (except the poor old Alpha 100 – it was probably doing pretty well in reality anyway…).

We’ll know about the firmware soon, but it is significant that Sony having hinted at firmware upgrades for this Spring (documented from various trade shows, interviews etc on other websites) has first of all come out with an IDC upgrade.

Here is the full press release issued this morning:

α (Alpha) digital SLR users can now enjoy even more control over creating beautiful, low noise images with the latest release of Image Data Converter software.

Image Data Converter SR Version 3.2 now features new algorithms that significantly reduce image noise at high ISO settings when converting RAW data to JPEG files. Processing is most effective at ISO 800 and higher, delivering impressively natural results with minimised colour noise right up to ISO 12,800 (depends on DLSR model).

The new algorithm is effective when converting RAW file or cRAW files (depends on DSLR model) to JPEG files produced by all current and previous model digital SLR cameras by Sony (excluding DSLR-A100).

Image Data Convertor SR Version 3.2 is part of the Image Data Suite that also includes Image Data Lightbox SR Version 2.2. Supplied free of charge with all new digital SLR cameras by Sony, the enhanced bundle now also offers support for Mac OS 10.6 (Snow Leopard).

Registered Alpha customers can download Image Data Convertor SR Version 3.2 free of charge from the Sony Europe support website in English version from 31st March 2010. Other languages will be available to download within the next 10 working days. To download the new update, please visit:

http://support.sony-europe.com/dime/digistill/alpha/alpha.aspx? "
--
Tom

Look at the picture, not the pixels

http://www.flickr.com/photos/25301400@N00/
 
not that I use high ISO a lot, but it sure would be nice to have better noise control in my A350 - even if as good as the A700.

Just waiting for the upgrade to be posted to give it a try. Almost all my shots in the past year or more have been RAW, so I have lots of images to try it on.
--
Jerry
Sony V1, H5 and A350... Still learning...

'The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera.'
-- Dorothea Lange

http://www.pbase.com/icicle50/root

 
The A5xx series cams have significantly nicer noise reduction algorithms in camera than the previous A2xx and A3xx cameras - with a very specific targeting of chroma noise and a much finer grain pattern in lumi with stronger detail retention. I'm not sure about the A7xx - I think the version 4 update improved the NR in higher ISOs than the original did. So this could be an offering of the updated and enhanced NR algorithms they are using with the A5xx cameras.

It would make sense to me, since I absolutely cannot replicate the A550's NR results from high ISO when I convert from RAW using IDC...the camera jpg NR is better, cleaner, more detailed compared to what I get from it. Then again, I'm absolutely terrible with RAW conversion, and don't understand Sony's IDC in the first place (the 'sharpen' sliders, for example, appear to do absolutely nothing even if I jam all sliders to 0 or 100).

--
Justin
galleries: http://www.pbase.com/zackiedawg
 
Could be interesting but I'm noting the proximity to April 1st. :) Most Raw converters do not show the sharpening effect unless expanded to 75 percent or more.

Cheers,
--

“Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” - Ben Franklin.
You can see larger versions of my pictures at http://www.dennismullen.com .
 
I just realized a couple of days ago, that the "Threshold" setting should be set lower then the mod-point for the sharpening to work. This setting, I think, sets the parameters for the difference in contrast that has to exist for sharpening to occur. If that's too high, only the most contrasty edges will be sharpened - and this is not what we want in most cases. I tried it at about -75 and the sharpening process was noticable. What I can't resolve is the "undershoot/overshoot" sliders. When does one use one or the other or both?
--
Jerry
Sony V1, H5 and A350... Still learning...

'The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera.'
-- Dorothea Lange

http://www.pbase.com/icicle50/root

 
The GUI is still the same PITA and frankly, while I can't really tell whether noise reduction processing has improved relative to the previous version, IMO IDC 3.2 still isn't very good and can't compete with LR 3.

It would have been kind of a nightmare though if they kept the horrible interface and vastly improved the output. The way it is now I can safely continue to ignore IDC :-)
 
It let's you download the program as long as your camera is connected to the computer.

Cheers,
--

“Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” - Ben Franklin.
You can see larger versions of my pictures at http://www.dennismullen.com .
 
Nordstjernen said:
It took a software update to better the high ISO noise, not a firmware update!

What if there are some firmware upgrades in near future too?
Click to expand...
IMO, this increases the plausibility of the rumors of firmware upgrades in the near future.
 
It now takes the same approach to demosaicing and NR as seen in Lr3 and in the a5x0 firmware routines.

Noise is handled the same or better as in Lr3, you just get less control over adjustments. Colours are near-perfect. (And if you use a200/300, this IDC is much better noise-wise than the Lr3b2.)

The proggie is still as awkward as ever... But may make sense to run a batch conversion to 16bit/channel TIFFs and then edit further.
 
Hmmmm....yes, but IDC is horrible software! It's kind of like putting lipstick on a pig.

I do wonder though, if they have some magic bullet to be able to compete in the noise area with others - why not - 1) Put it in the camera? 2) Make the info open source so Adobe LR and others can use it?

Or maybe we're supposed to import and process for noise in IDC first - then send it to LR etc. for the rest?
  • Karen
http://www.karenengelphotography.com
 
ck3 said:
The GUI is still the same PITA and frankly, while I can't really tell whether noise reduction processing has improved relative to the previous version, IMO IDC 3.2 still isn't very good and can't compete with LR 3.
Click to expand...
We can't expect it to compete with LR3 - it's obviously intended for those of us who want a simple solution to converting from RAW without chucking the bucks for some of the third-party software. I would hope, though, that it can handle the basic conversion from RAW - including noise treatment - as well as the third-party software, like LR.

I've tried LR3 Beta, and, while reasonably tech and computer-literate, I just didn't want to take the time to learn this complex software. For me, IDC and PSPX2 together are an acceptable solution. If IDC now handles high-ISO noise a bit better, that's a bonus I'll be happy with.

--
Jerry
Sony V1, H5 and A350... Still learning...

'The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera.'
-- Dorothea Lange

http://www.pbase.com/icicle50/root

 
JerryCurtis said:
ck3 said:
The GUI is still the same PITA and frankly, while I can't really tell whether noise reduction processing has improved relative to the previous version, IMO IDC 3.2 still isn't very good and can't compete with LR 3.
Click to expand...
We can't expect it to compete with LR3 - it's obviously intended for those of us who want a simple solution to converting from RAW without chucking the bucks for some of the third-party software. I would hope, though, that it can handle the basic conversion from RAW - including noise treatment - as well as the third-party software, like LR.

I've tried LR3 Beta, and, while reasonably tech and computer-literate, I just didn't want to take the time to learn this complex software. For me, IDC and PSPX2 together are an acceptable solution. If IDC now handles high-ISO noise a bit better, that's a bonus I'll be happy with.

--
Jerry
Sony V1, H5 and A350... Still learning...

'The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera.'
-- Dorothea Lange

http://www.pbase.com/icicle50/root

Click to expand...
I would be happy if they just increased the efficiency. I can live with the interface but the response time can be really frustrating.

--
Rick
 
cgarrard said:
I've already been to the top about it.

Carl
--
http://www.AlphaMountWorld.com
Click to expand...
Is this there response to eh A900/A850 "noise issues"?

If I owned an A900/A850 I would be OK with this as a solution since I shoot cRAW exclusively on my A700. Post processing would be more important to me than the JPEG engine in the camera.

I wonder how many people with the A900/A850 shoot JPEG.

--
Rick
 
iGirl said:
Hmmmm....yes, but IDC is horrible software! It's kind of like putting lipstick on a pig.

I do wonder though, if they have some magic bullet to be able to compete in the noise area with others - why not - 1) Put it in the camera? 2) Make the info open source so Adobe LR and others can use it?

Or maybe we're supposed to import and process for noise in IDC first - then send it to LR etc. for the rest?
  • Karen
http://www.karenengelphotography.com
Click to expand...
They should make IDC open source so it can be improved.

--
Rick
 
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