60D likely to have

coldbivy · Feb 10, 2010

72.357% of the claims in this thread are BS

fyngyrz · Feb 10, 2010

Mark B. said:
Me too, based on my own experience with 2 cameras with similar-sized sensors. There's more to it than just pixel density; sensor technology improves as well as processing methods.

Mark, I'm an engineer with experience ranging from chip design to full systems. I'm well aware that technology advances, and that factors interact.

What I advocate is that the best tech be applied to a relatively low density, because regardless of the any specific tech, physics mandates that larger sensels will perform better, given that the same technology is used to implement them.

In other words, as they've got the 7D's 18 mp performing well, then a 15 or 12 or 10 or 8 mp sensor using the same tech will perform successively better. There's no way around this (other than straight up design or foundry blunders.) Larger sensels are quieter.

And post processing, though I love it dearly and actually make my living writing it at the present time, will never, ever, ever substitute for higher quality data acquisition, because one can always apply that same post processing to that better data.

--
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jonrobertp · Feb 10, 2010

jonrobertp · Feb 10, 2010

T2i has the same AF as the T1i.
But my money is on a 60D before the 20th.

Christoph Stephan · Feb 10, 2010

I think for someone who is not put off by the weight (and price), the weather-sealing and the big finder of the 7D may be well worth the upgrade. Many of these people may also want to have 2 cameras and therefore may keep their 50D as back-up (and decommission an older camera they have).

A pity it has not the same battery as the 50D....
--
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-----
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Doug_PS · Feb 10, 2010

I think the following makes perfect sense and simplifies the lineup for Canon:

XXXD line: Consumer Line (1.6 crop bodies...restricted features)
XD line: Professional Line (Crop and FF bodies...pro features)

with the addition of the 7D, I see the 50D (which I own) as being the end of the line for the XXD segment. Just my opinion!

indusbreed · Feb 10, 2010

jonrobertp said:
Personally I think the 60D would outsell the 7D...and maybe the T2i as well...but then I'm not a marketer....but it would carry the 20/30/40/50 line along with a huge following over the past 5 yrs.

Wow, a ghost camera outselling 7D and T2i, dude you are giving speculation a whole new twist

IB

Mark B. · Feb 10, 2010

fyngyrz said:
Mark B. said:

Me too, based on my own experience with 2 cameras with similar-sized sensors. There's more to it than just pixel density; sensor technology improves as well as processing methods.

Click to expand...

Mark, I'm an engineer with experience ranging from chip design to full systems. I'm well aware that technology advances, and that factors interact.

What I advocate is that the best tech be applied to a relatively low density, because regardless of the any specific tech, physics mandates that larger sensels will perform better, given that the same technology is used to implement them.

In other words, as they've got the 7D's 18 mp performing well, then a 15 or 12 or 10 or 8 mp sensor using the same tech will perform successively better. There's no way around this (other than straight up design or foundry blunders.) Larger sensels are quieter.

Regardless, Canon isn't going to release a camera successor with half the number of pixels. Just not going to happen.

fyngyrz said:
And post processing, though I love it dearly and actually make my living writing it at the present time, will never, ever, ever substitute for higher quality data acquisition, because one can always apply that same post processing to that better data.

I was speaking of the in-camera processing, not PP.

Mark

jonrobertp · Feb 10, 2010

jonrobertp · Feb 10, 2010

David Naylor · Feb 10, 2010

So are you saying that such a camera would get the same Dxomark score for low-light ISO as the 5D mII?

http://bit.ly/bzKer3

fyngyrz said:
...the thing about objective facts is that no matter how enthusiastically you believe otherwise, they don't change. That's why you'll keep seeing this -- your incorrect beliefs are being smacked around by reality.

--
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http://davidnaylor.org/blog/

tknterry · Feb 10, 2010

That will be an easy task for Canon.....to hand out a phantom camera

--
---Terry

http://www.wildworldphoto.net

MarkNicholas · Feb 10, 2010

Sorry if this is a disappointment but there will not be a 60D. The XXD line will I am certain be discontinued. The 7D is a 60D on steroids and I think Canon just raised the bar a notch or two.

We will have the entry level cameras, the 7D series, the 5D series and the 1D series. If there is a gap between the entry level and the 7D then the entry level cameras will gradually close up.

Mark B. · Feb 11, 2010

MarkNicholas said:
Sorry if this is a disappointment but there will not be a 60D.

Your source for this information is...?

David Naylor · Feb 11, 2010

Mark B. said:
MarkNicholas said:

Sorry if this is a disappointment but there will not be a 60D.

Click to expand...

Your source for this information is...?

No source needed. He is certain.

--
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http://davidnaylor.org/blog/

tknterry · Feb 11, 2010

It's clear to me that he is stating his opinion as is everyone else regarding the hypothetical 60D, since Canon has not gave any hint of its existence, now or in the future. I also share his skepticism.

Mark B. said:
Your source for this information is...?

--
---Terry

http://www.wildworldphoto.net

David Naylor · Feb 11, 2010

Let's take a step back and look at Nikon's and Canon's line-ups.

This is how I understand the different models to be competing:
(Correct me if I go wrong here.)

D3X - 1Ds
D3/D3S - 1D
D700 - 5D
D300/D300s - 7D
D90 - 50D
D5000 - 550D
D3000 - 1000D

Until the 7D came around, Canon lacked a direct competitor for the D300.

Do you really believe that Canon, after only just having taken steps to match all Nikon's cameras, are deliberately going to abandon the D90 price/feature range and let it reign free?

--
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Walter Blackledge · Feb 11, 2010

Shawn,

nobody wants to feel they are being manipulated by a company. Their are many "First Kid on the Block to own an X" types who will spend big $$$ to get what they want. Canon knows this and will harvest their cash first, then go for the people who aren't willing to spend that much on a Camera. So they come out with a new model with many of the same features a few months later.

I love canon products. I just wish their weren't as expensive as they are (thinking big telephoto lens, high end cameras, etc.)

Canon's laws of Motion.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=34488975

Mark B. · Feb 11, 2010

Walter Blackledge said:
Canon’s First Law of Motion :
That which is announced in (Sept/ Feb) will not be available until (Nov/ May).

The 7D announced in September was available in October.

Walter Blackledge said:
Canon’s Second Law of Motion :

That which you purchased in (Nov/May) will be made obsolete by some better features on a cheaper lower end model announced only 4 months after your (Nov/May) purchase.

The 550D certainly hasn't made the 7D obsolete by any stretch of the imagination.

Walter Blackledge said:
Canon’s Third Law of Motion :

That which possesses the best features available , and most craved by the consumer shall remain only those most expensive cameras available and shall not be passed down to lower end cameras.

That's true of most consumer electronics, definitely not unique to Canon products. Other DSLRs, cell phones, laptops, HDTVs to name just a few.

Mark

Austo82 · Feb 11, 2010

And then Canon is going to realize their mistake when everyone starts selling their 40D/50D for a Nikon D90s when that comes out, I would consider it if it was a good camera and Canon refused to make a new camera with an XXD quality body.

Canon just sealed the deal with the 7D now competing with the D300 and now has a camera to match every line of Nikon cameras. I just don't see them letting the XXD series go and giving Nikon free reign of the introductory prosumer DSLR market which is one of the better selling DSLR markets other than the rebel series. The 7D was competition for the D300 not a replacement for the 60D. It would be a huge mistake for Canon to have a $900 price gap between the t2i and the 7D especially if Nikon comes out with a D90s priced at a happy medium between the two and having a better body than the t2i.

MarkNicholas said:
Sorry if this is a disappointment but there will not be a 60D. The XXD line will I am certain be discontinued. The 7D is a 60D on steroids and I think Canon just raised the bar a notch or two.

We will have the entry level cameras, the 7D series, the 5D series and the 1D series. If there is a gap between the entry level and the 7D then the entry level cameras will gradually close up.

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