s2 lenses for group shots

what lenses are good lens for doing group shots with 10 people or more, either from nikon or an independent lens manufactuer? Some samples with your oppinions would be nice. I've played with some lenses that some friends of mine have and have mixed reviews, going to try again with a tripod cause it seems the sharpness on the s2 is too good and even at 1/150 some shots seem sharper than others and i dont think its the lens cause it sorta looks like shake but i dunno have to do more tests

I suggest that you include taking shots in RAW mode in your tests. That will maximise the quality from the S2, important where groups are concerned.

With the 1.5 conversion factor, it all depends on how far away from your subject you are, how much light there is (lens speed) etc. I use a 50mm f1.8 for small group and individual portraits. That is the equivalent of a 75mm lens on a normal film slr. You might need something a bit wider than that if space is tight, in which case, look at one of the zooms like the 17-35mm f2.8, or 18-35 f 3.5-4.5.

Q

Relm said:

what lenses are good lens for doing group shots with 10 people or
more, either from nikon or an independent lens manufactuer? Some
samples with your oppinions would be nice. I've played with some
lenses that some friends of mine have and have mixed reviews, going
to try again with a tripod cause it seems the sharpness on the s2
is too good and even at 1/150 some shots seem sharper than others
and i dont think its the lens cause it sorta looks like shake but i
dunno have to do more tests

Click to expand...

thanks qbd, does the raw and tiff hold that much more information than the jpg's? not so much worried about the light cause i can just move so another location or flash the subjects, btw i thinking about mainly wedding shots and i been getting requests for more fdamily portraits and a few class reunions with mabye 100 + people, how is the distortaion and drop off of the 17-35? are we talking nikon? i hope one of my friends owns a 17-35 :/ hee hee hee
thanks again

QDB said:

I suggest that you include taking shots in RAW mode in your tests.
That will maximise the quality from the S2, important where groups
are concerned.

With the 1.5 conversion factor, it all depends on how far away from
your subject you are, how much light there is (lens speed) etc. I
use a 50mm f1.8 for small group and individual portraits. That is
the equivalent of a 75mm lens on a normal film slr. You might need
something a bit wider than that if space is tight, in which case,
look at one of the zooms like the 17-35mm f2.8, or 18-35 f 3.5-4.5.

Click to expand...

The 17-35 is a great lens, but not cheap. I use the cheaper 18-35 and find it is very sharp. I tend not to use independent make lenses, as I don't trust their quality control, and used Nikkors fetch more on the used market. There are exceptions, though.

Fine Jpeg is great if you get the exposure etc right. The advantage of RAW is that you retain the ability to convert to 16 bit tif files. That means more data to apply corrections to in Photoshop if, perchance, you get the exposure wrong. Yes, RAW is better, but it is also more work. Try out a few shots with, say, Quimage and see how you get on (make sure you use the Qimage Fuji input profile).

Tiff in-camera I would not bother with. You are still limited to 8-bit output. If you do not use RAW, I'd use fine Jpeg.

Q

Relm said:

QDB said:

I suggest that you include taking shots in RAW mode in your tests.
That will maximise the quality from the S2, important where groups
are concerned.

With the 1.5 conversion factor, it all depends on how far away from
your subject you are, how much light there is (lens speed) etc. I
use a 50mm f1.8 for small group and individual portraits. That is
the equivalent of a 75mm lens on a normal film slr. You might need
something a bit wider than that if space is tight, in which case,
look at one of the zooms like the 17-35mm f2.8, or 18-35 f 3.5-4.5.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

QDB said:

The 17-35 is a great lens, but not cheap. I use the cheaper 18-35
and find it is very sharp. I tend not to use independent make
lenses, as I don't trust their quality control, and used Nikkors
fetch more on the used market. There are exceptions, though.

Fine Jpeg is great if you get the exposure etc right. The
advantage of RAW is that you retain the ability to convert to 16
bit tif files. That means more data to apply corrections to in
Photoshop if, perchance, you get the exposure wrong. Yes, RAW is
better, but it is also more work. Try out a few shots with, say,
Quimage and see how you get on (make sure you use the Qimage Fuji
input profile).

Tiff in-camera I would not bother with. You are still limited to
8-bit output. If you do not use RAW, I'd use fine Jpeg.

Q

Click to expand...

Hi Relm:

I have the 18-35mm Nikkor - Great lens for groups.

Here is a recent shot using this lens. Shot Fine-3024.

http://www.pbase.com/mdemyan/wide_angle

--
Mike Demyan
S-2
http://www.pbase.com/mdemyan
http://home.ptd.net/~mdemyan

Relm said:

what lenses are good lens for doing group shots with 10 people or
more, either from nikon or an independent lens manufactuer? Some
samples with your oppinions would be nice. I've played with some
lenses that some friends of mine have and have mixed reviews, going
to try again with a tripod cause it seems the sharpness on the s2
is too good and even at 1/150 some shots seem sharper than others
and i dont think its the lens cause it sorta looks like shake but i
dunno have to do more tests

Click to expand...

I've just started using a newly acquired Nikor 35 f2 for group shots - looks very promising and is a "normal" 52mm equiv lens. If you are pushed for distance and want to go wider the Sigma 20 f1.8 EX DF DG rates a bit better than the Nikor 20 f2.8 and has less distortion. Anthony posted a group shot sample here a week ago. It is at:
http://www.pbase.com/image/3252636/large
--
Doug Jones
Canberra
http://www.panamagic.com.au

thanks guys, pics look great! certainly eases my mind about buying a wide lens i really apreciate you sharing your shots and advice!

Now if I get this straight, you want to know which lenses are sharp and which are not.

Any lens that is sharp is a good lens for groups providing you can get them inside the frame of your camera.

For the best natural perspective, I prefer a lens that would be the equivalent of a 85 mm lens on a 35mm camera. That would then be a 55 to 60 mm lens on the S2.

I believe some people here would tell you that the 50 mm (75 on S2) prime standard lens from Nikon is a good starting point. The zooms that cover this area a re more usefull of course but if you want the sharpest, this is a good inexpensive addition.
Rinus of Calgary

srry rinus thats a good question i tend to muddle many of my thoughts together sometimes and forget the original direction of my questions basically i want to know what is the widest angle that i can use, without distorting the people, and captures detail well. as you know, if you want more in a fixed length lens you have ot move back,and the more you move back the less detail you will obtain. i want to be able to stay close, without distortaion, while keeping detail. the 50mm is great i have one already and love it, great for candids, but the bigger the gruop gets the more detail i lose. and my shoots keep getting bigger and bigger groups, i had to decline a shoot for a class reunion cause the wideist shot i can do is a 28mm and it has some distortaion not to mention the loss of detail i got when i was still in 35 with a 150 people in the shot. i couldnt produce the quality i wanted to give so i declined, but wiht the s2 im rather happy with the detail it can record with the 28. just want to know the wideist i can go. ^.^

Rinus said:

Now if I get this straight, you want to know which lenses are sharp
and which are not.
Any lens that is sharp is a good lens for groups providing you can
get them inside the frame of your camera.
For the best natural perspective, I prefer a lens that would be the
equivalent of a 85 mm lens on a 35mm camera. That would then be a
55 to 60 mm lens on the S2.
I believe some people here would tell you that the 50 mm (75 on S2)
prime standard lens from Nikon is a good starting point. The zooms
that cover this area a re more usefull of course but if you want
the sharpest, this is a good inexpensive addition.
Rinus of Calgary

Click to expand...

this one was done with Nikkor 28-105 1:3.5-4 D

Relm said:

what lenses are good lens for doing group shots with 10 people or
more, either from nikon or an independent lens manufactuer? Some
samples with your oppinions would be nice. I've played with some
lenses that some friends of mine have and have mixed reviews, going
to try again with a tripod cause it seems the sharpness on the s2
is too good and even at 1/150 some shots seem sharper than others
and i dont think its the lens cause it sorta looks like shake but i
dunno have to do more tests

Click to expand...

--
http://www.pbase.com/anatolii/

Your ideas are noble but the resolution of the image does not change with backing up away from the subject with a longer lens. The CCD is 4256 pixels wide and no matter what lens you put on, it is still the same. Rejoice and know that 10 people side by side can be photographed without problem with any lens but try not to go wider than 24 mm on your S2 (35 or 36mm lens on film) The people at the sides are quickly stretched and will look fat! The 50 mm lens and backing up is still the best. It also photgraphs less background behind the people for more control.
Rinus of Calgary

Relm said:

srry rinus thats a good question i tend to muddle many of my
thoughts together sometimes and forget the original direction of my
questions basically i want to know what is the widest angle that
i can use, without distorting the people, and captures detail well.
as you know, if you want more in a fixed length lens you have ot
move back,and the more you move back the less detail you will
obtain. i want to be able to stay close, without distortaion, while
keeping detail. the 50mm is great i have one already and love it,
great for candids, but the bigger the gruop gets the more detail i
lose. and my shoots keep getting bigger and bigger groups, i had to
decline a shoot for a class reunion cause the wideist shot i can do
is a 28mm and it has some distortaion not to mention the loss of
detail i got when i was still in 35 with a 150 people in the shot.
i couldnt produce the quality i wanted to give so i declined, but
wiht the s2 im rather happy with the detail it can record with the
28. just want to know the wideist i can go. ^.^

Click to expand...

The best way to increase the resolution of a camera for a very large group shot is to take a number of shots with the camera in portrait orientation and then stitch them together with good pano software. This has the added benefit of giving you a wider angle shot than can be achieved with a single shot from the same lens. Also, if done correctly, you have less distortion. I have done an image taken in a basketball stadium with (guessing) more than 2000 people in the shot and the detail in the faces is good enough to recognise people. This was constructed from 5 portrait mode shots. With the S2 you can easily achieve pano image resolutions typically 4000x12000 pixels. The resolution when printed at 24x72 inches is astounding.
--
Doug Jones
Canberra
http://www.panamagic.com.au

oh no no no, im not speaking or resoloution , just detail in general. hee hee so sorry guys! plz feel free to slap the amatuer n the head:/ haha

let say you were shooting on film format, which i still plan to do, grain is a beautiful thing when shot correctly. and lets say in shoot ing the 50mm if i cant to fit more people in the shot i have to either pose them one on fromn the other, or move back. if i move back the lens will take in less detail....right? i hope im making sence i already did a shot with about 10 so i shose that # at a wedding,



in which it did fine, but i want know my limitations and or if i should buy a new lens. i tried to get a bigger group shot for a test but th largest i could gather was the bride and grroms family about 15 people, but i didnt spread them out so my test couldnt work.

how bout this then, would a 50mm printable detail, as in able to make out someones face very well, with say ..... 200 people? like i said im getting more request for bigger shots, one from my old highschool teacher who wants me to shoot the band with about 200 plus kids in it. i was too afraid to try it out with 35mm film and also why i bought an s2, was a choise between a hasse or a big digital. but i seen some gorgeous shots printed in 20x30's with the s1! so opted for an s2. i tried once in 35mm but they didnt like the shot, wanted more detail int eh face and so i declined te job cause i figured the only way to get a shot like that is with a bigger format cam. thanks for your time everyone! i hope im not fustrating anyone i really apreciate it

Rinus said:

Your ideas are noble but the resolution of the image does not
change with backing up away from the subject with a longer lens.
The CCD is 4256 pixels wide and no matter what lens you put on, it
is still the same. Rejoice and know that 10 people side by side can
be photographed without problem with any lens but try not to go
wider than 24 mm on your S2 (35 or 36mm lens on film) The people at
the sides are quickly stretched and will look fat! The 50 mm lens
and backing up is still the best. It also photgraphs less
background behind the people for more control.
Rinus of Calgary

Click to expand...

holy cow! thats a lotta detail