Manual Budget Camera

I'm not really sure where to put this...

I would like to buy a cheap compact camera (max. 150€) and I would like it to have manual controls. I've read about the Lumix LZ8, but in my country it seems to be out.of.stores, like the Powershot A590IS. their replacements have better auto modes but no manual settings at all.

where and what should I look for?

PS if there will be a 2009 Budget Camera Poll in the reviews I'm looking forward for it

Have you considered getting a second hand camera? There are superb small-sensor cameras with manual controls that now cost a fraction of what they did a few years ago.

Also, do you have any other requirements - size/weight, lens range, RAW support, speed, hot-shoe, swivel LCD, EVF?

Prog.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/oren_b

I checked ebay italia, the only LZ8's are new and ship at 190€, kelkoo italia doesn't even list it and generally used announcements don't involve so relativily new and cheap cameras.

btw, on the english net you can find it new at 100$... problably I'd better look for an used higher level camera later in january, but I'd prefer to buy with a warranty.

for the other requirements... well it has to be a "budget" camera, a 35-120mm with an almost decent image quality would be nice enough.

You didn't relate to the other requirements (size, RAW, etc) so I'll tell you what second hand cameras I would look for in this budget (150 Euro):

(Compacts are in bold )

• Canon - Pro1, if you don't need a wide-angle lens - G6, A620, A630, A640 , also consider cameras like SD850 and SD870 with the CHDK add-on
• Olympus - C7070 , C8080, C5060 (check for mode-dial problems)
• KonicaMinolta - A2, A200, A1 (only if the sensor was replaced)
• Fuji - S6500/S6000, S9500/S9000 (check for mode-dial problems), S9100/S9600, E900
• Ricoh - GX100, GX8
• Nikon - Nothing worth the bother in this budget.
• Panasonic - LX1 , FZ30
• Kodak - P880

All of these are better to far-better than what you can get for 150 Euro new, but finding them second hand and within this budget may be tricky. I know that at least in Israel I saw all of these camera going for 150 Euro or less at one point in time or another, so Italy (which is much larger in terms of population) should have more offerings. Just don't limit your searches to eBay.

Prog.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/oren_b

thank you, I'll check them all out and keep an eye for post christams bargains

You might want to consider the Kodak Z915, for a budget cam with manual controls. Current price on Amazon new, is around $129.

Nick1420 said:

You might want to consider the Kodak Z915, for a budget cam with manual controls. Current price on Amazon new, is around $129.

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It looks like a decent option. The only serious omissions compared to many of the second-hand options above are the lack of a wide 28mm lens (a deal breaker for me), and missing RAW mode, hot-shoe and swivel-screen. If the OP is fine with these, then the Z915 seems like an option worth exploring.

Prog.

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/oren_b

so far I resolved to search some used cameras shop after the end of the year, looking for a used Powershot G-xx or A720 (or similar). I doubt I could find less common things like the Olympus ore the FinePix E900, but it wouldn' be bad. also, I already had prblems with my LX-1 so I wouldn't consider buying another.

for buying new (and in warranty) I'm also considering the Powershot SX series, only they're a bit more expensive then I had in mind. how fares the EasyShare Z915 compared to the SX110/120 (for no clear reason the 10mp model seems to cost less than the 9mp)

maja_ldm said:

so far I resolved to search some used cameras shop after the end of the year, looking for a used Powershot G-xx or A720 (or similar).

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The A720 is nothing special. Its sensor is small (1/2.5) and it doesn't have the other nice features that the G series offers (swivel screen, fast lens, hot-shoe, good build quality). Both don't have a wide angle lens, which IMHO is a significant disadvantage.

maja_ldm said:

for buying new (and in warranty) I'm also considering the Powershot SX series, only they're a bit more expensive then I had in mind. how fares the EasyShare Z915 compared to the SX110/120 (for no clear reason the 10mp model seems to cost less than the 9mp)

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10MP vs. 9MP is completely meaningless. You'll find very few 12MP cameras that can rival the old 6MP Fuji F31 for image quality, so that should tell you something. Sensor size, sensor technology and image processing are more important than MP count.

As for the SX110/120 vs. the Z915, other than a slightly larger screen and slightly faster lens, these Canon models don't offer much of an advantage. All three share the same significant shortcoming - no wide angle lens.

BTW, are you sure you really need full manual exposure control? Many cameras don't have PASM modes, but they have manual long exposure options which is sufficient for nightscapes. Other than that, PASM (or A and S modes to be specific) are highly overrated when it comes to small-sensor compact cameras. I explained why in this post:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1033&message=27896278

Prog.
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maja_ldm said:

I'm not really sure where to put this...

I would like to buy a cheap compact camera (max. 150€) and I would like it to have manual controls. I've read about the Lumix LZ8, but in my country it seems to be out.of.stores, like the Powershot A590IS.

Click to expand...

Well, this is probably due to the fact that both of these models have been discontinued for quite some time now and there are probably not too many left available.

--
J. D.
Colorado

yeah, I already noticed that most compact DC have like 3 steps of aperture, but I wanted a manual mode camera to push my sister at practicing (for what is possible...)

I gave her an eos300 some time ago, but with the fact that film is expensive and it's difficult to check the results of your try-outs she always use full-auto...

as for the pixelage... I myself really doubt even 8mp sensors seriousness, but should I choose a new/mint camera (for the warranty) I can't seem to have many options.

also, should I ever go for a used one... I fear I'll have to go for what I can find (italy is big, but I live in a small city and on-line offers are not a lot).

don't know.. I just know amazon or google shopping still list a lot of them for the "english" market.

btw, after a night's browsing I discovered the Finepix F200 which I could buy for 180€... it could not be the "flawless" F31 and not have a real manual mode... but after all if my sister would learn to use her SLR she would have already said so... and years ago my deision was between the LX1 and the F30... and now the next model of the same line at that price... I'd better sleep over it.

maja_ldm said:

btw, after a night's browsing I discovered the Finepix F200 which I could buy for 180€... it could not be the "flawless" F31 and not have a real manual mode... but after all if my sister would learn to use her SLR she would have already said so...

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The F200 is an excellent camera, but its aperture control only offers two values - equivalent to wide open and stopped down.

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In the USA market the least expensive current model with iris for aperture is the Canon SX120 IS. Most compact with iris are the Canon S90 and Nikon S710.

Kelly Cook

all right, I've resolved for the F200. and at least the priority modes will avoid the flash to splurt in inappropriate moments