Very half-hearted effort at Luminous Landscape on K7 review

tvw said:

I was waiting for this. You actually took a few milliseconds longer than I expected.

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I am not surprised by your response either. In fact I would have been surprised if you hadn't.

tvw said:

Well, as I noted above Pentax people want unconditional praise and you'll have your ditto heads lavishing praise on you any minute now. All this adulation and not a bit of hubris, how noble.

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Maybe you can show where I am wrong in my appraisal of the review? After all, all I said was that anyone considering the purcahse of a K7 do so because it is a compromise that they are willing to make. I never said it was the best camera, but it is the best camera for those people which is a statement that Michael Reichmann doesn't seem willing to make. Get over it.

--
Lance B
http://www.pbase.com/lance_b

tvw said:

What is it with the insecurity and Pentax people? The guy says it is a good camera, he even praises pentaxes roots, he makes a fair assessment with some qualifers, which he points out right up front, but because it isn't a LanceB gush fest you an't handle it. You don't want an unbiased review, you want unconditional praise and anything less than that results in temper tantrums. Yeah, the guy does shoot Leica, he know quality.

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LOL. It seems to me the one who can't handle it is you . I mean, why are you even here ? It should matter nout what we say on this forum as you are a Canon apologist. No one has said anything bad about Canon, or Nikon, or Olympus....

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Lance B
http://www.pbase.com/lance_b

Lance I know nothing about you or your history, so I make no judgements, but MAN you must have thick skin! Well what you said makes sense to me anyway.

And as for you tvw, are there any worms down in that hole? Speaking for myself (and I suspect the vast majority of Pentaxians), I don't care if he HATES the K-7, but I want and deserve a quality bit of writing! A high school student could write better than that.

And so for your Pentaxian bashing effort tvw you are awarded today's

tvw said:

What is it with the insecurity and Pentax people? The guy says it is a good camera, he even praises pentaxes roots, he makes a fair assessment with some qualifers, which he points out right up front, but because it isn't a LanceB gush fest you an't handle it. You don't want an unbiased review, you want unconditional praise and anything less than that results in temper tantrums. Yeah, the guy does shoot Leica, he know quality.

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--
Best regards

Greg



/ He who can't laugh at himself need not worry - others will do it for him/

I dunno noe hows to tak that crittycism, But I kinda had a hard time witn that ingesh stuff and the writeing two.

tvw said:

I dunno noe hows to tak that crittycism, But I kinda had a hard time witn that ingesh stuff and the writeing two.

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If he has troubles writing, then there may be a reason but that is no reason to attack him personally. Stick to the issues, please.
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Lance B
http://www.pbase.com/lance_b

I agree that the review seems to have been rushed. Michael may have only agreed to do it grudgingly as he may not have been that excited to work with it like he did the C 7D and the Leicas. However, he did say some good things about the K7 and Pentax lenses.

For Pentax's marketing department, his response should be noted as many professionals don't seem that attracted to Pentax, for various reasons. More focus should be given to the small size of the K7 when used with the ltd lenses for street shooting. Pentax has a long road to hoe to get the recognition of the industry. His points about being average are correct and Pentax needs a top of the line camera to really attract attention. That is why a good FF, priced like the Sony alpha 850, could attract recognition. Pentax may need to treat FF as a loss leader for people to feel they have an upward migration path.

Dale
--
http://www.pbase.com/abundant108

http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/home#section=ARTIST&subSection=272176&subSubSection=1787360&language=EN

Lance, I absolutely agree. I though that Chillgreg was blasting my writing. I know that we disagree but I would never make fun of anyone's personal abilities. I truthfully apologize to that poster , but believe me I thought the comment was directed at me since it came with the cartoon and a few other swipes.

I see they made up for DPReview's non-mention of the SR (In the Pro column) by mentioning it twice! I can even forgive them for misspelling it "Shake Deduction".

I have always admired and respected luminous landscape, and Michael Reichmann.

But I have to agree with Lance B regarding this review being one that Michael probably did not devote enough time to.

However, over and over again I keep seeing the same thing in all of these camera reviews. And I think I understand why. This persistent desire for more statistical improvements in all the new DSLR's. Let's face it folks, we're all terribly spoiled. The truth is all of the cameras today are great photographic instruments, the vast majority of them far exceeding most of us amateur photographers capabilities. Well, reviewer sure can't write about that. They've got to do something to help pay the rent.

For me, at my age, the big deal anymore is how does the camera feel in my hands. How easy is it for me to take pictures with any given camera. The real joy of photography anymore is how easy it is to just take a good sharp picture, consistently, reliably and enjoyably. The truth is I almost never print out a picture larger than 4 x 6. The majority of other viewing is done on screen. All the pixel peeping in the world will not help this, but rather impede my progress towards what I have mentioned above.

I don't own a K7, I own a K10. But I'd like to own a K7. Maybe I will buy a K8.

--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/26289929@N05/

Don

joseluismx said:

I would probably go for the 23K USD camera over the 1.2K USD camera as well. lol.

Winder said:

I think he has the Leica S2 under evaluation right now as well. Hard for any camera to compete with something like the S2.

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Yeah, I doubt he is spending much time with the K-7. If I had the opportunity to test the S2 I probably would take full advantage of it and use it exclusively for as long as I could.

Pentax has produced a great body with the K-7.... Now they need to show they can consistently produce great bodies, and continue to improve.

Nick Savoiu said:

Did he forget to turn off CA/distortion correction?

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Yeah it seems to be the case. I have sent him an e-mail about this and we'll see what he has to say about it.

--
Peter Fang - Pentax user for more than 25 years: K-7 / MZ-S / Z-1 / SFX / LX
My PBase Gallery: http://www.pbase.com/pfang

I was really stumped when I tried to figure out why Michael was even reviewing the Pentax K-7. His site has meandered and followed odd niche products over the last year or two and this seemed to pop up out of the blue. He concluded a divorce from Canon after the Nikon D3 emerged from the shadows and heartily denounced their offerings as less-than-competent (my words) in comparison to Nikon's, specifically the body features. Now he's suddenly back to doing regular camera body reviews? Of Pentax? When is the last time he even mentioned them on his site? I'm not sure what his point was. Who was he directing this review towards? Very perplexing - I agree with some of the other posters, it almost seems like he was grudgingly talked into it. The review has the feeling of a child being forced to eat their brussel sprouts, "Fine, I'll eat them but I'll hold my nose!" He really didn't seem to make an effort to appreciate, as he's stated regarding the Leica system, the "gestalt" of the Pentax system, especially with the amazing lack of any Limited lenses in the kit. Either Pentax dropped the ball on equipment loans or he really didn't have an understanding of the K-7 to start with. It was designed specifically for the Limited lineup for pete's sake!

I dunno, this one leaves me scratching my head and feeling let down by Michael's efforts. I don't mind if someone doesn't "get" the K-7 but they have to make a concerted effort as a reviewer to understand the role of the tool and it's intended market. It was never designed to be a D700 killer or compete with full frame cameras. It's smaller than the competition, beautifully designed, a step-improvement over previous offerings and provides Pentax a solid foundation for future development. I don't even have to mention SR and weather sealing... Very disappointing and beneath his abilities. I apparently had too high of expectations for LL.
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Rich

Dale108 said:

For Pentax's marketing department, his response should be noted as many professionals don't seem that attracted to Pentax, for various reasons. More focus should be given to the small size of the K7 when used with the ltd lenses for street shooting.

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To appeal to pro's, Pentax need not just a superb product (that's the easy bit) but also a pro-friendly pedigree - it comes through a reputation built over many years for great products and great service. Marketing alone can't buy that.

--
Mike
http://flickr.com/rc-soar

hammer9 said:

This guy really phoned in the review - don't even understand why he bothered to write it up:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/k7-hands.shtml

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Just read the review this minute. I'm new to Pentax, no hardware yet, but I have been doing a lot of reading. I think you are right -- he 'phoned it in".

"Didn't have time to evaluate this or that". No prime lenses -- the best available in the industry per his own website , but he couldn't bring himself to even ask for any.

"It (K7) just failed to light my fire" -- this is my favorite. No go and read all the eloquent BS he wrote about the Leica M9. Of what use is the Leica? Street photography is all I can come up with. Then read further about all the problems he had with the Leica, and again he dodges them with a multitude of paragraphs. Well, I do photography professionaly, and the Leica M9 fails to light my fire -- big time. I think I'm beginning, again, to tune out LuminousLandscape. He is soooo enamored with that Leica, and I just cannot see it.

The LL K7 review is written by someone who just didn't care to do a good review. He's too busy visiting the Leica factory and talking to thier engineers. So be it.
--
Thom--

hammer9 said:

This guy really phoned in the review - don't even understand why he bothered to write it up:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/k7-hands.shtml

*************************
Tom in Delaware
Photoblog: http://homepage.mac.com/galoot_9/blog/momentary.html

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The guy is a total gear not, trying to eak a little more from his Hassleblads and Shnieder lenses.

He carries a lot of equipment. always uses a tripod, and his cameras are always under a WR sheet.

What I am saying is that if Hassy/Lieca made a camera twice as big as what they have now. charged 80,000 for it. He will praise it!!!!!!
He is not someone to care for SR. light weight, real weather resistant.

He is a gear nut who happens to be an OK photographer.

Hi Steve,

*isteve said:

But I dont get the 2s delay. Did he have image correction set on?

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Yeah that bit about "non-instant review" also caught my attention. I have written an e-mail to Michael and will see what he has to say about it. I guess he used DA/DA* lenses and had lens correction or some built-in special effects filter turned on. Otherwise there's no way the review to have a two-second delay.

Peter

--
Peter Fang - Pentax user for more than 25 years: K-7 / MZ-S / Z-1 / SFX / LX
My PBase Gallery: http://www.pbase.com/pfang

Rich1971 said:

I was really stumped when I tried to figure out why Michael was even reviewing the Pentax K-7. His site has meandered and followed odd niche products over the last year or two and this seemed to pop up out of the blue. He concluded a divorce from Canon after the Nikon D3 emerged from the shadows and heartily denounced their offerings as less-than-competent (my words) in comparison to Nikon's, specifically the body features. Now he's suddenly back to doing regular camera body reviews? Of Pentax? When is the last time he even mentioned them on his site? I'm not sure what his point was. Who was he directing this review towards? Very perplexing - I agree with some of the other posters, it almost seems like he was grudgingly talked into it. The review has the feeling of a child being forced to eat their brussel sprouts, "Fine, I'll eat them but I'll hold my nose!" He really didn't seem to make an effort to appreciate, as he's stated regarding the Leica system, the "gestalt" of the Pentax system, especially with the amazing lack of any Limited lenses in the kit. Either Pentax dropped the ball on equipment loans or he really didn't have an understanding of the K-7 to start with. It was designed specifically for the Limited lineup for pete's sake!

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Yep, you nailed the whole flavor of the review. Perfunctory, half-hearted, grudging, jaded come to mind in trying to describe it. He did not seem to spend enough time with the camera to even understand the features very well. I wonder how much time he even spent with it, it would appear that he could not FORCE himself to use such a plebeian product when he has so many other fascinating cameras at his disposal.

Well, I liked the TOP review in comparison, not so much because of the result but because Gordon Lewis made an effort to learn and explore, and yes appreciate, the feature set as well as take photographs with it. He tried the shake reduction, he tried a variety of lenses, including an older manual lens, he tried out a lot of things. Interesting that Lewis produced a photograph with the K7 that aroused enough comment such that he and TOP decided to offer it as a limited print series. Yes, the man printed photographs from the camera. Bit of a shock, that.
--
*************************
Tom in Delaware
Photoblog: http://homepage.mac.com/galoot_9/blog/momentary.html

hammer9 said:

This became apparent to me in two ways. The first was as I was choosing which camera to take out on a shoot each day (I had four different new cameras to test in a one month period). After a full day of initial familiarization I rarely found myself reaching for the K7 by choice. Not because of any particular failing, but simply because there were features or capabilities of other cameras available that simply were more compelling and which I felt would help me take better images more effectively.

Secondly, when it came to shooting some images for comparisons, looking at resolution and high ISO capability, the K7 stood firmly in the middle of the pack. Not a stand-out in any regard, but not so far behind the pack so as to draw attention to itself. In fact this "averageness" meant that I got bored doing comparisons, because there really wasn't a stand-out feature or failing to make the process interesting.

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Yeah, strange conclusion. It's not written as a photographer, it's written as a market analyst. So he had four top-end pro cameras to choose from. That's great. Most of will only have have one - so "averageness" is very much appreciated.

Reichmann's biased to the top end pro market, so anything less isn't going to get much love. Like the OP, I was left wondering why he even wrote the piece.

*isteve said:

*isteve said:

Uh ? The AF point navigation on the K-7 is exactly like that of the K10D & K20D before it, and quite intuitive.

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Yes, but its no longer dedicated. The joystick on the Canon is one of the few ergonomic features I actually like.

I still prefer Pentax controls overall, but I think they are trying to force the control layout from lower end cameras on their top end model, rather than designing the controls to suit the features.

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Hear, hear! The direction pad with all the overloaded controls is a bit much. Even the AF point selection on the K10D and K20D was a problem when shooting continuously - if you happened to try adjust shutter speed via the e-dial while instant review was on, it would just zoom in and then the D-pad would start scrolling the image around rather than moving the active AF point. Luckily you can just turn off instant review from the custom settings.

--
Pavel
http://flickr.com/photos/pavel/