Unexpected sale! Your help is needed...

But I am not sure I misunderstood Michael J.
Yes, I know it is a scam.

I was mostly suggesting ways for any future sales - be cause she didn't seem to have anything set up to sell her photos.
He was suggesting a certified check, and sending an invoice.
Having them send her a certified check does not give them any information about her than is already in a phone book. What it would really do is get them to go away, because they are not about to send anybody any money or any personal information about themselves.
Certified Checks used to be secure, but obviously not any more.
What's not secure? You deposit the check, wait for it to clear, e-mail the image.
You would have to wait about 2 MONTHS. A bank will "clear" a check in a few days, yet it can STILL COME BACK up to 6-8 weeks later.

A friend of mine deposited a "Dow Chemical Co." check, it cleared, he spent the money.

The FBI showed up 2 months later and arrested him. They gave him 3 days to "replace" every penny or he was going away for a couple of years.
And I am concerned that sending an invoice simply gives the scammer more info than they already had.
A name and address? That info is easy to find.
Not if they so-far only have your e-mail addy. Some pro's only maintain a PO Box on their public available web-site.
I don't know what the answer is for deals that we are not "sure" of, (but seem legit).

I can only think of an online-invoice, (since he does indeed already have your email), and PayPal, (even though I have heard it is not very reliable in getting refunds, AND (fake) PayPal is one of the BIGGEST phishing titles).

But I would not "mail" an invoice with your real address on it. Maybe a PO Box.
If you are that scared, then don't do anything.
I have been a victim of Identity Theft (20 years ago, before it was even known as a "crime") that cost me over a $million$. So I don't now even use my "correct" name on the internet, I have 60 domain names, they are not purchased/listed under my "real" name. My PayPal account is also not my real name, it is my "internet" name.

I am sorry, but I have been a victim, they even transferred my mail when they knew I had over a $100,000 in accounts payable coming in. It took me over a year of exchanges with a (USPS) Judge in Washington DC to get it transferred back. But much, much too late to recover the accounts-payable checks that I permanently lost.
I can see where you would have reservations, after what you went through.
In my case, and x-employee (that wanted to be a "partner" and I refused) simply went downtown and got a duplicate Business License and DBA in the SAME NAME as my company. (yes, anyone CAN do that, you have to get a Court Order to get it reversed).

He then contacted my BANK, and diverted my MAIL with a Change-of-Address card, (which ANYONE can also very EASILY do). He told both of them that he was the new "owner" of the business.

I notified the POLICE of what he was doing; and they "warned" him that he was going to JAIL if he "took" anything.

That did NOT stop him.

He then conned a LOCKSMITH to allow him into my photo-lab and studio. (he told the locksmith he simply lost his "key")

When he immediately started loading EVERYTHING from my lab-studio into trailers, the LOCKSMITH CALLED POLICE.

The Police came, but even thought they had told him "you are going to jail" .... they suddenly C-H-A-N-G-E-D T-H-E-I-R M-I-N-D, and decided it was a "civil" matter because he convinced them we were "partners", (we were not).

So the police simply WATCHED him load EVERYTHING ... (business records and file-cabinets, computers, a 15 phone-bank system, cameras, lighting, backgrounds, sample photo displays and albums, even desks and chairs). He even got a box that contained 10 years of my "customers" CREDIT CARD RECEIPTS (with ALL their CC numbers on the receipts).

Believe it or not, the police even found out that he had NO DRIVERS LICENSE, and NONE of the trailers were licensed, so they again WARNED him that he "could not drive the vehicles". But the police eventually got "tired" of simply "watching" him ... and left. He immediately "left" also, with ALL my equipment and business records in his trailers.

The police refused to even take a "Theft" Police Report because they claimed it was a "civil" matter and to "handle it myself" ...

Believe me ... IF they had told me earlier to "handle it myself" ... I WOULD HAVE ... with the help of a couple of close friends ... Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson.

I even have another close friend ... called Mr. LEAD PIPE. (Did you know lead-pipes "bend" when wrapped over the top of someones head ???)

I sued the police the police, they admitted "watching" everything, BUT ... I found out they have "immunity" and could not sue them.

I won a $2 Million judgement from the guy who did it ... but he was/is long gone and I have not seen or heard from him since. (and he does not have $2 million anyway ... he works completely underground)

I got the Bank corrected pretty quickly, but the USPS was a nightmare since I had to deal with Washington DC fraud division and all my "business records" I needed to prove my point, had been stolen by the other guy.

Oh BTW, after he stole all my business records, he also turned me into IRS and State SALES TAX .... I had NO RECORDS to fight with.

I never recovered, I had a heart attack from all the stress, and never fully recovered the business. When "digital" came, I could not afford the new investments required.

--
Thanks for reading .... JoePhoto

( Do You Ever STOP to THINK --- and FORGET to START Again ??? )
 
That's a heartbreak story Joe, horrible.

Bottom line is, one can be alert about fraud but there is little protection against rare cases of anti sociopaths. Types that have good and social appearances but lack social empathy. Madoff is one of most famous case. The smart ones learn from young how to mimic social behavior and live up to social expectations. As they lack social empathy, frauding their so called friends is as easy as robbing a tourist for a crackhead.
 
But I am not sure I misunderstood Michael J.
Yes, I know it is a scam.

I was mostly suggesting ways for any future sales - be cause she didn't seem to have anything set up to sell her photos.
He was suggesting a certified check, and sending an invoice.
Having them send her a certified check does not give them any information about her than is already in a phone book. What it would really do is get them to go away, because they are not about to send anybody any money or any personal information about themselves.
Certified Checks used to be secure, but obviously not any more.
What's not secure? You deposit the check, wait for it to clear, e-mail the image.
You would have to wait about 2 MONTHS. A bank will "clear" a check in a few days, yet it can STILL COME BACK up to 6-8 weeks later.
So? You are missing my point - they aren't going to send a check - it's a scam, remember?

And even if they did send a $150 check, just stick it in the bank and wait for the FBI to show up. :) Send the image after the check clears and the FBI gives her their thumbs up. It's not like the OP needs the money to live on.
A friend of mine deposited a "Dow Chemical Co." check, it cleared, he spent the money.

The FBI showed up 2 months later and arrested him. They gave him 3 days to "replace" every penny or he was going away for a couple of years.
I'm sure there's more to this story. Did he steal the check? Was the check for $150?

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.
 
But I am not sure I misunderstood Michael J.
Yes, I know it is a scam.

I was mostly suggesting ways for any future sales - be cause she didn't seem to have anything set up to sell her photos.
He was suggesting a certified check, and sending an invoice.
Having them send her a certified check does not give them any information about her than is already in a phone book. What it would really do is get them to go away, because they are not about to send anybody any money or any personal information about themselves.
Certified Checks used to be secure, but obviously not any more.
What's not secure? You deposit the check, wait for it to clear, e-mail the image.
You would have to wait about 2 MONTHS. A bank will "clear" a check in a few days, yet it can STILL COME BACK up to 6-8 weeks later.
So? You are missing my point - they aren't going to send a check - it's a scam, remember?
I agree with you. In this case they would never send a check. (Actually in this case they said they would "wire" the money WHEN SHE GAVE THEM HER BANK-ACCOUNT INFO.)

BUT ... I am sure you are aware that one of the more common scams is to indeed actually send a "Certified" check for MORE than the amount; asking for a "refund" of the extra over-payment.

It "clears" ... and you send them back real-cash for the overpayment, only to later find the original was no-good and you have to replace all.

I used to conduct Photo Workshops, and a guy notified me that his company only issued him one (large) "Vacation Check" that he had to use for everything.

My workshop fee was $1600. He offered to send me the "Vacation" check, I would keep my $1600, (plus an extra $100 for my trouble) ... and refund him the difference so he could pay for Airline, Car Rental, Hotel ... etc.
And even if they did send a $150 check, just stick it in the bank and wait for the FBI to show up. :) Send the image after the check clears and the FBI gives her their thumbs up. It's not like the OP needs the money to live on.
A friend of mine deposited a "Dow Chemical Co." check, it cleared, he spent the money.

The FBI showed up 2 months later and arrested him. They gave him 3 days to "replace" every penny or he was going away for a couple of years.
I'm sure there's more to this story. Did he steal the check? Was the check for $150?
My buddy had sold a car (for $5000). The buyer said he worked for Dow Chemical, and was a member of their CREDIT UNION. The check was supposed to be from his account at the credit-union. The bank said the check was good, cashed it .... gave him the money .... until the FBI showed up to inform him, (with handcuffs) that the check was counterfeit; 2 months later.

Like I mentioned, after he convinced the FBI that the check had been given to him by another guy, they gave him 3 days to refund all the money, or he still was going to be held responsible.

(I think the buyer had even given a fictitious name, so I don't believe they ever found him. The FBI's main interest was getting the money back to the bank. The "stolen" car was then a matter for local police and the guy was apparently from out of town/state; and probably had means of changing VIN number for whatever registration he may have done. Remember, these guys are GOOD, they do it every day. They are pro-scammers.)
--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.
--
Thanks for reading .... JoePhoto

( Do You Ever STOP to THINK --- and FORGET to START Again ??? )
 
Joe, why don't you read Andrea's comment again? There is nothing there to suggest that she doesn't understand. In fact it's you who hasn't understood.

She was, in effect, commenting on how the scammers would do better to "offer" a more realistic price which would attract even more victims. They have nothing to lose by "offering" more realistic amounts.
Just to let you know that Andrea is most likely a "he" than a "she", considering that it is a normal male name in Italy.

-MaxiMax
 
Just a quick question about bank info being confidential.

My bank info is printed right on my checks: account number, routing, etc.
Checks are being given out right and left to vendors and to pay bills.

Does this mean that with each check I am giving out info to steal money from my account?
I understand (a little sadly!!!)

It's a curious tecnique to say they can pay only few money for your image, if they'll not pay it at all. I think that, in the same position of the scammer, I would offer a "regular" price. But perhaps this scam is not aimed to photographers but to photo amateurs... (my image was seen on flickr...)

Anyway, really thanks for your replies!
sorry for my english... and my ignorance

bye
Andrea
Excuse me Andrea ... you still don't seem to get it. They are NOT interested in your photo. It has NOTHING to do with your photo.

You photo I am sure is excellent .... but please believe that THEY NEVER EVEN LOOKED AT IT. You were nothing but a "name" that they got from the site.

Believe that they sent the same message to EVERYONE.

The ONLY thing they want is your "Bank Account" info.

I repeat ... the ONLY thing they want is your "Bank Account" info.

Once they have your Bank Account info, they can withdraw EVERYTHING from it ... EVERYTHING !!!

Do you understand .... EVERYTHING !!!

I know that you may be flattered that it seems like someone wants to buy your photo. But this is a very common scam, and we have ALL gotten them.

They succeed cause MANY people are IGNORANT and GULLIBLE.

You did the RIGHT THING by "asking" here.

I don't mean to be blunt, but your response indicates that you still didn't understand. This was not meant to "photographers" at all ... (amateur or not) ... IT WAS INTENDED FOR "SUCKERS" who are stupid enough to send them their "Bank Account" info so they can STEAL all your money !!!

I hope you understand now.

-- Thanks for reading .... JoePhoto

( Do You Ever STOP to THINK --- and FORGET to START Again ??? )
--
Andrzej
http://lowflyingbananas.zenfolio.com/
 
Just a quick question about bank info being confidential.

My bank info is printed right on my checks: account number, routing, etc.
Checks are being given out right and left to vendors and to pay bills.

Does this mean that with each check I am giving out info to steal money from my account?
A very good question. And I think the answer is YES !!!

I do know for a fact that there are a very many companies that now call me on the phone, and offer to take "payment by check" over the PHONE.

I simply do indeed give them the same numbers you describe and they agree to take only a pre-determined amount of money. I am "trusting" them to ONLY take that specific amount, and no-more. BUT ... there is nothing to stop them from doing so.

Now most of these have been places like "utility" companies or other such entities that I feel I can trust ....

AND ... it is possible that the banks only allow that power to very selected companies. The same as you have to be "credit" approved with a "merchant" account to be allowed to take Credit Card's by mail. (I used to have a "merchant" credit-card account and could take AmEx, Visa, MasterCard and Discovery either direct or by phone. Those are very common now, and I suspect most/many "pros" here have that.)

So I think the bottom line answer to your question is YES, albeit the BANK must also allow you such power; same as CC.

--
Thanks for reading .... JoePhoto

( Do You Ever STOP to THINK --- and FORGET to START Again ??? )
 
Hi
I'm working in the United States in advertising and would
like to use one of your photographs for my client. He
does not have a lot of money, but we would be willing to pay
you $150 American Dollars for unlimited, global usage
rights? Would you grant us the rights?
The easiest way for us to pay you would be to have you
submit an invoice to us along with bank wire information.
That way we can just wire the money to you.
Sounds like a typical Yahoo SPAM scam..."...bank wire information."

Sorry, it just does not fly. I've seen these before, but for different services. DON'T DO IT!

Oh yeah, someone who can advertise globally would have to have some SERIOUS cash flow. $150 would be a lint filament on a piece of lint in your pocket.
--
Dejan Smaic
http://www.sportifimages.com
 
Bank / cashiers checks can take up to 45 days to clear, and if they bounce, they will take the money back from your account --
--
Mean people suck
 
Thanks for all of these info...

Meanwhile, after this one:
Hi Andrea,
I'm working in the United States in advertising and would
like to use one of your photographs for my client (Liguria
(Italia) - La via Aurelia tra Noli e Varigotti). My client
does not have a lot of money, but we would be willing to pay
you $150 American Dollars for unlimited, global usage
rights? Would you grant us the rights?
The easiest way for us to pay you would be to have you
submit an invoice to us along with bank wire information.
That way we can just wire the money to you.


I received this second e-mail:

Hi Andrea,
I sent the below email a few weeks ago and haven't heard
back from you. Do you think I would be able to use your
photo? Please let me know as I have a deadline this month.
Thanks!


Like for the first one, there's a pretty good italian translation of the message after it...

Ahh, I think the photo could reasonably be this one in my galllery on flickr (other two shots have the same name)
You can see it here with a postprocessing far from optimal...



and...

I know I'm probably saying an eresy... but isnt'it a viable way to receive (in hypotesis, obvious!) these 150$ through paypal? Isnt'it safe enough?

thanks to everyone of you

Ps: yes. I'm a male (only in very rare cases females in Italy have the name andrea")

bye!
 

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