New FF Sony camera. Great news for Nikon user

Yep I agree. The 850 meets my more limited enthusiast needs but I'll wait a while to see (November or so) where Nikon goes. I put more of my money into lenses. I just don't have the budget to play the camera upgrade game a great deal. My last major body spend was to buy the D200 new. Since then I decided that my glass was more important. I'd prefer a Nikon with similar specs to the 850 since I already have a nice wide (20-35mm) and the 80-200mm af-s and 80-400 VR.

Ahh... I didn't know their 28-75 was the Tamron. Not that that's bad but I'll be curious to see how it fairs on full frame at that pixel level. The thing holding me back with Sony is the cost of their good glass. Those cost a pretty penny.
...but when you compare the optical construction and physical characteristics, it looks like it may be just that: a rebranded Tamron 28-75/2.8. Lending even more credibility is why would any new standard zoom design start 28mm, which hasn't been "wide" since the mid-90s. :-)

Anyhoo, I suppose it if delivers the goods optically, it's all good. But at $800, it had better do a lot of things much better than the $275 Tamron.
They are understandably not competing with Nikon (they are often partners in sensor development, after all), but very aggressively attacking Canon on value-per-dollar. When the eventual Nikon D700X/D800 comes to market, its features and performance will target an entirely different group of users than the cost-conscious full-frame aspirants Sony is targeting with the A850 and its (apparently) restyled and rebranded Tamron 28-75/2.8 "kit" zoom.

Assuming the lens lineup meets your needs, the a850 looks like a tremendous value for landscape and studio photographers as well as hobbyists/enthusiasts making the transition from 35mm film. For these folks, there won't be any perceived limitations at all in the a850. A smart move, I think, by Sony, especially if they are just about ready to take the wraps off an a900 successor (or even a model above it, as they've stated that a truly professional Alpha is coming) just in time to steal some thunder from Canon's seemingly-imminent 1DsIV announcement. Wouldn't that be fun?!?
Or who might like to shoot landscapes. I don't need 5 fps or collosal high ISO for that. The resolution however would be most welcome.
The only folks cross-shopping these cameras, I suspect, are those who really have no idea what they need from a camera, and they'll always be chasing whatever's newest.
Now Nikon has no choice, but release D700x at a really competitive price.
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The Minolta 28-75 was also a Tamron at it's foundation, but is was proven to be a better performer. Hopefully the Sony will be more like the Minolta.
 
Now Nikon has no choice, but release D700x at a really competitive price.
The a900 obviously had no bearing whatsoever on the cost of the D3x, I doubt Nikon will worry too much about the a850.

If Sony (or anyone) released a full frame camera in for less than what we're seeing APS cameras going for, everyone would definitely be affected. Right now though, $2000 is significant, and good on Sony for getting there with a full-frame, but really doesn't need to affect anything. If you need the resolution, buy the a850, if you need the speed and AF system, you get the d300. Two different needs, apples and oranges, etc, etc.

The a850 has the same image quality as the a900 and we already know Nikon has improved on that with the "same" sensor. Nikon still has the far superior autofocus system. A d700x could easily be justified at $3500 or higher.
 
Now Nikon has no choice, but release D700x at a really competitive price.
The a900 obviously had no bearing whatsoever on the cost of the D3x, I doubt Nikon will worry too much about the a850.

If Sony (or anyone) released a full frame camera in for less than what we're seeing APS cameras going for, everyone would definitely be affected. Right now though, $2000 is significant, and good on Sony for getting there with a full-frame, but really doesn't need to affect anything. If you need the resolution, buy the a850, if you need the speed and AF system, you get the d300. Two different needs, apples and oranges, etc, etc.

The a850 has the same image quality as the a900 and we already know Nikon has improved on that with the "same" sensor. Nikon still has the far superior autofocus system. A d700x could easily be justified at $3500 or higher.
As Iliah will point out, the D3x has better DR than the A900/A850, but the A900/A850 has better spectral properties, so "improved" may be a stretch. Maybe just "different."
 
Kerry, the A850 is certainly competitive in specs to its competition, especially the 5Dii.
I agree with you. In my initial post, I stated that it might be worth adding to a nikon kit. So, where's the beef?

My initial post and all subsequent posts are only directed to the notion that the a850 is going to force nikon to do anything, like lower prices on existing models or bring out a direct competitor. The point is that nikon doesn't compete at this price level, with like cameras. Both the d300 and d700 have pro AF and other features that make them cost more than the competitors. So what? Why would this sony model make any difference to nikon? There's no reason to believe it would.

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But non of this makes D700 or A900/A850 bad.
Never said they were. That's just your sony fanboy defensiveness, reading stuff in my posts that isn't there.
In either way - you like Nikon - great, stay with it. But bashing another system is just pointless and makes you look like a fanboy.
LOL. Please show me where I bashed the 850 or sony. I specifically stated that it might be worth adding to a nikon kit, in my first post. Of course, you skip right over that, fanboy. :)

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I thought Nikon lenses worked on Sony cameras, did they go proprietary? I don't know anything about Sony now ever since I ditched my old one. If you need more megapixels and want to pay less for a cheaper body, get the Sony. If you want a quality camera that can take a beating and keep on ticking with superior ergonomics, get a Nikon. How's the AF on the Sony compared to the new Canon cameras? I'm not a gear snob or a fanboy, I've just always liked Nikon better...
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I don't get how they can get away with writing something like that.

They make conclusions looking at only a few attributes/features. It's like comparing cars based on their horsepower and size of engine alone. Year right, that's how people make their decision buy a camera system.

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You keep talking about "Bare Bones" "Bare Bones" as if it's some kind of virus, have you not seen or used Leica cameras?
Features and performance drive the business. More features and performance = more cost. Lots of folks don't want a leica, or any other bare bones camera. That's why the high end nikon and canon models are selling so well.
Less IS definetely more be realistic for an experienced photographer all you need is
Nah, I don't buy that. The d5000 is less. I don't see droves of people in this forum dumping their cameras to replace them with d5000 bodies. The d300 and d700 are the most capable cameras that I've ever used. Why would anyone give that up, if that's what they wanted to begin with? :)
Your entire post was that you already have a D300 and D700 so the sony camera to you is irrelevant. Again is not about "you" is about how the Sony pricing and sensor affect the market and I think it affects it in positive way.
It isn't about me. It's about this market segment, of which I am a part. I think that I'm a pretty average guy in this market segment. If I'm not interested in losing features and performance, I can't imagine that there are a lot of other people in this market segment that would. After all, we bought or want to buy, the d300, the d700, etc. Why would we suddenly want to settle for less?

The point now, is as it always has been. The 850 doesn't compete on features. I'd much rather have a d700x than either of the sony FF cams. That is not because they're bad cameras, it's because I expect a certain level of performance capability and am willing to pay for it.

Truthfully, I've considered the a900, but it's just too expensive to buy the cam and the lenses that I'd want to use with it. It would almost be cheaper to buy the d3x. That would certainly hold true for a d700x model that nikon could put out. I'm not going to suddenly buy a sony because the d700x is $4k.

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I don't know. I think if they came out with it already, they could have pushed the envelope by getting close to $4K for a 24MP D700 equivalent. But, we're getting close to the end of the year, and Sony comes out with this new model for under $2K. Granted, it doesn't have some of the great features as the D700 body, but Nikon's main argument for the premium was the 24MP sensor.

Remember in the film days when pro-grade bodies with strong AF and weather-sealing could be had for under $2K? And, that was for the entire camera!

Don't get me wrong. I want the D700x, and I'm a Canon shooter. I'm just sitting here wondering if they are ever going to come out with it. But, if they do, I don't know that they can get $2K more than Sony or $1500 more than Canon just for the body build and so forth. They can't use the argument of sensor costs at this point.

I think Nikon would do well to try and get $3500 US for the D700x with the price of the D700 dropping to around $2K. I'd pay that much for it, but I don't know that it's worth any more than that. I don't expect it's going to have a 100% viewfinder like the D3X. So, I guess we'll just wait and see, unless I break down and get the 5D MKII.

Hurry Nikon! I'm not waiting forever.
Nikon will release the D700x at the price they had planned from the start. Probably around 4.000 $. And many people will buy it and be happy for a long time.

Some people (like me) would be much happier with a 16-18 MP camera in a D700 body.
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It isn't about me. It's about this market segment, of which I am a part. I think that I'm a pretty average guy in this market segment. If I'm not interested in losing features and performance, I can't imagine that there are a lot of other people in this market segment that would. After all, we bought or want to buy, the d300, the d700, etc. Why would we suddenly want to settle for less?
I think you're right, and I'd suggest I am also a part of this market segment, and it really depends on the shooter. A year or two ago, I was begging for a high MP 35mm body that was lower in price, and, coming from medium format, I would have bought such a camera for $3K if it only had an aperture/shutter control, mirror lock up, and maybe AF. The A900 ended up being much more. Outside of the AF, the A900 and D700 are pretty competitive in features, and I'd suggest that the in-body IS negates the AF advantage for some. Heck, I never shoot over 1fps with my A900. Now, I am hoping for an even simpler, smaller 24MP FF camera for under $1K as a travel solution. They can even leave out AF. lol.
 
The only folks cross-shopping these cameras, I suspect, are those who really have no idea what they need from a camera, and they'll always be chasing whatever's newest.
No, I know exactly why I want a 24MP camera. Having post processed my 2nd photographer's Canon 5DII files I understand what the applications of a 24mp files are very well and what post processing opportunities and downfalls there are.

David

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Features and performance drive the business.
Really? the #1 business driver............PRICE............. :-)

What's the #2? ........................ MegaPixesls!

Consumers will look at these two things before anything else.
Less IS definetely more be realistic for an experienced photographer all you need is
Nah, I don't buy that. The d5000 is less.
Kerry, you're comparing apples to potatoes, but if you want to make it a realistic comparison, the D5000 will probably outsell the D300 5 to 1
Your entire post was that you already have a D300 and D700 so the sony camera to you is irrelevant. Again is not about "you" is about how the Sony pricing and sensor affect the market and I think it affects it in positive way.
It isn't about me. It's about this market segment, of which I am a part of

I think that I'm a pretty average guy in this market segment. If I'm not interested in > losing features and performance, I can't imagine that there are a lot of other people > in this market segment that would.
Kerrry, let me give you an "average guy" who two years ago purchased a D60 Kit at Costco for $700 and now loves photography and he can't afford to upgrade to FF but he can afford to upgrade to a D300 for $1,600. Guess what? for $400 more he can get Full Frame, 24 MP, it's an easy call. The average guy can scratch an extra $400 for the upgrade , no way he can scratch an extra $1,000 , especially at 12MP.

The Sony camera is market force, nikon will either have to re-price accordingly or see their market share errode.
 
I don't see how that sony would affect the price of a d700x. It's a stripped
down, bare bones camera. If you want high MP and don't care about any
other features...
I shoot mostly landscape/buildings/etc. and no sports, etc. so this is perfect. I don't need the fast AF, etc. 95% viewfinder coverage is a bummer though but not a big deal.

Too bad it is not a F-Mount body :)
 
I don't see how that sony would affect the price of a d700x. It's a stripped
down, bare bones camera. If you want high MP and don't care about any
other features...
I shoot mostly landscape/buildings/etc. and no sports, etc. so this is perfect. I don't need the fast AF, etc. 95% viewfinder coverage is a bummer though but not a big deal.

Too bad it is not a F-Mount body :)
A850 is a 98% VF. From everything I'm hearing, it is nearly impossible to tell the difference between it and the 100% A900.
 
The point is that Nikon FF cameras are going to become way cheaper in the months ahead, thanks to Sony.
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Thierry
 
Canon and Nikon being left to themselves would have the market divided between FF at $2,500 and up, and DX below.

Sony has changed that. FF at $2,000 MSRP means ~$1,800 street price, barely more than a D300s.

The impact will not only be cheaper FF cameras from the Canikon group, as many have mentioned, but also cheaper high-end DX cameras.

In these days of economic pain, a name is not enough to sell a camera: buyers look at value.

And right now (but not for long: Canon & Nikon will have to react) value for an FF camera is with Sony.
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Thierry
 
If Nikon does not come out with a D700x reasonably priced, I will be selling my Nikon lenses. Nikon may think it is now competing with Canon since it has been behind for so long but from the consumer to semi pro, Sony will be a force to reckoned with once Sony gets the noise down.
Now Nikon has no choice, but release D700x at a really competitive price.
 
I'm talking about anyone cross-shopping one camera obviously designed for high resolution with relatively static subject matter against one that, by all indications, will be tailored more toward action-oriented subjects. Granted the folly of this all is that no one know how the D700x/D800 will be specified when/if it manifests.
The only folks cross-shopping these cameras, I suspect, are those who really have no idea what they need from a camera, and they'll always be chasing whatever's newest.
No, I know exactly why I want a 24MP camera. Having post processed my 2nd photographer's Canon 5DII files I understand what the applications of a 24mp files are very well and what post processing opportunities and downfalls there are.

David

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