SX10 IS has terrible picture quality!

I want to thank all of you for helping me decide what to do with SX10IS.

Some of the pictures you posted were really good and made me think twice before returning SX10IS.

Unfortunately, each time I saw a nice picture made by SX10 I was aware of how much noise it had and how much better it would look like if taken with A620.

The review I mistakenly referred to was NOT on dpreview.com, it was on digitalcamerareview.com:

http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/default.asp?newsID=3789&review=canon+powershot+sx10

The quote:

"And if you can manage to shoot without going above ISO 200 you can make big enlargements without worry of ISO noise possibly raining on your image parade."

...is really without any merit, compared to Canon A620.

I guess today there is no replacement for Canon A620, no matter how much I pay, I will always get worse picture quality.

It would be really interesting to see what some of you that have SX10, would say after taking same pictures with A620. ;)

Here are the images we compared again:



--a620



--sx10is



--a620



--sx10is

Best regards,
Damir
 
The review I mistakenly referred to was NOT on dpreview.com, it was on digitalcamerareview.com:

http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/default.asp?newsID=3789&review=canon+powershot+sx10
I assumed you were talking about this review
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/Q109superzoomgroup/page2.asp
I guess today there is no replacement for Canon A620, no matter how much I pay, I will always get worse picture quality.
I think you may have too much confidence in the A620.

These two models both have better image quality and less densely packed sensors and one sells for under US$100.
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/fujifilm/finepix_f40_fd
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/dp2
 
Damn, I was sure I've seen it on dpreview but couldn't find it afterwards :)

You are right there are better cams than A620. It is the best point and shoot camera I've seen (own), and feature wise it has always been most balanced (basing my judgement on the reviews.)

I've seen many other digicams but the canon's menu system, ease of use and image quality were always better.

Anyway, thanks to the people of this forum I'll give a chance to some other brand. :)
The review I mistakenly referred to was NOT on dpreview.com, it was on digitalcamerareview.com:

http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/default.asp?newsID=3789&review=canon+powershot+sx10
I assumed you were talking about this review
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/Q109superzoomgroup/page2.asp
I guess today there is no replacement for Canon A620, no matter how much I pay, I will always get worse picture quality.
I think you may have too much confidence in the A620.

These two models both have better image quality and less densely packed sensors and one sells for under US$100.
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/fujifilm/finepix_f40_fd
http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/dp2
 
I, like most that have bought this camera, needed that fantastic zoom! I spend a lot of time in the NWR wildlife refuges on bicycle and have spent countless hours getting good but NOT National Geography quality photos. I couldn't do this with any other type of camera and all of this power and versatility in one small, manageable package for about 1/2 weeks pay. You couldn't do that ten years ago! Someday, soon, I think they will be able to put a really good sensor in this type of camera and then you will really have something. What will happen to all of that expensive glass out there?
 
Comparing A620 to SX10 was the whole point of the discussion.

SX10 is a new Canon camera, praised for its good pictures.
Yes it has, comparing with other superzoom cameras with similiar/same sensor size, not comparing to the A620 which has G series rated optics and sensor used in previous top of the range models i.e. G6, Ixus700/750
A620 is an old cheaper Canon camera that is not being made any more and which made much better pictures.
Older camera does not mean they'll produce less image quality
All those people that are happy with SX10 would throw it away without a thought if they could just see how good were the pictures made by cheaper and older A620.
No they won't, I guess you haven't understood the versitility of the SX10 over the A620. What if I need a lot of zoom?? What is i need to shoot at ISO more than 400? What if I need IS?
That's where camera reviewers should come in and advise people to check the older models and not just say "the new model is great, it makes good pictures."
Yes they should, but again if you compare the SX10 with older superzooms, it already offers more.
I bought it because of the review, thinking: "If they wrote the same good stuff for SX10 as they did for A620, I should buy it"
DPreview also wrote some good stuff about the Nikon D3X, Canon 1Ds3, Panasonic LX3, Canon G10......... Why not buy those? DPreview does compare with similar type of models, but not models that is in a different range let alone 4 years older.
I did buy it and found out that although the review did say the same thing it said for A620 it wasn't objective at all, older camera made better pictures and the reviewer missed it completely.
No, they haven't, no where in the review did they say that the new camera has better image quality than the old one, again they compare similar type of camera not older ones. They do mention the fact that sensor size and pixel pitch does have an effect on noise. Put it this way, you've found yourself a bargin 4 years ago, it doesn't mean that the SX10 is a rubbish camera because it can do a lot of things that the A620 can't even dream of (I have a A620 by the way)
P.S.

I understand the sensor size/pixel count/noise level . The question was of a tongue in a cheek type, as in "why in a world would Canon cram more pixels within a smaller sensor?" Of course we know the answer, more mega pixels spells better sales, never mind the picture quality.
Yes more pixels do give us the preception of progression, however a lot of people don't realise that good image quality was achieved years ago, what we're buying is just more versitile cameras with higher and higher hit rates because of technologies like big zooms and IS
My posted pictures were all 100% zoom. The noise was more than obvious, pictures do not look like photographs, they look like paintings made by a nervous guy :)
Yes they do, and you're not the only one to see them and remember Canon is not alone in this either (other manc also use similar/same sensor technology)
I would be thankful if someone could tell me what camera TODAY has the quality of the old Canon A620. That kind of information is what an objective review should provide by maintaining the same quality points system for all tests. :)
If you're talking about lens sharpness and noise level, the closest will be the G10 from Canon, Panasonic LX3 and Fuji F200FD
That way one could say "ah ok, SX10 is good, but not as good as the old Canon cameras with much less mega pixels.
That's up to whether the manufacturer want to produce the older cameras. I want a 7mp 1/1.8 inch sensor with a IS, along with hotshoe and swivel screen. But hey guess what they don't make one because things move on for the better.

"
How can SX10 with smaller sensor have 10Mpixels while A620 with larger sensor has "only" 7.1 Mpixels?
You need to do some research and learn the terminology of digital cameras before making such statements. When talking about the size of a sensor, it is the physical size being referred to. The number of pixels refers to the resolution of the sensor. All other things being equal, the higher the resolution of a given size sensor, the higher the noise level. When you compare a larger sensor, with lower resolution (such as the A620) to the SX10, you place the SX10 at an immediate disadvantage. You are not comparing apples to apples.

If you realize how many people are very happy with the SX10, it should be obvious that we are not all wrong and you are the only one that is right. When we see statements from you that show your lack of knowledge of equipment, it only causes people to have little confidence in anything else you claim or trust your ability to test a camera.

Steve
 
sx1 & sx10 do have horrible image quality. I own sx1 and was really shocked how bad the image quality is and how much noise is present even at its base ISO.

Pictures posted here have some heavy duty noise reduction/pp applied on them, and some don't even have exif, so I am having hard time believing in those who claim images straight from their camera is that good. I have few older p&s canons and some new and old sony ones and they all have considerably better image quality even in bright light conditions with low iso settings.

All in all, I agree with the OP that sx10 (assuming its image quality is similar to sx1) has horrible image quality. They show way too much chromatic aberration as well. I really like movies coming out of my sx1, but i hate its pictures. I have a D700 for anything serious but I really wish my sx1 had much better image quality. So I hear you OP. You can take a look at D5000 (be careful with the recall) or XTi if you want some decent image quality (unfortunately you won't get that extra reach these super zooms provide without paying an arm and a leg)
 
That's not just a "bit" of noise in the hummer picture; it's a lot for the circumstances. And it shows just how poor the noise factor in the SX10 is at ISO 200. With its muddled details and high noise it's really not a good image.

As I said, though, the Iguana (at ISO 80) is quite good. Clean and detailed.

Obviously with the SX10, the ISO needs to be kept as low as possible, which is a good recommendation for all small sensor cameras.

Rick
Both 100% crops.

The first one is at ISO 80, so quite clean, the second at ISO 200, so it contains a bit of noise.
 
I owned the S5 IS which was a great camera - sharp images but not so great at high ISO. However, there were only a few times when I need NeatImage to fix up an image.

Anyway, I had high hopes for the SX10 but was concerned about how soft a good number of the sample photos were. I kept looking around and was always coming to the same conclusion - softer images, almost a tad mushy. I can see it in the samples posted in this thread.

So, I ended up buying one anyway and quickly determined that, yes, the images were soft and lacked the punch I got from my S5. So, after playing with it for a couple of hours, I returned it to the store. I was not happy with the results, even though it was handling higher ISOs a bit better than the S5.

Put the S5 lens with Digic IV and it might a be a better package.

Anyway, I'll wait for and try out the upcoming SX20 (or whatever iit will be called) and hope for the best!

--
Best Regards,

Rusty
G10
 
Damir,

I think there's a bit of a mystery here. I looked up the DPReview on the A620, and then found data on the SX10IS in the review on the SX1IS. I split the screen and compared noise levels on the A620 and the SX10IS, and found them quite comparable, including the measured noise levels in the graphs.

However, in your shots the noise from the SX10IS is clearly higher, and the noise reduction artifacts are also quite noticeable (the water color effect). This implies to me that the SX10IS is actually shooting at ISO 400 or possibly even 800, but I also know that you set your ISO to a lower number.

This suggests that you have Auto ISO Shift in the main menu turned ON. If it is, the camera will shift the ISO to a higher level in low light. Is this a possiblity? See page 85 in your manual.

If it was ON, then turn it off and try again.
--
Jerry
 
Thank you Gerarld.

I tried taking photos with manual settings (ISO 80, everything perfectly set) but it always produced that kind of noise (more or less visible, but it was always there).

Outdoors, indoors, it's was the same.

Unfortunatelly I cannot do more tests, I returned it and got my refund.

I am no professional, but when I saw how bad the photos were I couldn't believe it, so I got my old battered A620 and took the same photos. The results you've seen here...

I do have more photos on the SIM card (outdoors, flash, no flash etc.). I'll upload a couple of them tonight... :)
Damir,

I think there's a bit of a mystery here. I looked up the DPReview on the A620, and then found data on the SX10IS in the review on the SX1IS. I split the screen and compared noise levels on the A620 and the SX10IS, and found them quite comparable, including the measured noise levels in the graphs.

However, in your shots the noise from the SX10IS is clearly higher, and the noise reduction artifacts are also quite noticeable (the water color effect). This implies to me that the SX10IS is actually shooting at ISO 400 or possibly even 800, but I also know that you set your ISO to a lower number.

This suggests that you have Auto ISO Shift in the main menu turned ON. If it is, the camera will shift the ISO to a higher level in low light. Is this a possiblity? See page 85 in your manual.

If it was ON, then turn it off and try again.
--
Jerry
 
I suggest that only people who have taken a simple test, which certifies that they're capable of using a digital camera, are allowed to publicly voice their opinion on a camera and return said camera if they don't like it.

How in the world can you base your findings on two such irrelevant images? A 20x superzoom on auto mode is not the camera to take pictures of a pine cone inside in low light. Use the SX10 for shooting wildlife in good light or for taking pictures at a car race etc etc etc. For the right setting, superzooms can't be beat, in other situations they do not perform well. If you really thought such a specialized camera was in fact an allrounder camera, perfect for every situation imaginable, then you failed the test and really shouldn't be annoying your dealer with a return. Sorry for the harsh words but your actions are comparable to those of the great folks who surf the internet without antivirus and firewall software installed and sooner or later become part of a huge SPAM bot which hassles us all.
 
I suggest that only people who have taken a simple test, which certifies that they're capable of using a digital camera, are allowed to publicly voice their opinion on a camera and return said camera if they don't like it.

How in the world can you base your findings on two such irrelevant images? A 20x superzoom on auto mode is not the camera to take pictures of a pine cone inside in low light. Use the SX10 for shooting wildlife in good light or for taking pictures at a car race etc etc etc. For the right setting, superzooms can't be beat, in other situations they do not perform well. If you really thought such a specialized camera was in fact an allrounder camera, perfect for every situation imaginable, then you failed the test and really shouldn't be annoying your dealer with a return. Sorry for the harsh words but your actions are comparable to those of the great folks who surf the internet without antivirus and firewall software installed and sooner or later become part of a huge SPAM bot which hassles us all.
just to add:
it's possible you bought a not working camera.
But I agree with most of words above.

A superzoom camera has some limits, and an old 3-4 Mp camera has less noise than a 10-12 Mpx camera.
 
I did all other tests too. Outside photos, with plenty of Sun, with low light, flash, no flash, automatic settings, manual settings, program, av etc etc...

Every photo showed too much noise.

I want my diploma now! :D
I suggest that only people who have taken a simple test, which certifies that they're capable of using a digital camera, are allowed to publicly voice their opinion on a camera and return said camera if they don't like it.

How in the world can you base your findings on two such irrelevant images? A 20x superzoom on auto mode is not the camera to take pictures of a pine cone inside in low light. Use the SX10 for shooting wildlife in good light or for taking pictures at a car race etc etc etc. For the right setting, superzooms can't be beat, in other situations they do not perform well. If you really thought such a specialized camera was in fact an allrounder camera, perfect for every situation imaginable, then you failed the test and really shouldn't be annoying your dealer with a return. Sorry for the harsh words but your actions are comparable to those of the great folks who surf the internet without antivirus and firewall software installed and sooner or later become part of a huge SPAM bot which hassles us all.
 
You can get your diploma as soon as you pass the final test. The test is to post genuine image files with EXIF data intact instead of screen captures from the Microsoft viewer. You need to demonstrate your competence as a photographer before you graduate.
 
Hi, there are several things you have to realize when making the comparision you're making here. First of all your A620 has an image sensor that's more than twice the size of the SX10 and has less pixels, so obviously the SX10 will be noisier. Secondly, the A620 has a better lens on it that's not compromized by a ridiculous zoom range. Third, your comparision shots aren't exposed the same: the SX10 is slightly underexposed compared to the A620 shot and quite underexposed in general. Your results will improve with better exposure.

You have to remember that the A620 was probably one of the best all-round compacts ever made, so it's hard to compare a compromized product like the SX10 IS to it. The SX10 was made for people who want a very long lens in a small package, who for some reason also want 28mm equivalent at the same time. As a superzoom compact it performs very well, but it pales in comparision to a large sensor compact such as the A6xx and Gx models in terms of pure image quality. OTOH, try getting 560mm equiv. out of the A620.

Until last week, I had very little experience in the field with compacts, but I borrowed an SX10 IS for a canoe camping trip because I didn't want to risk losing my gear (worth many times the price of said SX10). It was an eye-opening experience to say the least, as I wasn't prepared for the difference in image quality compared to my 40D, but for what it is, I think it does ok. In good daylight I found it pretty acceptable, even up to ISO 200, and this is where it should be used. It was also pretty responsive and the AF worked fairly well. I also found using M mode to be easier than with most compacts. In dim lighting or in any conditions using ISO 400+, it's ridiculously noisy and returns almost no detail or DR, but you must expect that with this kind of camera. Personally, I think I'll risk my DSLR kit next time, as I was disapointed with many dawn/dusk shots and even daylight shots won't be able to be printed 13x19, but it was a good learning experience.

So, return it if you must, but know that this is the best of the superzoom lot and other than the G10 or Panny LX3, you won't find too many better compacts. You definitely won't find anything with a similar zoom range that outperforms it either. So if you really want great IQ, just get a DSLR and be done with it. Otherwise you'll have to live with this camera's compromises and use it where and when it excels: outdoors in good lighting at ISO 80.

--
-Scott
http://www.flickr.com/photos/redteg94/
 

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