E-P1 vs Compact cameras

Hi,

I'm considering the purchase of an E-P1. My current cameras are a Canon 40D + 17-55 and a Fuji F31fd. My primary subject is my 18-month daughter who is very active. The 40D works great indoors in-low light however it's just so bulky I often don't leave it in the living room. The Fuji whilst it has a great sensor for low-light is so slow that I've given up using it for anything other than static subjects. My wife's Ixus seems quick enough to capture children indoors but obviously its low light performance isn't great. If the E-P1 is as quick as that I'd be happy.

So, with all the comment surrounding the E-P1's AF speed I was wondering where exactly it fitted. Is it as fast as your average Ixus/compact cam? Is it as dog slow as my Fuji? Or is it merely not as quick as a DSLR?

I've tried both the E-P1 (and the G1) in my local Jessops however without using it in a real world situation I don't feel able to really draw any conclusions with regard to its usability.

So, has anyone with kids replaced a small digicam (or a DSLR) with the E-P1? If so, what are your impressions with regard to speed?

Regards,

Jules.

I compared the E-P1 to my G10 yesterday in a camera store. With the E-P1, the lag between half-pressing the shutter release and the camera obtaining focus was quite noticeable. The G10 was much faster, taking maybe half the time. Focusing was otherwise accurate, and it didn't "hunt." I have an F31fd as well, but I didn't compare it with the E-P1. I know that the F31fd is slower than the G10. The E-P1 may be a bit faster than the F31fd--I don't know. But, as has been observed by others, speedy response is not the E-P1's strong suit, and DSLRs are faster than any of these cameras.

Bob

Stick with the SLR for anything but static shots. Even the g1, with its faster AF, the EVF blacks out after you take a shot and thus its impossible to do a series of shots with AF tracking (eg. your kid running around).

warrj said:

Hi,

I'm considering the purchase of an E-P1. My current cameras are a Canon 40D + 17-55 and a Fuji F31fd. My primary subject is my 18-month daughter who is very active. The 40D works great indoors in-low light however it's just so bulky I often don't leave it in the living room. The Fuji whilst it has a great sensor for low-light is so slow that I've given up using it for anything other than static subjects. My wife's Ixus seems quick enough to capture children indoors but obviously its low light performance isn't great. If the E-P1 is as quick as that I'd be happy.

So, with all the comment surrounding the E-P1's AF speed I was wondering where exactly it fitted. Is it as fast as your average Ixus/compact cam? Is it as dog slow as my Fuji? Or is it merely not as quick as a DSLR?

I've tried both the E-P1 (and the G1) in my local Jessops however without using it in a real world situation I don't feel able to really draw any conclusions with regard to its usability.

So, has anyone with kids replaced a small digicam (or a DSLR) with the E-P1? If so, what are your impressions with regard to speed?

Regards,

Jules.

Click to expand...

warrj said:

So, has anyone with kids replaced a small digicam (or a DSLR) with the E-P1? If so, what are your impressions with regard to speed?

Click to expand...

Depends what you're shooting. I've kept the Canon x0D cameras around for the 10 years I coached soccer. My wife would typically shoot 100+ photos per game. I'd do some PP in PS and put the best 50 on the team web site per game. We used fast 70-200mm f2.8 and 85mm f1.8 and 50mm f1.4 (for basketball). That being said, if the E-P1 existed then, with the choice of micro and full four thirds lenses, as well as a lot of other manual focus lenses, it would be a fine camera for limited sports photography.

The E-P1 is pretty quick compared to point and shoot cameras provided you have a fast lens. It's not really for shooting pro sports - I can't imagine NFL photographers would trade in their 1D Mark IIIs for this, but I would imagine there are people out there good enough to adapt a long lens and shoot in manual focus and get spectacular amature sports photos from long distances.

Since I've had my E-P1, I have been able to shoot photos of my kids running and jumping into the pool without any problem. It can shoot 3fps in RAW mode and for most activities, that will do the trick. I used to have the original Canon 5D which only did 3fps and I shot some very good action photos when I took it to several NFL games.

I just ordered the Sigma 30mm f1.4 four thirds lens. I can't imagine that I won't be able to capture fast movement with that lens. It will complement my 17mm f2.8 micro four thirds. I also have a Panasonic micro four thirds 45-200 on the way, which I'm hoping will add reach.

Since I just 'retired' from coaching soccer (my son is starting high school in the fall). I am going to sell my 50D and keep my 5D Mark II and my E-P1. I'm planning a trip to Seattle at the end of July and have tickets for a Mariners game. I'm only going to take the E-P1 (I normally take the 5D class camera). I'll get some action shots from the game as well as some street photograhy and give you my iimpressions after that. But so far, even with the slower 'kit' lens - the 14-42 f3.5 - f5.6, I'm able to capture action shots that I couldn't have done with a slower P&S.

The E-P1 comes very close to being that niche camera in between a P&S and a DSLR. It has a mechanical shutter, interchangable lenses and excellent pixel density ratio compared to a P&S. My only real gripe is the lack of an integrated flash. I have the same issue with the 5D Mark II. I know people say "it's a pro camera" and I have some great flashes, but it tends to sit at home when I can use the 50D with its built in flash. The difference with the E-P1 is the add on flash is quite small and very nice. I taped some tissue to the flash to diffuse the light and been able to capture some very good images with the E-P1 indoors as well.

This camera has really made it fun for me to take pictures again. I love my Canon gear, but it's a lot to lug around. The P&S cameras always come with me, but I'm never 100% happy with the images. The E-P1 is small enough to carry everywhere and has great images. I don't think you'll be unhappy with this camera Jules, provided you get faster lenses and the flash.

Hope this helps.

-Ted

--
'There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs.'
-Ansel Adams
http://www.pbase.com/tedwill

The Ricoh CX1 is very very fast, but it is not a low light camera. For all else it is very good.

Robert Deutsch said:

I compared the E-P1 to my G10 yesterday in a camera store. With the E-P1, the lag between half-pressing the shutter release and the camera obtaining focus was quite noticeable. The G10 was much faster, taking maybe half the time. Focusing was otherwise accurate, and it didn't "hunt." I have an F31fd as well, but I didn't compare it with the E-P1. I know that the F31fd is slower than the G10. The E-P1 may be a bit faster than the F31fd--I don't know. But, as has been observed by others, speedy response is not the E-P1's strong suit, and DSLRs are faster than any of these cameras.

Click to expand...

I 'remapped' the AF function to the AEL/AFL button rather than to the shutter and I can take photos very fast with the E-P1 now. I agree that DSLRs are faster in every way, but having had young kids, it's not always easy to carry the gear with you. The E-P1 is way faster than any point and shoot. I've owned the slowest (Sigma DP1) and several Fuji F series as well as the D-Lux 3 and D-Lux 4. The E-P1 starts faster, shoots faster and allows me to set up for the next shot faster than any P&S I've used. You can also turn off 'face detect' and IS and speed up auto focus. I'm finding now that I've had the camera a week that I prefer to shoot manual focus.

--
'There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs.'
-Ansel Adams
http://www.pbase.com/tedwill

Ted Williamson said:

I just ordered the Sigma 30mm f1.4 four thirds lens. I can't imagine that I won't be able to capture fast movement with that lens. It will complement my 17mm f2.8 micro four thirds. I also have a Panasonic micro four thirds 45-200 on the way, which I'm hoping will add reach.

Click to expand...

Ted,

I will be very interested to hear how the Sigma works on the EP1. I had it for several different 4/3 bodies and was never really happy with the AF speed. (Always felt the Oly lenses were faster.) I did love the f1/4 for low light though.
Steve

I have the 14-42 and in good light it can certainly hold it's own with any P&S I have used. (Last one extensively was the Canon G7.) However, as the light dims, it does slow down a little - just like every other camera.

It can't compare to a non-Live View DSLR - even the entry models. However it is better than probably every DSLR that use Live View. (Never tried the Sony version of Live View though.)

I have also read that some of the Panasonic lenses do improve the AF speed, though whether enough to justify the purchase is probably questionable. (Though the Pana lenses are supposedly better/quieter in Movie Mode.)

I also have some 4/3 lenses and in good light the kit m4/3 zoom holds it own against them. (Even the 14-54 MKII lens.)

I am not saying that the AF in the EP1 is the greatest, but it is certainly not the dog that some imply. Most of the people that are complaining are coming from DSLRs and figured the EP1 would be closer to that speed and would blow away all P&S cameras.
Steve

When you "remapped" the AF function to the AEL/AFL button vs to the shutter, I'm assuming it means you press the AEL/AFL button - do you still have to press the shutter button? Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I'm having a challenge trying to get through the learning curve on the E-P1.

Thanks!

Maria
--

Steven Wandy said:

I have the 14-42 and in good light it can certainly hold it's own with any P&S I have used. (Last one extensively was the Canon G7.) However, as the light dims, it does slow down a little - just like every other camera.

It can't compare to a non-Live View DSLR - even the entry models. However it is better than probably every DSLR that use Live View. (Never tried the Sony version of Live View though.)

I have also read that some of the Panasonic lenses do improve the AF speed, though whether enough to justify the purchase is probably questionable. (Though the Pana lenses are supposedly better/quieter in Movie Mode.)

I also have some 4/3 lenses and in good light the kit m4/3 zoom holds it own against them. (Even the 14-54 MKII lens.)

I am not saying that the AF in the EP1 is the greatest, but it is certainly not the dog that some imply. Most of the people that are complaining are coming from DSLRs and figured the EP1 would be closer to that speed and would blow away all P&S cameras.
Steve

Click to expand...

That's encouraging! I'm trying to get through the learning curve, and for me personally, it's tough. I'm coming from a Canon dslr and the LX3 - where life and photography were less complex!

Question - have you done the "remapping?" IOW - setting the AF function to the AEL/AFL botton? Or are you getting good AF as mentioned above from the default setting?

Maria

Maria

Marla said:

When you "remapped" the AF function to the AEL/AFL button vs to the shutter, I'm assuming it means you press the AEL/AFL button - do you still have to press the shutter button? Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I'm having a challenge trying to get through the learning curve on the E-P1.

Click to expand...

Depending on what 'mode' you're in when you change the settings, the AEL/AFL button will become the autofocus button. For me, I chose to do that when I'm in Manual mode, I use that button since I'm setting up for a still image. I still use the shutter button for autofocus in other modes.

Most cameras use the shutter button for autofocus. I decided to leave that function alone in AUTO mode in case I'm out at a restaurant with friends and I ask a waiter to take our picture. Most people are used to it there. I like having auto focus on another button in Manual mode because I'll be the only one using the camera in that mode.

Hope that makes sense.

--
'There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs.'
-Ansel Adams
http://www.pbase.com/tedwill

Yes, it's beginning to make sense now!

Maria
--

the focusing speed of the ep-1 is horrible in low light, at least with the kit lens. sometimes, it would not get a focus lock at all even though there is reasonable contrast. probably not good for what you are going to do with it, such as catching fast kids indoors. other than that, its great for catching anything that is not moving too fast.

I agree.. this camera with the kit zoom probably wont be any better than your F31 in low light indoors with fast moving kids running back and forth. With the 17mm prime it should be better but I doubt by much. You should to stick with your SLR in these situations and use the right tool for the job.

digdub said:

the focusing speed of the ep-1 is horrible in low light, at least with the kit lens. sometimes, it would not get a focus lock at all even though there is reasonable contrast. probably not good for what you are going to do with it, such as catching fast kids indoors. other than that, its great for catching anything that is not moving too fast.

Click to expand...

I've been using the Pen for a few days now and took iit out on the Scott Kelby Photowalk this morning, along with my K20D. The Pen is a perfect point and shoot killer. AF speed is as fast as any P&S I've used, including my Canon G9, and image quality kills any P&S, period.

I have the kit zoom and the 17mm pancake, and both have their place. The zoom is very convenient and the low light capability of the sensor (compared to a P&S) makes it fast enough. If you're indoors, the 17mm seems to be the lens to use.

The Pen compares okay to a dSLR, but isn't quite the same performance. If you compare it to a point and shoot, you'll be very happy, and won't mind leaving the dSLR at home on occasions. However, the dSLR will still be needed on occasion.

--
Russ
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rfortson/
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/russfortson
Even bad photography can be fun

I had the EP1 for two weeks. GREAT camera. It's speed to shot is just a little slower than a point and shoot. Fine for travel, and there's also tricks to focusing (such as setting the AE button to AF or using MF with the zoom) that helps.

But for kids, I stick to my rebel. The bulk of the D40 is exactly the reason I'm sticking with the rebel series.

EP1 is a great camera, but may not be able to address the "fast kids" issue.

WT21 said:

I had the EP1 for two weeks. GREAT camera. It's speed to shot is just a little slower than a point and shoot. Fine for travel, and there's also tricks to focusing (such as setting the AE button to AF or using MF with the zoom) that helps.

But for kids, I stick to my rebel. The bulk of the D40 is exactly the reason I'm sticking with the rebel series.

EP1 is a great camera, but may not be able to address the "fast kids" issue.

Click to expand...

Did you send it back or were you evaluating it?

I don't see it as a choice between a DSLR. I'm keeping my 5D Mark II AND my DL4. This camera adds to the tools I can use. I can certainly capture images from 'fast kids' with the E-P1 being 3fps, along with an f2.8 or 1.4 lens. It is more of an SLR than a P&S. It takes some getting used to shooting with the screen rather than a viewfinder, but I can shoot just as fast with this as I can with my 5D Mark II. Maybe not as fast as my 50D.

--
'There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs.'
-Ansel Adams
http://www.pbase.com/tedwill

Have others that own this camera encountered this problem?

digdub said:

the focusing speed of the ep-1 is horrible in low light, at least with the kit lens. sometimes, it would not get a focus lock at all even though there is reasonable contrast. probably not good for what you are going to do with it, such as catching fast kids indoors. other than that, its great for catching anything that is not moving too fast.

Click to expand...

--
-Photographygal

'Quit trying to find beautiful objects to photograph. Find the ordinary objects so you can transform it by photographing it.' - Morley Baer

http://picasaweb.google.com/photographygalsgallery

photographygal said:

digdub said:

the focusing speed of the ep-1 is horrible in low light, at least with the kit lens. sometimes, it would not get a focus lock at all even though there is reasonable contrast. probably not good for what you are going to do with it, such as catching fast kids indoors. other than that, its great for catching anything that is not moving too fast.

Click to expand...

--
-Photographygal

'Quit trying to find beautiful objects to photograph. Find the ordinary objects so you can transform it by photographing it.' - Morley Baer

http://picasaweb.google.com/photographygalsgallery

Click to expand...

No, I haven't encountered this. It's as good as any point and shoot out there (as it should be, as it uses the same AF technology). If you compare it to a dSLR, it won't be as good in low light, but it's certainly not horrible from my experience with both Oly lenses.

People want to compare it to a dSLR and in some ways it's similar (IQ, flexibility) but in others it's like a good point & shoot (AF, no viewfinder). To me, I was looking for a P&S killer and this is definitely it. Plus, it's just fun to shoot!

--
Russ
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rfortson/
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/russfortson
Even bad photography can be fun

Ted Williamson said:

WT21 said:

I had the EP1 for two weeks. GREAT camera. It's speed to shot is just a little slower than a point and shoot. Fine for travel, and there's also tricks to focusing (such as setting the AE button to AF or using MF with the zoom) that helps.

But for kids, I stick to my rebel. The bulk of the D40 is exactly the reason I'm sticking with the rebel series.

EP1 is a great camera, but may not be able to address the "fast kids" issue.

Click to expand...

Did you send it back or were you evaluating it?

I don't see it as a choice between a DSLR. I'm keeping my 5D Mark II AND my DL4. This camera adds to the tools I can use. I can certainly capture images from 'fast kids' with the E-P1 being 3fps, along with an f2.8 or 1.4 lens. It is more of an SLR than a P&S. It takes some getting used to shooting with the screen rather than a viewfinder, but I can shoot just as fast with this as I can with my 5D Mark II. Maybe not as fast as my 50D.

--
'There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs.'
-Ansel Adams
http://www.pbase.com/tedwill

Click to expand...

I sent mine back because my needs are specific. I was looking for good video, and I had always wanted a range-finder like compact camera. I thought the EP1 would do both, and even toyed with moving from Canon to Oly. Alas, the T1i (which is my budget -- so it was either the T1i or the EP1, not both) outpaces the EP1 in video by a long shot. But, the way m43 is headed, I think I'll end up there eventually. I love the idea of having both a DSLR and a rangefinder. Another iteration of the Pen series (EP2 or maybe one from Panny), and I may be on board to stay.