Nuthatch with FZ18 and TC-E17ED

I'm not very successful shooting smaller birds because I'm not patient enough to prepare the location and to wait. Therefore I'm carrying beside my Nikon D90 with a mounted 70-300VR also the FZ18 with a mounted Nikon TC-E17ED.

This gives me a calculated reach of 856.8 mm and that is what I need when I cannot get closer to the birds.

One reason why I like the Panasonic FZs: I can use this phantastic peace of glass with them. Here's a shot from today:



Olaf

I just added a 100% crop without any additional PP (ISO100, f/4.2, 1/400 sec, handheld) to show the outstanding quality of the TC-E17ED in combination with a Panasonic FZ:



With a DSLR you would need multiple thousand Dollars or Euro to get a lens with that reach and quality.

Olaf

Olaf,

This is a wonderful picture. It has lots of detail and great colors.

Now, I have a question... I have heard from other people as well about how good the Nikon tc-e17ed is. What is it about your picture that I should be looking at that demonstrates the Nikon lens? There are so many other factors involved like the extra reach of the FZ-18's lens and the in-camera picture processing, not to mention your personal skill as a photographer, that make it very difficult (impossible for me) to see what part the Nikon lens had in making this shot so nice. Is it simply the level of detail that you were able to attain compared to, for instance, the same shot using an Olympus TCON17?

I'm not trying to start any trouble here, I just am trying to learn something.

Thanks,
Joe
--

Joe Abbiati said:

Olaf,

This is a wonderful picture. It has lots of detail and great colors.

Now, I have a question... I have heard from other people as well
about how good the Nikon tc-e17ed is. What is it about your picture
that I should be looking at that demonstrates the Nikon lens? There
are so many other factors involved like the extra reach of the
FZ-18's lens and the in-camera picture processing, not to mention
your personal skill as a photographer, that make it very difficult
(impossible for me) to see what part the Nikon lens had in making
this shot so nice. Is it simply the level of detail that you were
able to attain compared to, for instance, the same shot using an
Olympus TCON17?

Click to expand...

I think the TC-E17ED was developed when cameras were expensive and when every pixel counted.

It is a lens that optically makes no compromises and uses the same high quality of glass that Nikon today uses for its best DSLR lenses.

What makes the difference to for example the TCON-17 ?

One year ago I tested most high quality TCs. In practice under good conditions the TCON-17 also is able to deliver comparable results. But very often other TCs add purple fringing and even if the FZ18 tries to correct it sometimes it turned into green fringing.

And in no case the TCON-17 was sharper than the TC-E17ED. And due to the diameter of 86 mm of the front lens of the TC-E17ED the lens also catches more light.

I did series of test shots with 6 different TCs with the same result: with a single exception the average of the Nikon was better than the best of the others and compared to the others with 20-50% keepers it gave me more than 90% keepers.

And by the way: the small 1.5x brother TC-E15ED with only one ED glass and only 58 mm front lens diameter had problems with light falloff at the corners, but in evrey other aspect it was better than all non Nikons.

It's simply a lens that makes no mistakes. If I'm getting bad results with it I know: it was me, the photographer.

Back to my Nuthatch: I think the TCON-17 would have had problems with the light in that situation and we would notice some kind of chromatic aberrations. And it isn't so sharp.

Olaf

...I have had mine for 2 years and can only agree, what I also notice is the the rich colours it can produce, such as the green of the lichen on the twigs in your pic! To get close to the reach of the tce17ed, you would have to buy an 80-400 VR lens for your D90 Well done and keep it up. RonS

I still have my Nikon, but it doesn't fit my G1! ;-( Very nice detail and exposure on your Nuthatch photo. I know from personal experience they don't stop for long to pose!
--
Just cruisin' ...



GeeOne, EffZeeEighteen, TeeZeeThree

Which adapter are you using to mount the TC-E17ED on your FZ18?

I've been looking for a TC-E17ED for a while now but can't seem to find one. Apparently Nikon no longer manufactures them.

Really nice shot.

Thanks for sharing.
Tim

if it would help I can post a nuthatch taken with the FZ18 and Oly TCON-17- I did notice a lot of purple fringing especially around the branches on my own shots. The only ones I have posted on Flickr are PP'd a bit, If you like I'll try and upload the originals as well. I should also add that I think mine we shot at a greater distance than Olafs so it probably wouldnt be much use as a comparison to be honest.
--
My Website

http://www.kats-korner-uk.com/index1.html

nice bird, nice picture, excellent detail
--



eFZed50, Oly TeeCON17, RaynoxDCR150 DCR250
My Galleries are at
http://picasaweb.google.com/trevorfcarpenter

--Thats a good bird pic and an even better Nuthatch pic,some one else said they don't hang around waiting either and he's right.
Thanks.

My opinion is just that.
Cameras currently in use:- Panasonic FZ30,FZ8,TZ2, Fuji S6500fd.

Joe Abbiati said:

Olaf,

This is a wonderful picture. It has lots of detail and great colors.

Now, I have a question... I have heard from other people as well
about how good the Nikon tc-e17ed is. What is it about your picture
that I should be looking at that demonstrates the Nikon lens? There
are so many other factors involved like the extra reach of the
FZ-18's lens and the in-camera picture processing, not to mention
your personal skill as a photographer, that make it very difficult
(impossible for me) to see what part the Nikon lens had in making
this shot so nice. Is it simply the level of detail that you were
able to attain compared to, for instance, the same shot using an
Olympus TCON17?

I'm not trying to start any trouble here, I just am trying to learn
something.

Thanks,
Joe

Click to expand...

Hi Jo...here is an example that shows the difference between TC's..

Pana Lt55 -vs- Nikon 17ed -vs- Olympus TC17...



--
Cheers

Rik



FZ50

Aside from the extra weight of the Nikon, I've measured the magnification in the past, and have never been able to ascribe more than 1.6X to the TCON, whereas the Nikon seems to be an honest 1.7X. I think the Nikon is also a little faster, I guess maybe its bigger front diameter lets in more light?
--
Just cruisin' ...



GeeOne, EffZeeEighteen, TeeZeeThree

Olaf, you've shown very well with this shot and others in the past the potential of this great lens. One thing that I think needs to be emphasized is that it is heavy. I, as a weakling, usually get better hand held results with the TC-E15ED. But I like to keep the TC-E17ED on the FZ30 at home just in case something interesting flies into the backyard.

BTW, I found that a Betty Crocker lid from a frosting can (if I remember correctly) works well as a cap on the Nikon HN 13 shade that many of use on the TC-E17ED. If you know of a good alternative in black, let me know, please : )



--
Vickie
Life was simpler before technology made life easier.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/myssvictoria/

A great shot, surprising detail and lovely green. The light was good too.

Tim asked about buying one? There is one on amazon for 'only' $800. Phew! Is all I can say to that.
--
Mark

Ps cheaper on ebay, $275 to start with 5days to go.

TGVoz said:

Which adapter are you using to mount the TC-E17ED on your FZ18?

I've been looking for a TC-E17ED for a while now but can't seem to
find one. Apparently Nikon no longer manufactures them.

Really nice shot.

Thanks for sharing.
Tim

Click to expand...

I'm using the Panasonic DMW-LA3 adapter tube and a stepring from 55-60 mm (available at Pemaraal). I also used it with the Pemaraal adapter tube and an additional stepring from 62-55 mm but because of the weight (625 g) I'm prefering an adapter made from one piece of metall.

Olaf

John_Reed said:

I still have my Nikon, but it doesn't fit my G1!

Click to expand...

Unfortunately I also cannot use it with my D90/70-300VR. But I'm thinking about getting also a FZ28 to use my good Nikon (TCs) and Minolta (closeup lenses) glass in future.

Olaf

ron.s said:

...I have had mine for 2 years and can only agree, what I also notice
is the the rich colours it can produce, such as the green of the
lichen on the twigs in your pic! To get close to the reach of the
tce17ed, you would have to buy an 80-400 VR lens for your D90 Well
done and keep it up. RonS

Click to expand...

From all I heard the 80-400VR is not worth the money of three times the price of the 70-300VR.

Olaf

Macromeds said:

A great shot, surprising detail and lovely green. The light was good
too.

Tim asked about buying one? There is one on amazon for 'only' $800.
Phew! Is all I can say to that.
--
Mark

Ps cheaper on ebay, $275 to start with 5days to go.

Click to expand...

Luckily in Germany nobody seems to know about the quality of this lens and I could buy two (one for 200 Euro and one for 230 Euro). The same applies to the TC-E15ED. You can get it here on EBAY for 25-40 Euro.

Some people at this forum bought two FZ50, but I think there are ways to replace it with newer and better technology and I'm still hoping, one day Panasonic also will know that they have to make a successor.

But I also think that never again somebody will make a TC of that quality. On the contrary they will build cheaper lenses and correct it by in-camera-processing.

Compared to the prices of DSLR glass it's a 1000$ lens. Two years ago amazon.de offered it new for 474 Euro.

Olaf

kittykat23uk said:

if it would help I can post a nuthatch taken with the FZ18 and Oly
TCON-17- I did notice a lot of purple fringing especially around the
branches on my own shots. The only ones I have posted on Flickr are
PP'd a bit, If you like I'll try and upload the originals as well. I
should also add that I think mine we shot at a greater distance than
Olafs so it probably wouldnt be much use as a comparison to be honest.

Click to expand...

From my experience the TC-E17ED becomes better compared to other lenses the greater the distance is. The minimal working distance is comparable long: I measured 7.3 meters in normal mode and 3.4 meters in tele macro mode with the FZ18.

The distance to the Nuthatch was approx. 8-10 meters.

Olaf

olafk said:

Macromeds said:

A great shot, surprising detail and lovely green. The light was good
too.

Tim asked about buying one? There is one on amazon for 'only' $800.
Phew! Is all I can say to that.
--
Mark

Ps cheaper on ebay, $275 to start with 5days to go.

Click to expand...

Luckily in Germany nobody seems to know about the quality of this
lens and I could buy two (one for 200 Euro and one for 230 Euro). The
same applies to the TC-E15ED. You can get it here on EBAY for 25-40
Euro.

Click to expand...

Checking.

olafk said:

Some people at this forum bought two FZ50, but I think there are ways
to replace it with newer and better technology and I'm still hoping,
one day Panasonic also will know that they have to make a successor.

Click to expand...

I'm keeping my eye out for it but not holding my breath. I have been considering a second FZ50 but can't justify having one just sit in a box.

olafk said:

But I also think that never again somebody will make a TC of that
quality. On the contrary they will build cheaper lenses and correct
it by in-camera-processing.

Click to expand...

Makes sense.

olafk said:

Compared to the prices of DSLR glass it's a 1000$ lens. Two years ago
amazon.de offered it new for 474 Euro.

Olaf

Click to expand...

--
Mark