Is my 1DMKIII finally OK?...You tell me...

PhotoKhan

Veteran Member
Messages
12,028
Solutions
7
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Cascais, PT
2 days ago I received my 1DMKIII back from Canon after sending it in for the recent announced periphery AF points campaign. This is the third intervention regarding the AF system in my camera.

Yesterday I went on to test my camera in AIS mode.

I decided to prepare a test where a series of AI Servo, Continuous speed drive modes (LOW and HI) would be used in perfect sequence, with four different lenses. The lenses used were the 70-200 f2.8L IS, the 300 f4L IS, the 24-105 f4L IS and the 135 f2L.

I elected to photograph license plates from incoming vehicles as they function as good contrast subjects which are easy to track and favor later assessment.

You'll notice that the files numbering run in perfect sequence (except for the 2 cases noted below). The "missing" files between the mid day and afternoon runs were expended in control shots.

The sequences were made in contiguous sequences to make this a "real world" test. This way, no specific runs could be specially selected based on the perceived (bad or good) performance, from a larger sample of runs. This was it.

I ran a series at mid day to cater for a subdued, "in-the shade" light at the licenses plates and a second one later in the afternoon in order to have very high contrast light cast on the plates.

These 2 runs were identical in what comes to set up and sequence.

2 photos (U3035 and U3036 ) are missing from the afternoon run due to misfire.

5 photos (U3120 to U3126) are missing later in the same afternoon run due to an attempt to shoot the following target from a previous one, while the buffer was still being emptied, forcing me to abort that sequence.

The series were prepared to allow mixed settings, regarding in-lens IS, focus point and speed drive selections according to this table:



Relevant C.Fn III settings were as follows, in line with Canon's recommendations:

C.Fn III -2 set to 0, as this function specifies the timing for determining when to switch subjects being tracked, something that was not a factor. The "0" setting corresponds to "Standard", as per Canon.

C.Fn III -3 set to 0, as this allows for AF priority for the first shot, followed by tracking priority for the issuing frames (side note: subjects were already being tracked in all series upon shutter release)

C.Fn III -4 set to 0, as this specifies that focus will be mainly in subjects in the selected AF points and I was confident I could track the licenses plates which move in a very predictable track.

Accordingly, I tagged as "user errors" the frames which are unusable where it can be clearly seen that I let the subject drift away from the selected focus points.

The ones where the same happened but were still usable, where credited to the camera.

C.Fn III -8 set to 1 (Enable left/right assist points) to account for left/right fluctuations while tracking the license plates, helping the AF by supplementing the selected AF point.

Option 2 (all surrounding assist points) was not selected since, according to Canon, option 1 is the only one that has no impact in overall processing speed ("preserves the utmost AF speed").

Other C.Fn settings were set as per my normal use or to accommodate a specific requirement in this test . For instance C.Fn III-17 was enabled to limit the bursts to 12 frames in Low Speed Continuous drive and 15 in Hi-Speed Continuous (...although I did forget to change from 12 to 15 in the afternoon series...).

The series can be seen here, featuring an initial control shot for the mid day and afternoon series and cropped copies for each frame of each series. The first shot in each series is also featured in full size, at the beginning, for reference and tagging purposes.

(I shot a second afternoon series but I will decide later if I process and analyze that third series as the 2 first ones seem enough and all this is a bit tiresome...)

http://www.pbase.com/photokhan/aismar09

I analyzed the photos and tagged them according to my evaluation: "Good" for the in-focus, perfect shots, "Acceptable" for the photos that can still be used, (especially taking into account that these tests were carried out before any AFMA of the individual lenses), "Non-acceptable" for the clearly OOF shots and "User Error" as described above.

These are the results:





This last intervention canceled all the previously stored AFMA settings in my camera, so I intend to run a similar test sequence at later stage, after these four lenses undergo new AF micro adjustments.

I would love to hear your opinions.

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
shooting the family car coming toward you at 30MPH or so.

You should get a 100 percent success rate. If you do obtain a 100 percent success rate, great ... if not, send it back to Canon. A constant velocity target is trivial for a predictive AF system that works (e.g. the AF on my 1DmkII and xxD bodies work ... 100 percent success rate tracking/shooting a constant velocity target).

The nice thing about the family car is it's a repeatable target which you can shoot under various conditions of illumination.

Regards,

Joe Kurkjian

Galleries: http://www.pbase.com/jkurkjia



SEARCHING FOR A BETTER SELF PORTRAIT
 
shooting the family car coming toward you at 30MPH or so.

You should get a 100 percent success rate. If you do obtain a 100
percent success rate, great ... if not, send it back to Canon. A
constant velocity target is trivial for a predictive AF system that
works (e.g. the AF on my 1DmkII and xxD bodies work ... 100 percent
success rate tracking/shooting a constant velocity target).

The nice thing about the family car is it's a repeatable target which
you can shoot under various conditions of illumination.
Just what I needed, another test :)

Seriously, that might be a good idea and I will probably consider it later on.

What a find about these series (and the fact that they were take in continuous sequence and with 4 different lenses) is that it is pretty much "neutral", as some uncontrollable factors will probably be canceled by others.

Overall I think these 32 sequences give a good "taste" of how AIS AF is performing.

I find this post very, VERY revealing:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1032&message=31338783

Even taking into account the probably loosely round up percentages mentioned, I would say that, from this runs, mine seems to perform worse or, at the best, equal to his friends "underperforming" camera.

PK
--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
is that obsession with perfection or what! My simple advise: rent a Nikon D3 + 70-200/2.8 and do the same test. If you results are better with the Nikon sell all the Canon gear and switch.

By the way all my gear is Canon and I am not a troll!

regards
John
 
I would just send it back and have them do a complete overhaul of
your camera.
...That is always an option...Keep sending it back and forth.

Maybe it can take some pictures on its own on the way and back.

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
I would just send it back and have them do a complete overhaul of
your camera.
...That is always an option...Keep sending it back and forth.

Maybe it can take some pictures on its own on the way and back.
If it can't perform basic functions such as multi-spot metering, I would be concerned that there are other issues that you haven't found yet.
 
...That is always an option...Keep sending it back and forth.

Maybe it can take some pictures on its own on the way and back.
Unless I misread you...why the sarcasm at the suggestion? If you're not happy with or uncertain with the AF...and if the spot metering isn't working...why WOULDN'T you send a body that retails for roughly $4000 back to make it right?

--
Keep chasing the light!

John
 
If it can't perform basic functions such as multi-spot metering, I
would be concerned that there are other issues that you haven't found
yet.
I have to get back to that one.

I never use that function and was just trying to help that poster by grabbing my camera and emulating exactly what he was describing (first checked the user guide to see if the described steps were the correct ones).

I find it utterly strange that it would not do the MS thing, exactly as described by that poster and then it turned out he was pressing the wrong button.

Far from serious, this one. I would happily trade the MS thing for a consistent 90% "in focus" shots in the above series.

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
Unless I misread you...why the sarcasm at the suggestion? If you're
not happy with or uncertain with the AF...and if the spot metering
isn't working...why WOULDN'T you send a body that retails for roughly
$4000 back to make it right?
Because that is no solution, given the fact that in 21 months the camera already went in 3 times for them to have a chance to put it right.

As far as I am concerned, this was their last opportunity, hence these tests and the ones I will redo after the AFMAs.

Then, if these are still not satisfactory and the previous lack of confidence in the AF still does not subside I will send the camera in together with the now profusely documented file, including the previous written exchanges, requesting either a new camera or a full refund.

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
I should have been more precise.

I don't need suggestions for my course of action, which has been pretty much outlined right from the beginning of this whole mess.

When I wrote "I would love to hear your opinions. " what I meant was:

Do you find the percentages and inconsistencies as presented acceptable, if this was your camera?

Thanks!

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
Then, if these are still not satisfactory and the previous lack of
confidence in the AF still does not subside I will send the camera in
together with the now profusely documented file, including the
previous written exchanges, requesting either a new camera or a full
refund.
That was sort of the point grin ...sending it back it to make it right...and in your case, i agree, after three times sending it back in might just mean a new body from them.

--
Keep chasing the light!

John
 
I should have been more precise.

I don't need suggestions for my course of action, which has been
pretty much outlined right from the beginning of this whole mess.

When I wrote "I would love to hear your opinions. " what I meant was:

Do you find the percentages and inconsistencies as presented
acceptable, if this was your camera?

Thanks!

PK
I don't, especially since you've sent it in several times, and Canon says Perfect focus in an instant and that all the photographer has to concentrate on is composition. Remember, this is a camera that is touted for its AF system (by Canon).

However, it's your camera and your money. If some people come along and say "Yes, I would accept that.", does that mean that you should? If some people come along and say "No, I wouldn't accept that", does that mean you should get rid of it and buy a different brand?

I have a feeling that you already know what you should do and that it's your frustration that has you asking for opinions. The trouble is, opinions of strangers won't take your pictures, and you'll have to decide whether the camera will do what you need and want it to and whether you're getting your money's worth.

And speaking of opinions, if it were my camera I would have demanded a refund long ago.

Good luck with whatever you decide.
--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my
skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
 
Do you find the percentages and inconsistencies as presented
acceptable, if this was your camera?
I can't recall using my camera to build spreadsheets. Usually, I use my 1D3, 5D2, and 20D cameras to take actual photographs of actual objects.

When you walk into an electronics store to compare stereo speakers, do you travel with an oscilliscope?

Good luck!
 
I did a similar series although not nearly as complex as yours. I did mine with two copies that have never been fixed to my satisfaction. My numbers were similar to yours --possibly being slightly higher unuseable percentage. I finally just gave up and sold both cameras and now I only own a 5D Mark II and 50D in Canon cameras. Both of my cameras had been back 5 times for calibration and the recalls with no real perceptable improvement except in the single shot setting. The two cameras were purchased over a year apart, but both exhibited the problems out of the box. A real irritant since I own a lot of premium L glass.
 
I don't, especially since you've sent it in several times, and Canon
says Perfect focus in an instant and that all the photographer has to
concentrate on is composition. Remember, this is a camera that is
touted for its AF system (by Canon).
True.
However, it's your camera and your money. If some people come along
and say "Yes, I would accept that.", does that mean that you should?
If some people come along and say "No, I wouldn't accept that", does
that mean you should get rid of it and buy a different brand?
No, not really, on both counts. However, well supported opinions in this case can help me to seeing things in alternate perspectives which, in turn, may enable me to further strengthen my case.
I have a feeling that you already know what you should do and that
it's your frustration that has you asking for opinions.
Not really the case, as explained above.
The trouble
is, opinions of strangers won't take your pictures, and you'll have
to decide whether the camera will do what you need and want it to and
whether you're getting your money's worth.
Being done.
And speaking of opinions, if it were my camera I would have demanded
a refund long ago.
Yes, but would they have given it to you? (...especially in the US, where, it seems, the level of Consumer Protection is not that high and big companies are more prone to litigate than to have their "arm twisted")

You see, when one goes about claiming a refund or replacement, one really must be well documented. In just does not cut it simply saying "this doesn't work".

Also, in my experience, if one is reasonable as well as systematic and resilient while building a case like this, not only will the other side appreciate the opportunities given in the transient situation at hand but, also, they will recognize us as a valuable and understanding customer in future deals.

I will need the good will of Canon Portugal for many years and I am certain that my patient but systematic approach will build a capital of respect and understanding.

It went precisely like that with my previous car, a Volvo, which I owned for 8 years. Because of the firm but considerate way I handled the initial minor complaints I had with the car in the first months of ownership, I turned the delaership where the car was serviced all those years into a "You're Welcomed" place where manager and technicians would go really out of their way to provide me with the best of services.

Even now (after going back to Honda as I could not keep wasting the price reductions provided by having a close relative working there) whenever I go there with a colleague of mine I am still warmly greeted and treated with the utmost respect, in spite of not being a customer anymore.

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
Valuable insight. Much appreciated.

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
 
shooting the family car coming toward you at 30MPH or so.
Agreed, you need something that is consistent between test sequences.

If not the family car - perhaps:
A remote controlled car that could be driven straight towards the camera. OR

Possible some target that could be pulled by motor toward you on a long line at a constant speed. Maybe even use an indoor gun-range that has the targets that can be sent back-n-forth?
 

Keyboard shortcuts

Back
Top