Digiscoping set up - Impossible focus/shake problems?

That photo you posted is incorrect. I have the TSN-DA10 and the TSN-DA4, which appears to also have the DA4-RS SHUTTER CABLE HOLDER AND AIMING SIGHT ASSEMBLY. It does not contain any shutter release cable, nor does it contain recommendations as to what shutter release cable will work with it. I have been to Kowa.com and their sight has absolutely no info on cable/shutter releases. I do not know why the picture they made for the ad shows a shutter release cable (as if its included) other than for display.

Even in the instructions, under adapter accessories, Kowa mentions nothing of the cable release.
 
That photo you posted is incorrect. I have the TSN-DA10 and the
TSN-DA4, which appears to also have the DA4-RS SHUTTER CABLE HOLDER
AND AIMING SIGHT ASSEMBLY. It does not contain any shutter release
cable
That's strange because this review says that the shutter release is part of the kit...

http://www.birddigiscoping.com/2007/02/kowas-tsn-da4-universal-adapter.html

Personally, I would call the place you bought it from and ask, just to make sure.

edit - the cable looks like a standard old-school shutter release. There's one on ebay for 6 bucks.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Remote-Cable-SHUTTER-RELEASE-New-12-30cms-AUTO-Lock_W0QQitemZ270311180810QQcmdZViewItemQQptZCamera_Cables_Cords?hash=item270311180810&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50
 
Thanks - I think I will call them and ask for recommendations. I searched their website and couldn't find any as well. As for the ebay link, still not sure if its what I should get. The links I have been finding indicate it should be at least 18-20 inches long, and this one is only 12. Also, this link does not indicate it will work with my camera:

Remote Cable Shutter Release
with handy finger grip and Auto shutter lock feature
Measures 12 inches / 30 cms
Brand NEW in package
fits almost all 35mm SLR Manual Focus Camera's
from: Nikon, Olympus, Canon, Ricoh, Pentax, Minolta,
to, Konica, Fujica, Contax, Yashica, Mamiya and others.

Maybe I'm reading way too much into things now that I'm having problems. It says "35mm SLR Manual Focus Camera". I am using a point and shoot. Or is that the purpose of the Kowa kit, to compliment it for use with a p&s?
 
Is there any other P&S camera that is
considered one of the best, that has a cable release capability?
The Fuji S9100 is/was just about then last decent P&S camera left standing. It actually takes a standard mechanical cable release just like you would expect any camera made in the last seventy years to have, but don't often see these days.

I don't know if the camera is still in production, but its successor may well be similarly endowed. The 9100 is an excellent camera. A colleague had one, I nearly bought one, there really isn't anything else worthy of consideration. I don't know just how good it is for digiscoping. I understand long zoom cameras are not the best choice as they are more prone to vignetting and there may be other issues. This may not be a problem for you and the plusses may outweigh the minuses.

I use an Olympus 5060, which does not have vignetting problems with a 1100mm Maksutov and a 20mm Nikon eyepiece. It uses an IR remote control, which is nearly as good as a cable anyway. I believe later Olys still have remotes and I imagine other makers do too.
 
The links I have been
finding indicate it should be at least 18-20 inches long, and this
one is only 12. Also, this link does not indicate it will work with
my camera:
The length doesn't matter too much. What's important is technique, and that's quickly figured out when you start using one.

Well, it certainly doesn't work with your camera! I think you mean work with your TSN-DA4 adapter, and you're right...it doesn't say so. However, the fact that it fits all those other cameras means that it's a standard shutter-release thread. If anything is going to fit...it will be such a release. There's no other type of release that would be considered “standard”.
Maybe I'm reading way too much into things now that I'm having
problems. It says "35mm SLR Manual Focus Camera". I am using a point
and shoot. Or is that the purpose of the Kowa kit, to compliment it
for use with a p&s?
It's a standard cable, but cameras that use it haven't been made in a long time. They were all manual focus.

I don't know which company started the trend, but Canon abandoned the shutter release cable in 1983 with the introduction of the T50. If you look at pictures of the old Canon A-1, AE-1, F-1, etc you'll see a threaded hole in the middle of the shutter button. The T50 doesn't have one.

I think it would be foolish for Kowa to use some non-standard thread...especially if they're not even telling you what thread it is.

I say send that DA4 back and get the SLR attachment. Your XTi has a wireless remote option...right?
 
Yes, it has a wireless remote option. Never used it. We also have the RS-60E3 wired remote. We were told very specifically and emphatically by the salesperson (whom was NOT selling us the camera), that we should use a P&S instead of our existing Canon. Damned if ya do and damned if ya don't. i think some of her reasons were those already pointed out by a few on here.

I will try a combination of other techniques such as using burst mode and like you and others have mentioned possiibly using a cable release on this setup.

Thanks again for your advice.
 
Code3Collector wrote:
We were told very specifically and emphatically
by the salesperson (whom was NOT selling us the camera), that we
should use a P&S instead of our existing Canon.
Not selling you a camera...but selling you an adapter that cost 400 bucks. I trust sailes people about as far as I can throw them.
I will try a combination of other techniques such as using burst mode
and like you and others have mentioned possiibly using a cable
release on this setup.
Hope it works out. Good luck!
 
The salesperson was the one who sold me only the scope and eyepiece and tripod and suggested that camera. They didn't have the Kowa combo setup
 
I assume you are referring to this?

Panasonic DMC-LX3K

I haven't seen any posts on other boards about the quality of digiscoped images with this camera.

Can you use a wireless or wired remote (directly to the camera)

Seems pricey for a P&S, but if it can back up the price with quality digiscoped images then I'm there.
 
The salesperson was the one who sold me only the scope and eyepiece
and tripod and suggested that camera. They didn't have the Kowa combo
setup
I still don't trust them :P

I found this information on the DA4 cable release from B&H (under the Features tab...)

"• Threaded to accept traditional cable release"

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/386694-REG/Kowa_TSN_DA4_K_TSN_DA4_K_Digiscoping_Adapter_Kit.html#features

B&H has a 20" cable release for 10 bucks.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/561807-REG/Bower_SR704_Cloth_Cable_Release_.html
 
1. Most Canon cameras can be remotely triggered with a computer using the software supplied with the camera. Just connect a notebook computer to the camera using the supplied USB cable. I have used this method to shoot birds on my back deck while sitting in the kitchen looking out the window.



2. There is a free firmware modification program that can add many more features to your Canon camera including the ability to trigger the camera through the USB port with an inexpensive electronic switch such as the Ricoh CA-1. I am currently using this method to fire two cameras in sync for stereoscopic photos.

 
First, why 5x zoom? You really don't need 5x zoom for digisoping - you would be better off with 4x or even 3x. You can get all the optical focal length you can use with the scope and the proper eyepiece.

My suggestion would be to look for an older camera such as the Nikon CP4500, CP990, Contax SL300R T*, etc. These cameras do an excellent job and produce amazing quality even with their rather paltry resolution compared to newer model digicams.

You can get an electronic release (Digisnap 2000, etc.) for any of the Nikons and many other digicams from:

http://www.harbortronics.com

This will solve you problem of moving the setup and works much better than a manual release because you can control more than just shutter release.

visit here for much more specific digiscoping information:

http://www.birdforum.net/forumdisplay.php?f=243

I think you were given bad information by the retailer who sold you the setup in the first place. Unfortunately few retailers know much about digiscoping and it is a pretty specialized area. If you visit the site above you can get more good and "accurate" information in short time than you will ever find through the retail seller. Andy Bright is a wealth of good information on the best products for digiscoping. As for scopes, the Kowa is fine but the ultimate digiscoper's tool is the Swarovski. If you want a cheap but very good scope to practice with, pick up an older model Meade ETX-90 or Celestron equivalent for around $175. Couple this with a 24mm William Optics eyepiece and a camera with a 28mm filter thread such as one of the older Nikons, a Harbortronics release and a decent tripod and you have a reliable digiscoping tools which will get you the quality you are looking for. No, you won't have 10 megapixels, but you can get beautiful 8x10 prints and even larger.

Best regards,

Lin
 
Each approach has its place and which to use depends a lot on your
situation and your birding skills. When looking for quality images,
nothing beats getting close to your subject with a high quality DSLR
and top notch optics. But the getting close part is often hard and
the top notch optics are often expensive.
This is true. Getting close is more an art than a science...
But the below images, part of a larger series, shot at dawn, would
simply be impossible for any digicam rig...
Those are images of large birds that aren't particularly elusive and are pretty easy to approach. So typically there would be little need for the long range of a digiscope to get those pictures. But even so, my bet is that you could easily manage that digiscoping at lower magnification. Of course it is hard to say for sure since there is no camera exposure info in the EXIF. Also, I would probably opt for a DSLR setup of some form for that kind of shot - the exception would be if the distance over the water was too great.

Given the same light, effective shutter speed is essentially a function of aperture size and magnification. So big objectives and low magnification are the way to go if you want fast shutter speeds.
All in all, whatever advantages there are to a digicam rig, are
simply to small to justify the many restrictions. If I had to I could
match those small advantages with my Nikon 2x tele converter, and the
use of two tripods. One attached to the camera, the other attached to
the 'Scope.
I can't agree. I carry both a digiscope and a DSLR with long lens when I'm in the field. Carrying two tripods and having to set them up for a shot would be far more restrictive. I can carry my digiscope setup on my shoulder with a strap and can go from hiking on a trail to set up and on a bird in about 15 seconds. I'm guessing that would be very difficult to duplicate if I had to set up two tripods. Further, my experience is that no amount of tripod sturdiness eliminates shake due to mirror vibrations. I strongly suspect (based on my tests and reports from others) that there's a range of shutter speeds where the two tripod rig is going to have problems.

This image was taken at (as I recall) 1/5 of a second at a focal length equivalence of around 2000mm at dawn. I think this shot is barely feasible with an SLR. You'd need mirror lockup which would cut down on your shot rate and choosing the moment of exposure. Every rig has its strong and weak points.



--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
 
How to make a DIY release cable?
Do a web search on shelf bracket and cable release.

Personally, I use a piece of aluminum and my camera's hot shoe. But that won't work for you since your camera does not have a hot shoe.

Here are pictures of the release holder I made for my Coolpix 5000 and then a more refined one I made for my C7070. I did something similar for my Coolpix 8400.





For the Coolpix 5000, I eventually ended using a wired remove via an adapter. I consider a cable release mandatory. Though I know some digiscopers who get fine results without one. Make sure that your issue is one of motion blur, and not one of poor focus and/or over magnification.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
 
The "physical" shutter releases, I thought were more
effective for triggering the camera from a distance - not for lack of
pressure on the shutter. Doesn't holding your finger 1/2 way down and
focusing, and then depressing the shutter have the same amount of
pressure as a manual trigger release being depressed 1/2 way and then
fully?
That's not the issue. The issue is isolating all the other motion that your hand/arm can introduce. Just hold your hand out. Is it perfectly steady? Right. So why touch your rig with something that is heavy and moving. The cable portion of the cable release tends to isolate (though not completely) this motion from the camera.
I was specifically told by the retailer http://www.opticsplanet.com that I
should ignore manual shutter releases as they were not needed, and
focus only on scope quality.
IMO, he's nuts. Most people benefit from the use of a cable release. Though there are a few who do fine without it - most people need it.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
 
Did you consider the TSN-PZ adapter (+ Canon EOS T-adapter) to
connect your XTi to the scope? Here's a page with pictures from an
884 with an XTi and good descriptions of the shooting process.

http://www.digital-nature-photography.com/nature/info/digiscoping-kowa-tsn-884.php

The two adapters should be less than $500.
That would be a good option IMO. One of the advantages with using a DSLR is that you can shoot at a higher frame rate and especially that you can shoot faster with raw.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
 
I don't understand why people are telling the OP to get a cable
release when he's already stated he's using a Kowa DA4
adapter...which contains a cable release.
Did you read his original post? He indicated that he didn't have a manual cable release for the camera. I and others clearly relied on the OP to understand what options his particular rig offered.

If that release bracket will work with his camera, then of course he should use that.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
 

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