Canon & Nikon well experienced users only...

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly from camera (jpg).

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

I've used both, mostly Canon. I haven't noticed the color tones you are referring to. The biggest difference in my opinion is how much better Nikon handles highly saturated colors, such as the red rocks at the Valley of Fire. The Canon 5D had a heck of a time handling those colors and in order to stop the red channel from blowing I'd have to either significantly lower the exposure (not good), lower the red saturation (not good) or make the white balance cooler (not good). My D700 smokes by old 5D at the Valley of Fire. I got perfect exposures of the red rocks with NO issues.

Another example was just last week when I was at Sedona, shooting Cathedral Rocks with fall colors and my D700. I was there exactly one year ago at the exact same place with my 5D. The D700 shots are much better. The 5D could not handle the dynamic range (at sunset a good portion of the rocks are in shadow) with the red rocks and yellow leaves. The D700 nailed it.

Now, don't get me wrong. The 5D is an excellent camera and I'm sure the 5D Mark II will be too, assuming Canon gets that nasty "black spot next to the highlights" issue fixed (see another post on this board referencing that Canon thread). I've seen some very nice images with the 5D Mark II. But, I can't imagine dumping my D700 for a 5D.

YMMV.

photomik said:

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler
tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm
talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically
the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly
from camera (jpg).

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope
my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

Click to expand...

--
Cheers,
Doug

http://doglesby.zenfolio.com/

Thanks for your point of view, especially from a Canon user.

I did not know about those differences in certain situations. I actually like neutral or faithful color settings in most cases. So are your cams set that way?

I know that the D700 is a semi-pro cam and that overall it is a better cam w/o video and 21MP resolution, but my eyes are drawn to those colors for some reason. Maybe I should have my eyes checked. ;-)

Yeah, I read about those black spots, but I'm sure Canon can fix that with firmware.

Ghozer said:

Another example was just last week when I was at Sedona, shooting
Cathedral Rocks with fall colors and my D700. I was there exactly
one year ago at the exact same place with my 5D. The D700 shots are
much better. The 5D could not handle the dynamic range (at sunset a
good portion of the rocks are in shadow) with the red rocks and
yellow leaves. The D700 nailed it.

Now, don't get me wrong. The 5D is an excellent camera and I'm sure
the 5D Mark II will be too, assuming Canon gets that nasty "black
spot next to the highlights" issue fixed (see another post on this
board referencing that Canon thread). I've seen some very nice
images with the 5D Mark II. But, I can't imagine dumping my D700 for
a 5D.

YMMV.

photomik said:

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler
tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm
talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically
the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly
from camera (jpg).

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope
my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

Click to expand...

--
Cheers,
Doug

http://doglesby.zenfolio.com/

Click to expand...

I haven't noticed the color difference between Canon and Nikon but i notice that Nikon generally gives a more detailed and realistic look while Canon's look a tad smooth and over processed. This is just my personal opinion and I appreciate others may differ. Regarding colors it should not be a deal breaker as picture styles can be adjusted and tweaked to get the look you want.

I switch between vivid and standard on my D700. I used a custom picture style on the 5D that was about the equivalent of vivid. But, I always shoot raw and for Canon, other than DPP, the converters I used don't apply the picture styles to the raw conversion, unlike Capture NX 2. I use those picture styles on Nikon because they seem to work great for my raw conversions. On Canon I used the picture style solely for improving the JPEG rendition on the camera's LCD and on those occasions when I shot raw + jpeg.

photomik said:

I did not know about those differences in certain situations. I
actually like neutral or faithful color settings in most cases. So
are your cams set that way?

I know that the D700 is a semi-pro cam and that overall it is a
better cam w/o video and 21MP resolution, but my eyes are drawn to
those colors for some reason. Maybe I should have my eyes checked.
;-)

Yeah, I read about those black spots, but I'm sure Canon can fix that
with firmware.

Ghozer said:

Another example was just last week when I was at Sedona, shooting
Cathedral Rocks with fall colors and my D700. I was there exactly
one year ago at the exact same place with my 5D. The D700 shots are
much better. The 5D could not handle the dynamic range (at sunset a
good portion of the rocks are in shadow) with the red rocks and
yellow leaves. The D700 nailed it.

Now, don't get me wrong. The 5D is an excellent camera and I'm sure
the 5D Mark II will be too, assuming Canon gets that nasty "black
spot next to the highlights" issue fixed (see another post on this
board referencing that Canon thread). I've seen some very nice
images with the 5D Mark II. But, I can't imagine dumping my D700 for
a 5D.

YMMV.

photomik said:

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler
tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm
talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically
the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly
from camera (jpg).

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope
my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

Click to expand...

--
Cheers,
Doug

http://doglesby.zenfolio.com/

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

--
Cheers,
Doug

http://doglesby.zenfolio.com/

--

FWIW, there is some indication that the black spots are a hardware defect, so you may want to wait until it's sorted out, or go with the D700.

ps. I'm an A900 shooter, so I have no bias in this answer.

I did not notice any color shift with the 5D, however I only shot raw. The colors that I got were realistic neutral if not a tad warm. I preferred this coming straight from film and always using some sort of warming filter. Jpegs from any camera always seem over processed to me so maybe I need my eyes checked. : ) I have only seen examples of my friends D700 and only the high ISO capability had me envious...

penn

I shoot both and I also find the canon more pleasing. I sometimes find the Nikon colors and contrast a little on the drab side almost like there's no life to the photo. Canon usually has more of a pop to them. That being said, I am able to adjust the Nikon files to match the canon files pretty easily in ps, but it takes a little time. But there's one color that consistantly looks better in Nikon... yellow. I find that Canon tends to blow out easier for whatever reason.

photomik said:

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler
tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm
talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically
the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly
from camera (jpg).

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope
my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

Click to expand...

that Nikon has always felt more Kodak film like and Canon more Fuji like in terms of color.

cameraman12 said:

photomik said:

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler
tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm
talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically
the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly
from camera (jpg).

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope
my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I recently left Canon after purchasing a DS Mark III. Was completely unimpressed with the focus system, low light inability and IQ. I had a DSMII and a DMII as well. I purchased two D3's and could nt have been happier.

Someone came by the studio ab out a month ago and the 5DII did nothing but give him problems. Error 99 and the focus was awful. If you want quality build and a quality image, I would stick with Nikon.

photomik said:

Hi there,

I'm trying to decide between a 5DII and D700.

For some reason Canon colors are more pleasing to my eyes, cooler
tones/whiter whites as opposed to Nikon's warmer tones.

Click to expand...

Nonsense. In a raw file it makes absolutely NO difference.

photomik said:

If you are a using or have used both extensively and notices what I'm
talking about, please comment.

Do any of you know how to mimic those colors in camera, specifically
the D700? I do not want to pp at times, so this has to come directly
from camera (jpg).

Click to expand...

Raw can be set up to convert ALL files with a warmer or cooler color. In all honesty, I would suggest neither in your case. Both might be a little too much camera. You need to ask yourself WHY you need EITHER of these cameras.

photomik said:

I realise most of us have not tested for eye color response, I hope
my eyes fall in the mainstream.

Thanks in advanced.

Click to expand...

--
Steve Bingham
http://www.dustylens.com
http://www.ghost-town-photography.com

I've used both and I think it totally depends on what you're shooting. They each have their own advantages.

I like the Canon for landscapes with lots of greenery.

I like the Nikon for landscapes with red rocks.

And I especially like the Nikon for female skintones.

Everything else it's pretty much a tie (if you're using the best glass).

But ultimately, raw converters and PS can virtually neutralize any difference.

I guess it's the Velvia look I'm looking for.

cameraman12 said:

that Nikon has always felt more Kodak film like and Canon more Fuji
like in terms of color.

Click to expand...

That's the other problem - QC, and the reason why I want the D700 but able to output jpeg in Canon look.

jonlee1 said:

I recently left Canon after purchasing a DS Mark III. Was completely
unimpressed with the focus system, low light inability and IQ. I had
a DSMII and a DMII as well. I purchased two D3's and could nt have
been happier.

Someone came by the studio ab out a month ago and the 5DII did
nothing but give him problems. Error 99 and the focus was awful. If
you want quality build and a quality image, I would stick with Nikon.

Click to expand...

Steve Bingham said:

Raw can be set up to convert ALL files with a warmer or cooler color.
In all honesty, I would suggest neither in your case. Both might be a
little too much camera. You need to ask yourself WHY you need EITHER
of these cameras.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, master Steve, I know about NEF and done in batch mode. But this grasshopper said "jpeg directly from camera". What must he say to get this to thy big head. And thanks for you suggestion of neither. BTW, I am not into over saturated pictures as yours because maybe my eyes are too sensitive to false colors.

cameraman12 said:

that Nikon has always felt more Kodak film like and Canon more Fuji
like in terms of color.

Click to expand...

Interesting. I've read some comments from shooters who have said that the D700 tends to have a very saturated look to them (by default), much like Fuji film did/does. All I know is there are some people out there who can make the images from most of these cameras look nearly identical with the proper application of PP.

Ghozer said:

My D700 smokes by old 5D at the Valley of Fire. I got
perfect exposures of the red rocks with NO issues.

Click to expand...

I was shooting in Red Rock and in Valley of Fire two months ago using D2X and D3.

what you observed is because red channel in D3/D700 is less sensitive then in 5D. for nearly any camera except D3/D700 to temper the red channel without underexposing blue and green at least CC20C cyan filter is needed.

while shooting high in mountains, snow, sea, and similar D3/D700 are at disadvantage needing a CC20R red filter.

--
Julia

photomik said:

Ah yes, master Steve, I know about NEF and done in batch mode. But
this grasshopper said "jpeg directly from camera". What must he say
to get this to thy big head. And thanks for you suggestion of
neither. BTW, I am not into over saturated pictures as yours because
maybe my eyes are too sensitive to false colors.

Click to expand...

I would suggest that anyone that buys a $3k camera, should also have the requisite skills and intelligence to set up the camera in the manner that they wish to shoot, which includes JPGs. I don't know how easy or hard it is to change the JPG parameters on the canon, but the d700 has enormous latitude for setting up JPGs.

If you're wanting to use defaults and shoot P&S style, getting the results that some engineer or marketing agent came up with, then I don't understand why you want a $3k camera.

But, I'm sure that you'll come up with something that will demonstrate canon superiority, which is the general gist of your posts anyway.

--
my gallery of so-so photos
http://www.pbase.com/kerrypierce/root

I've owned 20D, 30D, 1DMkIII as well as D200, D2x, D300 and finally D700. I agree that the default JPEG settings in the D200 are warm to a fault and somewhat warm in the D2x. The D300 and especially the D700 seem much more balanced. By the same token, the Canon default JPEG settings produced images with a slight greenish cast that I found even more objectionable, especially the 20D and 30D. The 1DMkIII was also more balanced. This tells me that as you move up the scale in either brand and later in release date, you get more accurate default color.

The D700 ROCKS in shadow and highlight retention with Active D-Lighting set to Auto, Picture Control at Neutral and Saturation and Sharpness both bumped up 1 from the Neutral default. These settings produce JPEGs that can be PP'd if needed but that should be rare.

Steve

Thanks Julia. This is very informative. Do you typically shoot with a CC20R with your D3 in the mountains, snow or at the sea? Or, only under certain circumstances? I'm dying to know more about this. Or do you find that you can adjust sufficiently in post processing? I didn't have much luck compensating in post with my 5D. But, perhaps Nikon is different.

Also, I was checking out the CC20R availability and prices online and found a massive disparity in price. Any recommendation on brands? Tiffen seems to be a big player in the color compensating filter arena but I never considered them a top brand. Perhaps that's just ignorance.

Julia Borg said:

Julia Borg said:

My D700 smokes by old 5D at the Valley of Fire. I got
perfect exposures of the red rocks with NO issues.

Click to expand...

I was shooting in Red Rock and in Valley of Fire two months ago using
D2X and D3.

what you observed is because red channel in D3/D700 is less sensitive
then in 5D. for nearly any camera except D3/D700 to temper the red
channel without underexposing blue and green at least CC20C cyan
filter is needed.

while shooting high in mountains, snow, sea, and similar D3/D700 are
at disadvantage needing a CC20R red filter.

--
Julia

Click to expand...

--
Cheers,
Doug

http://doglesby.zenfolio.com/