D3X and limited f-stops for highest quality....

I was aked a few times in the other D Big (D3x) thread about the new high resolution cameras and this is a given for all cameras of that kind be it Nikon
Sony or Canon.
The highest resolution only works out at a very limited f- stop range
and that is closed down about 5.6 -11.....
What you produce at stops below is limited mostly because of spherical aberation
and over f stop 11 that where diffraction starts.

So your just filling up your harddisks with filesize that doesnt help your resolution ! ; P
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/50-comparison/f-stops.htm
This is a good page to show you this .
This is normal for every lens even the big ones for large format cameras..
What cameras with higher iso and less MP can give you is faster shutterspeeds
that can lead to sharper pictures because they avoid blurring that way.
When you use a 2.8 300mm lens wide open for fashion shots you would want
as short shutter speeds as possible.
In this case a D3 could be much sharper then a D3X (at 24mp) ! ; )
While in a studio or outdoors a camera at 24 MP and f stop 8 can produce
more resolution but only if you freeze any movement !
That can be the short duration of a studio flash too !
There is the next if ......
A lower MP camera with higher iso can result into much shorter flash duration
thus freezing any movement . 1 stop cuts it in half !
Instead of an 1/800 of a second at full charge you have 1/1600 th
Same with speedlites

Only a camera with a special mechanism ie pixel binning gives you the best of both worlds. Phase one backs as far as I know have this feature for higher iso and
that would be something very usefull on any new 24 mp camera.
maybe thats the new feature would be cool !
Peter

and so are lenses
I intend to use it for macro work with the Nikkor 85 Micro PC f2.8

diffraction has not been a problem with this lens stopped down until well over f22

I don't know that having more pixels on the sensor should change how the light traveling through the aperture, but I am willing to learn about this
--
--
pbase & dpreview supporter
DPR forum member since 5/2001
http://www.pbase.com/artichoke

Artichoke said:

and so are lenses
I intend to use it for macro work with the Nikkor 85 Micro PC f2.8
diffraction has not been a problem with this lens stopped down until
well over f22
I don't know that having more pixels on the sensor should change how
the light traveling through the aperture, but I am willing to learn
about this
--
--
pbase & dpreview supporter
DPR forum member since 5/2001
http://www.pbase.com/artichoke

Click to expand...

One of the fields a high MP camera would be more then welcome.

Diffraction has something to do with the pixelcount on the sensor, limiting effective diaphragma...beyond a certain diaphragma, you wont yield any more resolution.

rayman 2 said:

I was aked a few times in the other D Big (D3x) thread about the new
high resolution cameras and this is a given for all cameras of that
kind be it Nikon
Sony or Canon.
The highest resolution only works out at a very limited f- stop range
and that is closed down about 5.6 -11.....
What you produce at stops below is limited mostly because of
spherical aberation
and over f stop 11 that where diffraction starts.
So your just filling up your harddisks with filesize that doesnt help
your resolution ! ; P

Click to expand...

Is this your proof?

Noone would disagree with the assertion that the best aperture range for most lenses is 5.6 to 11. You've gone several steps further than this though - and you're criticising other dpreview posters for considering shooting 24MPixels at any apertures outside this range.

You're incorrect. There is still detail to be had at wider and narrower apertures that can be captured by a higher resolution camera. And the pixel density of a 24MPixel full frame camera isn't a whole lot different to that of a 12MPixel APS-c camera. You've provided no data to back up your claim.

rayman 2 said:

http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/50-comparison/f-stops.htm
This is a good page to show you this .

Click to expand...

FAIL for quoting Ken Rockwell

rayman 2 said:

This is normal for every lens even the big ones for large format
cameras..
What cameras with higher iso and less MP can give you is faster
shutterspeeds
that can lead to sharper pictures because they avoid blurring that way.
When you use a 2.8 300mm lens wide open for fashion shots you would
want
as short shutter speeds as possible.
In this case a D3 could be much sharper then a D3X (at 24mp) ! ; )

Click to expand...

Possibly, but this is a real edge case. Most people aren't photographing 300mm at f2.8

rayman 2 said:

While in a studio or outdoors a camera at 24 MP and f stop 8 can produce
more resolution but only if you freeze any movement !
That can be the short duration of a studio flash too !
There is the next if ......
A lower MP camera with higher iso can result into much shorter flash
duration
thus freezing any movement . 1 stop cuts it in half !
Instead of an 1/800 of a second at full charge you have 1/1600 th

Click to expand...

This depends on the quality of your flash and the light output. 1/800 is slow for a studio flash.

On the sort of normal to moderate tele lens used in a studio the difference in sharpness from motion blur comparing 1/800 to 1/1600 is too minor to consider

In a studio, resolution will be king.

rayman 2 said:

Same with speedlites
Only a camera with a special mechanism ie pixel binning gives you the
best of both worlds. Phase one backs as far as I know have this
feature for higher iso and
that would be something very usefull on any new 24 mp camera.
maybe thats the new feature would be cool !
Peter

Click to expand...

Why have you introduced pixel binning into the argument? If you're pixel binning, you've just crippled your high resolution sensor. Pixel binning isn't a solution to give you higher resolution captures - precisely the opposite.

rayman 2 said:

I was aked a few times in the other D Big (D3x) thread about the new
high resolution cameras and this is a given for all cameras of that
kind be it Nikon
Sony or Canon.
The highest resolution only works out at a very limited f- stop range
and that is closed down about 5.6 -11.....
What you produce at stops below is limited mostly because of
spherical aberation
and over f stop 11 that where diffraction starts.
So your just filling up your harddisks with filesize that doesnt help
your resolution ! ; P
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/50-comparison/f-stops.htm
This is a good page to show you this .
This is normal for every lens even the big ones for large format
cameras..
What cameras with higher iso and less MP can give you is faster
shutterspeeds
that can lead to sharper pictures because they avoid blurring that way.
When you use a 2.8 300mm lens wide open for fashion shots you would
want
as short shutter speeds as possible.
In this case a D3 could be much sharper then a D3X (at 24mp) ! ; )
While in a studio or outdoors a camera at 24 MP and f stop 8 can produce
more resolution but only if you freeze any movement !
That can be the short duration of a studio flash too !
There is the next if ......
A lower MP camera with higher iso can result into much shorter flash
duration
thus freezing any movement . 1 stop cuts it in half !
Instead of an 1/800 of a second at full charge you have 1/1600 th
Same with speedlites
Only a camera with a special mechanism ie pixel binning gives you the
best of both worlds. Phase one backs as far as I know have this
feature for higher iso and
that would be something very usefull on any new 24 mp camera.
maybe thats the new feature would be cool !
Peter

Click to expand...

Like a lot of people, you've been confused by the pseudo-scientific babble that goes on in internet photography forums (and particularly this one). A high resolution sensor is better at capturing the image projected on it than a low resolution sensor.

Lenses have a characteristic resolution curve with a peak somewhere between f/4 and f/8. There isn't yet a DSLR camera with sufficient resolution to do justice to the best lenses at their peak resolution, but a high resolution sensor gets closer, and extracts more detail from all lenses at all apertures.

There is no sensitivity penalty for high resolutions, so you can use exactly the same exposure settings in the same situations.

Pixel binning buys very little in day to day photographic situations, resampling to your desired output resolution generally equalises effectively between cameras of different pixel size, so long as its done properly.
--
Bob

When shooting landscapes, I try to not go beyond f11 with 24 Mpix Sony A900.
I do see some diffraction softness at f11 already.

Using the best lenses to get utmost acuity is critical, too. I never felt like that using a D2X crop camera, but on the A900 even a 50 mm prime doesn´t convince me ... actually, I´m wondering why that is so.
--
Greetings from Germany,
Pam

bloomoose wrote:
actually, I´m wondering why that is so.

bloomoose said:

--
Greetings from Germany,
Pam

Click to expand...

I´m not against this new camera I´m just against the myth that
your going to get it through your lens at anything other then the
sweetpoint of your lenses.
I too will buy this camera when its out but I will use it at that settings.

rayman 2 said:

I too will buy this camera when its out but I will use it at that
settings.

Click to expand...

I'd say at least try it on different settings , before sticking yourself to something you don't know too much about.

Pam,

I'd guess that your standards have got much higher. You've become addicted to the detail that your A900 can give you, and you're not happy if you find it missing, even though what that camera is giving is no worse than your D2x or D3.
--
Bob