G1 samples at full resolution.

This flickr series has been updated with full-resolution images (it used to only have photos of the camera):

http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/sets/72157607245255351/

then good for the G1.

--
Raist3d (Photographer & Tools/Systems/Gui Games Developer)
Andreas Feininger (1906-1999) 'Photographers — idiots, of which there are
so many — say, “Oh, if only I had a Nikon or a Leica, I could make great
photographs.” That’s the dumbest thing I ever heard in my life. It’s
nothing but a matter of seeing, and thinking, and interest. That’s what
makes a good photograph.'

They do look very saturated. Overall image quality looks fine, better than the FZ50. Check out the wacky rainbows on the man's shirt in the photo of the couple (lines in the fabric playing havoc with the G1 sensor; can't imagine any sensor that would be able to handle it; maybe 20 megapixel). Anyway, it's nice to see something at full-resolution. Encouraging, for what it's worth.

Virtually any DSLR class camera I have seen gets things better than an FZ50. I think it is encouraging. I am just worried about some colors given my experience with the LX3, but if those are the real colors, that's cool as long as a saturation down can bring them in line.

desertpullout said:

They do look very saturated. Overall image quality looks fine, better
than the FZ50. Check out the wacky rainbows on the man's shirt in the
photo of the couple (lines in the fabric playing havoc with the G1
sensor; can't imagine any sensor that would be able to handle it;
maybe 20 megapixel). Anyway, it's nice to see something at
full-resolution. Encouraging, for what it's worth.

--

Click to expand...

--
Raist3d (Photographer & Tools/Systems/Gui Games Developer)
Andreas Feininger (1906-1999) 'Photographers — idiots, of which there are
so many — say, “Oh, if only I had a Nikon or a Leica, I could make great
photographs.” That’s the dumbest thing I ever heard in my life. It’s
nothing but a matter of seeing, and thinking, and interest. That’s what
makes a good photograph.'

Thank you for the link, firmware is 0.3. That 14-45 kit lens looks very good to me.

I didn't check all of them, but the EXIF on at least one said it was taken with a Nikon D70. -Norm

desertpullout said:

This flickr series has been updated with full-resolution images (it
used to only have photos of the camera):

http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/sets/72157607245255351/

--

Click to expand...

--

PBase supporter

Pics of the G1 were taken with a D70. The ones at the bottom are from the G1. Sorry. -Norm

nboyer said:

desertpullout said:

This flickr series has been updated with full-resolution images (it
used to only have photos of the camera):

http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/sets/72157607245255351/

--

Click to expand...

--

PBase supporter

Click to expand...

--

PBase supporter

Good or bad, looks like the G1 has a weak AA filter, you can clearly see the moire effect on the man's shirt. My guess is that it should clean up fine in LR, once it's supported. I remember my former Nikon D70 exhibited this effect, but in return you get better sharpness. -Norm

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3128/2897447593_10d0c47568_o.jpg

desertpullout said:

This flickr series has been updated with full-resolution images (it
used to only have photos of the camera):

http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/sets/72157607245255351/

--

Click to expand...

--

PBase supporter

First thanks. A nice intro for some of us.

Two questions:

What was your experience of the viewfinder re brightness, size, and realistic quality of the image?

I don't expect it to be like that of a first rate DSLR viewfinder but would like to know it's at least B/B+ quality for seeing and composing.

And the LCD, how effective is it in normal sunlit conditions as an alternative to the viewfinder? I like to do waist level candid shooting.

Thanks.

mark

nboyer said:

Good or bad, looks like the G1 has a weak AA filter, you can clearly
see the moire effect on the man's shirt. My guess is that it should
clean up fine in LR, once it's supported. I remember my former Nikon
D70 exhibited this effect, but in return you get better sharpness.
-Norm

Click to expand...

That moire is dissapointing and not something you should have to correct for in post if the AA filter were designed correctly. I never noticed anythng like that on my entry level rebels and sharpness was never in question. The lens is also exhibiting some softness toward the edges and the noise is blotchy (typical Venus water color) as seen under the umbrella. However, sharpness appears good toward the center and the CA and fringing appear very well contained.

Need to see more to evaluate the camera but the lens design appears reasonably sound.

I also noticed that the Sea Gull is blurred so it's value as a good BIF camera becomes highly suspect

--
Ken
Canon Mark IIn + 350D + 400D, EF-S 17-85 IS, 100-400L IS, 400 5.6L, 500 4.0L IS
Panasonic FZ20 & FZ50
http://ken.smugmug.com/

tylerken said:

nboyer said:

Good or bad, looks like the G1 has a weak AA filter, you can clearly
see the moire effect on the man's shirt. My guess is that it should
clean up fine in LR, once it's supported. I remember my former Nikon
D70 exhibited this effect, but in return you get better sharpness.
-Norm

Click to expand...

That moire is dissapointing and not something you should have to
correct for in post if the AA filter were designed correctly.

Click to expand...

Considering that only every fourth pixel is red (ditto blue) you'd need
a very strong AA filter to remove colour moiré. Such a filter would not
be considered "correctly" designed by most people.

Since moiré is very situation dependent, I find it hard to judge by a single
picture like this. I would not say that this image proves it's worse than
an average DSLR (used with a sharp lens).

It would not surprise me, though, if the G1 turned out to have a
weaker-than-average AA filter, considering that's how they chose
to make the L10.

EDIT: Where did you see the gull shot, please? Edit

Just my two oere
Erik from Sweden

Ehrik said:

Since moiré is very situation dependent, I find it hard to judge by a
single
picture like this. I would not say that this image proves it's worse
than
an average DSLR (used with a sharp lens).

It would not surprise me, though, if the G1 turned out to have a
weaker-than-average AA filter, considering that's how they chose
to make the L10.

Click to expand...

The shirt may be a very difficult shot most cameras but one worries me further, the read against white is too staired!
I just hope software RAW converters are smarter than this.

See top of the letters or the demon's trident :



--
Duarte Bruno

Interesting find, good spotting. What do you suppose the magnification or print size would be where this would become a visable annoyance to viewers?
--
Bob

When viewed at 100% the staired effect is visible from 12", but not from 24".

When viewed at 100% we're looking at a 30" x 40" image.

So guess it depends on how close you view a 30" x 40" image.

Ross said:

Interesting find, good spotting. What do you suppose the
magnification or print size would be where this would become a
visable annoyance to viewers?
--
Bob

Click to expand...

I thought that G1s with the final firmware are not available yet and that Panasonic explicitly asked not to publish any originals shot with G1 firmware 0.x?

I guess you have a point. Until the firmaware is final, we don't know whether the engine will supress these kind of artifacts.

Can anyone with a L10 tell us if they have the problems on their cameras in comparable pictures?
The anti aliasing filter should be similar.
--
Duarte Bruno

From the Canon reveiw:

"Would you ever consider removing the anti alias (low pass) filter - or using a lighter one - on high end, high resolution models such as the EOS 1Ds Mark III, to improve pixel level sharpness, removing any moiré in software (like medium format cameras)?"

Hint: They don't like strong AA filters... Neither do I, I like sharp pictures.

GregGory said:

From the Canon reveiw:

"Would you ever consider removing the anti alias (low pass) filter -
or using a lighter one - on high end, high resolution models such as
the EOS 1Ds Mark III, to improve pixel level sharpness, removing any
moiré in software (like medium format cameras)?"

Click to expand...

It's impossible, after the fact, to distinguish real detail from high frequency
detail that is mirrored down below Nyquist. It's a many-to-one transform.
Running it backwards isn't well-defined. So software can never do what
an AA filter does, or undo the effect of lacking an AA filter.

I think particularly for high end models, with photographers doing critical
work, it's important to have real detail rather than false detail, giving an
impression of sharpness.

"Pixel sharpness" is not a good goal to aim towards. It's better to have enough
Mp to go via a few pixels when going from black to white.

It's no coincidence that all manufacturers, except for a few ones with tiny
market shares, trying desperately to offer something different, are using AA
filters.

Ironically, what's needed to be able to remove the AA filter without ill effects
is an increase in megapixels, massively so for DSLRs, something that DPR have
a mental block against.

Actually I've rarely seen DPR's misconceptions so clearly exposed as in that
Canon review (also in some other questions).

Just my two oere
Erik from Sweden

The image screams, "I am a bunch of fragments of reality chosen to be included here by chance alignments" -John Sheehy, about lack of AA filter

Hi Erik,

The M8 has no AA filter and when I first got one, I ran around looking for moire producing situations, because I thought I was going to have to learn to PP around that issue. Well, I failed miserably at producing moire. If you ever have a chance to handle and shoot an M8 grab some samples of your own that might have moire and see for your self. The files are amazing. The M8 will produce moire in fabric shots and window screens, just like most other digital cameras. I'm not sure how they did it, but moire isn't a problem in spite of no AA filter.
--
Bob

... JPEG's out of camera would be fine if you turn the saturation setting down.