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G1! Bum! Its a mini SLR design...and still wont fit in your man bag!

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allenelc said:
The critical issue will be image quality . . .
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Yes, definitely.
allenelc said:
Panasonic should be applauded for this advance.
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A lot of us have been applauding, in spite of making "but-I-would-like" comments . . . it should be applauded loudly whether the G1 is the exact camera for "me" or not. The new EVF technology should fill a big hole in the market and progressively replace lots and lots of swinging mirrors

Mike

FZ8, F20
 
WoodWorks said:
MaineTim said:
Everyone is acting like this is the one and only uFT camera ever.
This is just the start, and by their own admission a conservative
one. There's much more to come.

Tim
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No one is saying that, Tim. In fact, every post I've written, and all
of the posts that I've read by others who find this camera well short
of the mark say the same thing: We hope for better in the next
iteration.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I guess I was reacting to the overall tone of negativity. But rather than "better", could we say "different"? :-)
WoodWorks said:
But almost all the posts defending this camera try to ignore the
obvious: the promise of the µ4/3 format, i.e., a smaller, lighter
camera, is left unfulfilled (so far).
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I guess we disagree here, David. I think this is a great start towards that smaller, lighter camera, given all the features it packs in. I was afraid the first entry would be much more compact, with a fixed LCD and perhaps no EVF at all. That would have made me cringe. :-)

This image gives you an idea of just how small this baby really is:



Taken from: http://luc.saint-elie.com/

I understand it's not what you're looking for, but it is smaller. I look forward to a range that satisfies all our needs.

Tim
--
http://mainetim.zenfolio.com/
 
I people don't read my above post as negative. I'm quite impressed with the G1. I think it may be the perfect first camera. Hoping it catches on and we see more and different offerings. My only point is there isn't one perfect camera. I'd like to have several for different applications (but sharing lenses and accessories).
 
I didn't mean your particular post was negative, just that there was lot of negativity going around that I was responding to. We agree, a range of camera bodies to match the varying needs represented here will be great. I'm lucky that an early model seems to answer my requirements fairly well.

Tim
--
http://mainetim.zenfolio.com/
 
MaineTim said:
Sorry, I guess I was reacting to the overall tone of negativity. But
rather than "better", could we say "different"? :-)
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Agreed, different is the word I was looking for. And let me add that I appreciate your reasoned response. I also fully acknowledge that the G1 is the arthropod's leg joints to many here. And that's great. I just hope they make a camera for me some day too!
MaineTim said:
MaineTim said:
But almost all the posts defending this camera try to ignore the
obvious: the promise of the µ4/3 format, i.e., a smaller, lighter
camera, is left unfulfilled (so far).
Click to expand...
I guess we disagree here, David. I think this is a great start
towards that smaller, lighter camera, given all the features it packs
in. I was afraid the first entry would be much more compact, with a
fixed LCD and perhaps no EVF at all. That would have made me cringe.
:-)

I understand it's not what you're looking for, but it is smaller. I
look forward to a range that satisfies all our needs.

Tim
Click to expand...
Well, I do agree that the EVF and articulating LCD are great features, Tim. Now all they have to do is cram them into a box similar to that fictional CAD concept camera that was floating around here a few weeks ago, and I'll jump right on this bandwagon. In the mean time, my LX3 is due to arrive here on Monday, so you won't have to read any more of my whining for a while. :-P

David
 
…good point about the range finder design. Both the L1 and LC1 were so inspirational, and I wonder if their design has been put to rest by Panasonic. It would be a great pity, if so.

But, the advent of the G1 surely makes it possible that there will be an LC2, based on the new sensor?

Panasonic can't have helped noticing the trade in second hand LC1s and Digilux 2s.

As for the generic range finder, I guess we will have to wait and see what Leica comes up with next.
 
MaineTim said:
WoodWorks said:
MaineTim said:
Everyone is acting like this is the one and only uFT camera ever.
This is just the start, and by their own admission a conservative
one. There's much more to come.

Tim
Click to expand...
No one is saying that, Tim. In fact, every post I've written, and all
of the posts that I've read by others who find this camera well short
of the mark say the same thing: We hope for better in the next
iteration.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I guess I was reacting to the overall tone of negativity. But
rather than "better", could we say "different"? :-)
MaineTim said:
But almost all the posts defending this camera try to ignore the
obvious: the promise of the µ4/3 format, i.e., a smaller, lighter
camera, is left unfulfilled (so far).
Click to expand...
I guess we disagree here, David. I think this is a great start
towards that smaller, lighter camera, given all the features it packs
in. I was afraid the first entry would be much more compact, with a
fixed LCD and perhaps no EVF at all. That would have made me cringe.
:-)

This image gives you an idea of just how small this baby really is:



Taken from: http://luc.saint-elie.com/

I understand it's not what you're looking for, but it is smaller. I
look forward to a range that satisfies all our needs.

Tim
--
http://mainetim.zenfolio.com/
Click to expand...
Hmmm... that does seem smaller than I though. Thanks for the image.
 
How about this? http://www.4-3system.com/modules/news/

It appears to be a computer illustration but maybe we can mass-email Panasonic and encourage them to build it.
--Hal
Tim Woodward said:
I was sooo hoping for a rangefinder shape, sort of Olympus Trip 35,
y'know. Finder to the left, slight handgrip raised area maybe on the
right and short compact lens - and what do we get - another bloody
mini SLR design!!! These manufacturers are fixated on SLR!! It won't
go in my jacket pocket for sure, or even my in-town man bag without
leaving a great big bulge - the lens sticks out way too far. So its a
sideways slide-in job then and we still need a camera bag :-(

I would like to say "still it's great for what the future may bring"
  • but hell I am pretty fed up always waiting for the future, based on
this design, my future never comes - I am seriously thinking of going
down the Contax rangefinder or similar film route and getting a great
scanner, just imagine the size of those files :-)

--
Tim.
Click to expand...
 
Tim Woodward said:
This camera is actually what the 4/3rds system should have been to
begin with if they had had the courage to abandon the mirror box,
it's not new and it's not what the press releases seem to infer - a
bigger LX3 design would have been brilliant :-/
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Indeed, cameras of this type may be the ultimate justification of the 4/3 design, which looks lika a huge mistake in conventional SLR:s - the cost of the smaller sensor in image quality is there, but the supposed payoffs in convenience, size and price have been much smaller than what we originally were led to expect.

However, in order to be truly useful, a camera like this needs some fast lenses - both because the sensor is noisier than an APS-C sensor, and because you need larger aperture to get a narrow DOF with a smaller sensor. IMHO, zooms with f4 as max aperture won't cut it. Ideally f2.0 zoomes are needed, but at least the f2.8 zooms of the tratidional SLR mounts. And a couple of really fast primes, please.
 
Tim Woodward said:
I just don't want to buy an LX3 for compact stuff and find in 6
months someone releases m4/3rds compact! How long do you wait?
Click to expand...
There's no right answer.

1) You could wait until your perfect camera arrives. But in the meantime, it sounds like you're missing shots.

so you

2) do what the rest of us do.. buy today's camera today, and when you lust after a future model you sell the old one on ebay :)
 
JJJPhoto said:
Although I would LOVE to see Leica jump into the Micro Four Thirds
standard, there's something important that people are not noticing
about the G1:

There are absolutely NO markings on the camera or lenses that
indicate "Leica."

Absolutely NONE.

Every Panasonic-made lens prior to this release was branded with the
Leica name on it. Now, we have two lenses that just have the
Panasonic/Lumix name and Leica's name is mysteriously absent from the
new Panasonic Lumix lenses.

Rumors have it that Panasonic is enjoying a MUCH closer relationship
with Olympus than Leica. It seems that Leica still wants to work with
Panasonic for their point-and-shoots (because Leica doesn't want to
pay to develop their own P&S cameras when it's cheaper for them to
re-brand Panasonic cameras as "Leica" cameras) but the
Leica-Panasonic partnership has been rather fruitless in the DSLR
space.

When it comes to DSLRs, it's the Panasonic-Olympus relationship that
has contributed to the best DSLR tech. Considering how tight the
financial margins have become in the consumer electronics market, I
suspect that we'll be seeing less and less of Panasonic and Leica
working together with DSLRs.

We "might" see a Leica micro Four Thirds camera, but don't count on it.
--
Click to expand...
Well said - that is exactly the way I read it - Panasonic's money and Leica's "superiority" don't necessarily work well for technical development in pioneer countryside - re-branding consumer stuff might be ok for Leica but Leica helping develop a completely new concept other than the rangefinder concept of the LC1 might be too glacially slow for Panasonic. Lumix-branded lenses are surely just an announcement to the world of just who are currently running the show.
JJJPhoto said:
http://www.jjjphotography.com
See 'The Big Picture' at http://jjjphotography.blogspot.com/
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--
Tom Caldwell
 
The flip lcd bought me some great street photography on my Canon Pro90 years ago - and this is a relative tank.

The G1 will become smaller - in the meantime the flip lcd will enhance its use beyond measure - a great old idea that seemed to almost die for a while and is creeping back.

Look forward to smaller M4/3 bodies and fast pancake lenses - hope they don't sacrifice the flip lcd in this pursuit.

Olympus might shortly surprise us all - they are the leaders in miniature dslr's so they have a vested interest in making their M4/3 smaller than their dslr offerings.

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Fast quality primes or zooms please

But maybe we will see evf based camera bodies from Nikon, Canon, Sony, Pentax and Samsung? There are quite a lot of lenses waiting for bodies like these to happen - will not be as small as M4/3 has the potential to be but arguably they can be as small as the G1 if the of box is scrapped.

We might see lower (stranger) shapes more like those of rangefinder's but perhaps there is a limit to how much the depth can be reduced accommodating lenses basically designed for film camera use?

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Yes but the lenses and also the body combination will still be smaller specifically designed for M4/3 no matter what. However it would take years to manufacture a good range of lenses. Have to start and win over a range of new users to your lens system then once captured work them up into spending their bucks upgrading lenses and bodies once you have their undivided attention.

These are only the first ranging shots - the real battle is about to begin - have patience.

Obviously if you need compact - buy one of the "to come" smaller bodies with a fast pancake wide. But if you are a serious lens-collector you are not interested in ultima-compact and any size/weight saving is just a bonus.

--
Tom Caldwell
 
Hate to say it but that red-bodied one is certain to be a "cult camera" - if you need to make a statement just turn up with one of them at the photo-shoot :)

--
Tom Caldwell
 
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