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400mm f5.6 and the moon

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AWelsh said:
Anything above 400mm and you're fighting atmospheric stability.

The reason why the folks from the Philippines have such great moon
shots is because the air is far, far more stable in the tropics. Oh,
and the moon is always at a nice high altitude, so you're looking
through less air to begin with as well. For northern US, you can get
times when the moon gets no higher than 30 degrees above the
horizon-- and at that point you're looking through at least 2x the
amount of air versus directly overhead.
Click to expand...
I guess I have to go back to the Philippines...and go to a province there...maybe near Tall Volcano in Batangas...to get a really excellent shot of the moon.
AWelsh said:
Of course good technique is still needed-- solid tripod etc. but
atmospherics at 400+ mm are the #1 factor for image sharpness.
Generally, the best time for still air is usually a little before
dawn (before any pre-dawn breeze kicks up, and before the sun starts
heating things up). You have to be patient and watch and wait for
still air to happen-- it may only happen 1-2-3 nights a year.
Click to expand...
Wow! I got to test that!
AWelsh said:
Even with that said, a $60 webcam and low-cost telescope can image
circles around a DSLR any day, simply because the webcam can record
video, and you can hand-pick out the stillest frames, then stack
hundreds of them to smooth out the noise of each individual frame.
Click to expand...
Really? I got to try that too!

Thank you very much!

Cheers!

Danny Tuason :)
AWelsh said:
--
Check out my astrophotos:
http://astro.welsh-house.net/
Click to expand...
--
http://www.scandinavius.com/sweden/sesongs.html#anchor1139692
 
AWelsh said:
Even with that said, a $60 webcam and low-cost telescope can image
circles around a DSLR any day, simply because the webcam can record
video, and you can hand-pick out the stillest frames, then stack
hundreds of them to smooth out the noise of each individual frame.
Click to expand...
That's non-sensical. There is nothing preventing a SLR from shooting continuously and stacking the best frames. And I've never seen a $60 webcam that could even come close to the sensor resolution of any of our DSLR's.

Here's one taken with a 40D and 300mm lens and a couple of extenders (single image, not stacked):



--
Mike Mullen
 
mmullen said:
That's non-sensical. There is nothing preventing a SLR from shooting
continuously and stacking the best frames.
Click to expand...
Mine is a stack of 9 of 50. However, videos are often stacks of 1000 of 6000 frames.

And I've never seen a $60
mmullen said:
webcam that could even come close to the sensor resolution of any of
our DSLR's.
Click to expand...
That's why they shoot mosaics.
mmullen said:
Here's one taken with a 40D and 300mm lens and a couple of extenders
(single image, not stacked):
Click to expand...
And this was taken on video:

http://objectstyle.org/astronominsk/Moon/Moon2008/Moon_20080819_en.htm

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
Excellent shot Mike!

Thank you!

Danny Tuason :)
mmullen said:
AWelsh said:
Even with that said, a $60 webcam and low-cost telescope can image
circles around a DSLR any day, simply because the webcam can record
video, and you can hand-pick out the stillest frames, then stack
hundreds of them to smooth out the noise of each individual frame.
Click to expand...
That's non-sensical. There is nothing preventing a SLR from shooting
continuously and stacking the best frames. And I've never seen a $60
webcam that could even come close to the sensor resolution of any of
our DSLR's.

Here's one taken with a 40D and 300mm lens and a couple of extenders
(single image, not stacked):



--
Mike Mullen
Click to expand...
--
http://www.scandinavius.com/sweden/sesongs.html#anchor1139692
 
This is Romy's shot of Jupiter with his 300-800/5.6 and 2x TC. This is much better than I can get from a single dSLR shot from my telescope, because my scope is smaller than his lens. This is actually quite good for a single-shot from a dSLR (we all know Romy's technique is outstanding). I'm only providing a link since it's not my shot:

http://www.pbase.com/liquidstone/image/80529667

This is my best shot of Jupiter through my smaller scope using video:



--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
ljfinger said:
ljfinger said:
And this was taken on video:

http://objectstyle.org/astronominsk/Moon/Moon2008/Moon_20080819_en.htm
Click to expand...
Here's another:

http://objectstyle.org/astronominsk/Moon/Moon2008/Moon_20080627_en.htm

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
Click to expand...
Thanks for posting these examples. They show levels of detail simply not possible (or really, really difficult) with a DSLR.

I agree it is counter-intuitive for a cheapo webcam to do better than a DSLR, but when stacking images to reduce the signal-to-noise ratio, 1000-6000 frames trumps 10 or 20 hands down. Plus, you capture more still moments recording continuous video versus a few snapshots with your DSLR. Plus, you would have to put a lot of wear and tear to achieve the same result. The only drawbacks to a webcam is the field of view, and a single DSLR shot is a lot faster to process :)

--
Check out my astrophotos:
http://astro.welsh-house.net/
 
mmullen said:
ljfinger said:
And this was taken on video:

http://objectstyle.org/astronominsk/Moon/Moon2008/Moon_20080819_en.htm
Click to expand...
A stunning shot but I see it was taken with a 3000mm lens and a $1500
black and white CCD - not a $60 webcam with an integrated lens.
Click to expand...
When we take video with webcams (my Jupiter shot was taken with a web cam bought at Walmart for $58.88) we remove the lens.

Look at my Jupiter shot versus Romy's. His was taken with a $1000 camera and a $6000 lens. Mine was taken with a $60 camera and a $700 telescope, including tripod and tracking mount (the scope itself is about $300). Video is a very powerful way of extracting detail through the atmosphere.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
ljfinger said:
mmullen said:
ljfinger said:
And this was taken on video:

http://objectstyle.org/astronominsk/Moon/Moon2008/Moon_20080819_en.htm
Click to expand...
A stunning shot but I see it was taken with a 3000mm lens and a $1500
black and white CCD - not a $60 webcam with an integrated lens.
Click to expand...
When we take video with webcams (my Jupiter shot was taken with a web
cam bought at Walmart for $58.88) we remove the lens.
Click to expand...
Just supposing someone was crazy enough to want to stack a few (20? 30?) moon shots taken with the 40D and 300/4+1.4xTC, what stacking software would you recommend? It has to be free - I only want to 'dabble'.
 
Steve Balcombe said:
ljfinger said:
mmullen said:
ljfinger said:
And this was taken on video:

http://objectstyle.org/astronominsk/Moon/Moon2008/Moon_20080819_en.htm
Click to expand...
A stunning shot but I see it was taken with a 3000mm lens and a $1500
black and white CCD - not a $60 webcam with an integrated lens.
Click to expand...
When we take video with webcams (my Jupiter shot was taken with a web
cam bought at Walmart for $58.88) we remove the lens.
Click to expand...
Just supposing someone was crazy enough to want to stack a few (20?
30?) moon shots taken with the 40D and 300/4+1.4xTC, what stacking
software would you recommend? It has to be free - I only want to
'dabble'.
Click to expand...
Mine was 9 of 50 stacked. I used Registax 4 (free). It's a bit of a learning curve.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
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