Reading mode: Light Dark

All you PhotoSIGers

  • Thread starter Thread starter avanbeek
  • Start date Start date
Go to last post
Because the hang time is so short, your odds of getting a consistent sample of viewers (similar skill levels, ability to crritique, design background or none, etc) is about zilch. Also, there are wildly wacky ratios between number of views and number of critiques, so you can't even go by that. It's just all over the map!

Also certain kinds of pictures "draw" better than others: nudes of course, brighly colored sunsets and animals, pretty girls. Abstract art, portraits, and highly detailed shots that don't do well at thumnail size all get less action. (Unfortunately, those are what I like to shoot, aw shucks).

What's left to do is look for a trend, treat that with a grain of salt, and read the written critiques. if 5 people all tell you the focus is just too soft, well, you might listen. If only one says it and the other four say "nice colors and good composition" don't worry too much about the soft focus comment. Etc.

In other words, take what you can get, use your judgment to evaluate critiques, and don't make the mistake of thinking a posted image is you. It's not, it's just a posted image and exists whether you do or not. If you can make that separation, it's a whole lot easier to be objective about the critiques and not worry so much about the points.

Eric
 
erichocinc said:
Because the hang time is so short, your odds of getting a
consistent sample of viewers (similar skill levels, ability to
crritique, design background or none, etc) is about zilch. Also,
there are wildly wacky ratios between number of views and number of
critiques, so you can't even go by that. It's just all over the
map!
Click to expand...
In my case I can say that my good pictures get 1 vote for every 4 viewers, sometimes 1/3. It is usually the max. For less interesting pictures it's less. I am talking about the pictures that I think are the best among the ones I submit. Except for a few surprises the feedback I get is usually pretty consistent with what I think of what I submit. A few times, it is just obvious that the photo has passed too quickly and was unnoticed. In these circumstances I don't think that it hurts to provide a link so that people can take a look at those photos.
Erichatch said:
What's left to do is look for a trend, treat that with a grain of
salt, and read the written critiques. if 5 people all tell you the
focus is just too soft, well, you might listen. If only one says
it and the other four say "nice colors and good composition" don't
worry too much about the soft focus comment. Etc.
Click to expand...
What's important is the intent. I am not too interested in the technical feedback over there (more the exposure it gives). Don't get me wrong, I appreciate and welcome it, but often it is about something that goes against my intent while taking the picture. Intent is something I have started to develop after shooting, shooting, and shooting more and now there is more purpose when I take a picture. Comments pertaining to things like this are not intersting to me. Things that would make you change your picture into something that you did not want to do in the first place.

David.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
 
Hi David,

This is interesting, "intent" and "purpose" -- care to explain further? I "think" I noticed a shift in your posted photos when you got the Canon D30. Do you think it was the camera, or this intent and purpose you are shooting with now?

Some photos I still take as "family photos" as I call them.



This is an example. Just a quick shot out my window. The fog was so heavy last night it left drops of water. I like the growing apple cluster. Photosig? I wouldn't bother, but I share this one with my close friends (and now this forum) as a point in my life, things I notice in my day and take a few seconds enjoying.

So I'm just curious how you define intent and purpose

Dee
David Pichevin said:
Intent is something I have started to develop after shooting,
shooting, and shooting more and now there is more purpose when I
take a picture. Comments pertaining to things like this are not
intersting to me. Things that would make you change your picture
into something that you did not want to do in the first place.

David.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
Click to expand...
 
David Pichevin said:
erichocinc said:
Because the hang time is so short, your odds of getting a
consistent sample of viewers (similar skill levels, ability to
crritique, design background or none, etc) is about zilch. Also,
there are wildly wacky ratios between number of views and number of
critiques, so you can't even go by that. It's just all over the
map!
Click to expand...
In my case I can say that my good pictures get 1 vote for every 4
viewers, sometimes 1/3. It is usually the max. For less interesting
pictures it's less. I am talking about the pictures that I think
are the best among the ones I submit. Except for a few surprises
the feedback I get is usually pretty consistent with what I think
of what I submit. A few times, it is just obvious that the photo
has passed too quickly and was unnoticed. In these circumstances I
don't think that it hurts to provide a link so that people can take
a look at those photos.
David Pichevin said:
What's left to do is look for a trend, treat that with a grain of
salt, and read the written critiques. if 5 people all tell you the
focus is just too soft, well, you might listen. If only one says
it and the other four say "nice colors and good composition" don't
worry too much about the soft focus comment. Etc.
Click to expand...
What's important is the intent. I am not too interested in the
technical feedback over there (more the exposure it gives). Don't
get me wrong, I appreciate and welcome it, but often it is about
something that goes against my intent while taking the picture.
Intent is something I have started to develop after shooting,
shooting, and shooting more and now there is more purpose when I
take a picture. Comments pertaining to things like this are not
intersting to me. Things that would make you change your picture
into something that you did not want to do in the first place.

David.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
Click to expand...
David, I think you've hit it right on the head with intent. Not only are you the only one who knows your intent, but I find it hard to offer anything more than the fact that I like an image if I am not certain about the photographer's intent. Only when my image comes close to what I intended do I show it to anyone, and if they don't see the same thing I do, I don't let it bother me. I think evolving as a photographer means creating images that please you, rather than trying to please others. Of course, if it does both. that's great!

Larz
 
Dee Golden said:
Hi David,

This is interesting, "intent" and "purpose" -- care to explain
further? I "think" I noticed a shift in your posted photos when you
got the Canon D30. Do you think it was the camera, or this intent
and purpose you are shooting with now?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure the camera has much to do with it. It might have opened some possibilities and changed the way I work but I give more importance to practice and gaining experience. I improve with every new photo I take. I discover that my photos require less and less level/contrast tweak and that the exposure is right more often than before (even with the same camera).

In terms of intent and purpose it's very simple to me. Sometimes you take snapshots. Something looks cool, you don't think too much, you snap. You didn't have the intent to turn that thing into a masterpiece. I am not sure what kind of critique you can expect on this kind of photos. Because we are talking about a snapshot. No preparations, not too much work put into it. Just the intent to snap something quickly. I won't upload my snapshots because I think they are not that good myself and I know that there is nothing on them to improve beyond the fact that in order to get a better photo you need to spend more time on it and less snap :)

So, let's talk about something else than snapshots. I posted a waterlilly photo that i cropped vertically and I placed the flower on a 3 thirds line. A third from the top. One of the feedbacks I got was: too much stuff at the front, it needs to be cropped out. I won't do that. My intent was to leave the space at the front. I think it works. Somebody else thinks it doesn't, others don't care. That goes directly to the intent, what you want to do, show, and what looks good to your eyes. It doesn't really matter what the other one thinks of it. Now if your exposure was completely off that would be another matter. In my case, I won't post anything with the exposure completely off because I think I have progressed enough to see these things myself.

Another example: I have an egret shot where the egret is just walking in shallow water and is leaving a wake behind it. Some said that I should crop off the left and leave more space to the right in the direction the egret is looking. Now aside from the fact that it's not that easy to know in which direction this kind of bird is looking, I know all about leaving spece in the direction of sight etc...etc...but my intent was different. I wanted to show the wake and the egret coming from somewhere and give the impression of movement. Should I change it because someone didn't see it that way? Who's right? These are comments that I am usually not interested in because they really go to the intent of the photographer. I could have many more examples as it is usually the kind of comments I get.

A butterfly shot. Some will be interested in doing extreme macros and showing every detail of the bug. I am more interested in getting a good sharp view of the insect (as best I can) while placing it in its surroundings and making a composition out of it. Both views are valid but the intent is different. In this case, some would probably post a critique that say that I don't show enough detail on the bug, or even that I should show it full frame and the background is disctracting. That also goes purely to intent. If I did what is suggested then it would be an entrely different shot and not what I was trying to do.

With more practice, aside from better technical skills and handling of the camera (better DOF work, better exposure, better composition than before) I think that I have now acquired some "intent", some more vision, hoping that this doesn't sound conceited. A more precise idea of what I want to do.

I hope this babble makes sense to someone :)

David.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
 
There's missing the point then there's this...
Glenn A said:
A Van Beek said:
I thought you might like to know that there are a lot of people on
the photoSIG site who have agreements with one another to bump up
eachothers scores. So when you see a so-so shot that is really no
better than yours with a score of 150, now you know why. So in
other words, don't be discouraged that your work isn't as good as
other people's and be happy that you aren't that superficial.

--

Regards,
AVB
Click to expand...
Ask three photographers their opinion on a particular photograph
and you will get three different answers. Although in my younger
days I have won a few contests, I no longer enter for the above
reason. Look at the photos, enjoy them and forget about what other
people think. Enjoy..

Glenn A
Click to expand...
--

Regards,
AVB
http://www.pbase.com/avanbeek
 
Larz Yerxa said:
David, I think you've hit it right on the head with intent. Not
only are you the only one who knows your intent, but I find it hard
to offer anything more than the fact that I like an image if I am
not certain about the photographer's intent. Only when my image
comes close to what I intended do I show it to anyone, and if they
don't see the same thing I do, I don't let it bother me. I think
evolving as a photographer means creating images that please you,
rather than trying to please others. Of course, if it does both.
that's great!
Click to expand...
Yep. Of course, YMMV as we say and I understand that everybody works differently and there can be great value in critique for others. I rarely post anything for critique, although I welcome anybody who wants to do so or maybe ask questions about how it was done and about why (I feel that asking questions first would be a better way towards good critique). On the other hand I am also pretty bad at giving critique to others beyond technical tips and methods, for the exact same reasons. Unless of course somebody asks precise questions about what he/she should do in a specific case. But then again, that would only be my point of view. My very humble opinion is that in photography, practice makes better, and also looking at what is done, but rarely critique. The flaws in your pictures, if any, I think that you will discover them yourself at some point in time, and you get also more demanding on yourself and less satisfied by what you have done before.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
 
I agree, intent is everything... but without execution, intent cannot be communicated.

For example, if your intent is to scare your viewer, and he/she laughs instead, you have failed in the execution of your intent.

It's possible to go at this subject front-to-back or the other way around. If you have a sense of design, and communicating the design is your intent, the emotional reaciton of your viewer is at play -- you don't control it. By contrast, if you're a pornographer (not that you are, this is for arguement's sake), your intent is clearly to sexually arouse your viewer. If instead you evoke a sense of mystery, you have failed, sorry bubba.

It's an interactive system: if as photographer you're looking at the design, you influence the emotional reaction but may be surprised by it. If you're aiming at a specific emotional reaction, something in the execution may de-rail your intent.

So, bottom line, you can think something like "I want to capture/ convey the beauty of this scene," but everything after that depends on your designer's eye and your photographic technique. And sometimes, the technique triumphs, and you accomplish something far beyond your intent. That's called talent. Wish I had more of it!
 
Hi David,

Thanks for your response. I still take snapshots, sometimes because the photo will disappear. Other times I take the time to analyze the scene and try to get the best composition, so I think I know what you are talking about.

When it comes to critiques that disagree with my "intent" I try to see the critquer's point of view, and whether they are sincerely offering a well thought critique or just hoping for some extra critique points. There were a series of photos i used for my calendar gift project, and to fit the layout they were cropped a certain way. I learned to express my intent in my photo description to avoid some of these critiques (which suggested different cropping that would have gone against my "intent").

Sometimes my intent -- I wanted to show a dog patiently waiting inbetween his owner and a person his owner was chatting with, but most of the critiques didn't want to see the feet. I resubmitted it and got some different critiquers responding to it, and one critique didn't like the leash showing! Geesh! But I've learned that my intent won't always be popular. Showing the dog and the feet of it's owner was a more journalistic portrayal while people who like dogs just wanted to see the dog!

I did notice an improvement in the photos you submitted, so your philosophy must be working!

Dee
 
Dee Golden said:
Sometimes my intent -- I wanted to show a dog patiently waiting
inbetween his owner and a person his owner was chatting with, but
most of the critiques didn't want to see the feet. I resubmitted it
and got some different critiquers responding to it, and one
critique didn't like the leash showing! Geesh! But I've learned
that my intent won't always be popular. Showing the dog and the
feet of it's owner was a more journalistic portrayal while people
who like dogs just wanted to see the dog!
Click to expand...
Just like the bee example :)
Dee Golden said:
I did notice an improvement in the photos you submitted, so your
philosophy must be working!
Click to expand...
Well, thanks :) I hope I am impoving :)

I first submitted "older" photos to Photosig, as well as more recent favorite ones but I then had about 3 weeks last month without taking one single shots. I have more stuff to show these days.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
 
Yes it does make sense. It's where I hope to be and each day is a snap closer. Still a ways to go but I keep trying.
David Pichevin said:
Dee Golden said:
Hi David,

This is interesting, "intent" and "purpose" -- care to explain
further? I "think" I noticed a shift in your posted photos when you
got the Canon D30. Do you think it was the camera, or this intent
and purpose you are shooting with now?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure the camera has much to do with it. It might have
opened some possibilities and changed the way I work but I give
more importance to practice and gaining experience. I improve with
every new photo I take. I discover that my photos require less and
less level/contrast tweak and that the exposure is right more often
than before (even with the same camera).

In terms of intent and purpose it's very simple to me. Sometimes
you take snapshots. Something looks cool, you don't think too much,
you snap. You didn't have the intent to turn that thing into a
masterpiece. I am not sure what kind of critique you can expect on
this kind of photos. Because we are talking about a snapshot. No
preparations, not too much work put into it. Just the intent to
snap something quickly. I won't upload my snapshots because I think
they are not that good myself and I know that there is nothing on
them to improve beyond the fact that in order to get a better photo
you need to spend more time on it and less snap :)

So, let's talk about something else than snapshots. I posted a
waterlilly photo that i cropped vertically and I placed the flower
on a 3 thirds line. A third from the top. One of the feedbacks I
got was: too much stuff at the front, it needs to be cropped out. I
won't do that. My intent was to leave the space at the front. I
think it works. Somebody else thinks it doesn't, others don't care.
That goes directly to the intent, what you want to do, show, and
what looks good to your eyes. It doesn't really matter what the
other one thinks of it. Now if your exposure was completely off
that would be another matter. In my case, I won't post anything
with the exposure completely off because I think I have progressed
enough to see these things myself.

Another example: I have an egret shot where the egret is just
walking in shallow water and is leaving a wake behind it. Some said
that I should crop off the left and leave more space to the right
in the direction the egret is looking. Now aside from the fact that
it's not that easy to know in which direction this kind of bird is
looking, I know all about leaving spece in the direction of sight
etc...etc...but my intent was different. I wanted to show the wake
and the egret coming from somewhere and give the impression of
movement. Should I change it because someone didn't see it that
way? Who's right? These are comments that I am usually not
interested in because they really go to the intent of the
photographer. I could have many more examples as it is usually the
kind of comments I get.

A butterfly shot. Some will be interested in doing extreme macros
and showing every detail of the bug. I am more interested in
getting a good sharp view of the insect (as best I can) while
placing it in its surroundings and making a composition out of it.
Both views are valid but the intent is different. In this case,
some would probably post a critique that say that I don't show
enough detail on the bug, or even that I should show it full frame
and the background is disctracting. That also goes purely to
intent. If I did what is suggested then it would be an entrely
different shot and not what I was trying to do.

With more practice, aside from better technical skills and handling
of the camera (better DOF work, better exposure, better composition
than before) I think that I have now acquired some "intent", some
more vision, hoping that this doesn't sound conceited. A more
precise idea of what I want to do.

I hope this babble makes sense to someone :)

David.

--
Canon D30 ~ 50mm 1.8 ~ 28-135 IS
My photo galleries: http://www.pbase.com/davidp
Click to expand...
 
Andreas P. said:
Hi Mike,
Great job! I like it a lot!
Click to expand...
Hi Andreas, I can't claim the credit for this -- it's an actual screen capture of a normally hidden Photoshop 5.5 splash screen. Like a lot of other software, Photoshop has at least one fairly well known "Easter egg" built into it -- a hidden function written by the development programmers to amuse themselves and others who exchange information about the application.

The only thing I did to the image was add the red swirl, to highlight the "They killed Kenny!" comment. The underlying screen varies according to which version of Photoshop you're using, and that was just one of a large number of crazy, humorous comments that pops up while the list of credits scrolls underneath.

Information on Easter eggs found in many applications can be read here (and in all sorts of places on the Web):
http://www.htsoft.com/easter

Mike

 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Keyboard shortcuts

f
Forum
m
My threads
Mobile site
About
Editorial content
Cameras & Lenses
Community
All content, design, and layout are Copyright © 1998–2025 Digital Photography Review All Rights Reserved.
Reproduction in whole or part in any form or medium without specific written permission is prohibited.
When you use DPReview links to buy products, the site may earn a commission.
©GPS Media - Guides, Products, Services.
Back
Top