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Canon can't win with a 5D replacement

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To Badbatz: Your response is an insult to those who have suffered with problems FOR REAL (including me who was obliged to return 2 MKIIs and forced over to Nikon - time ran out). And if it wasn't for the Internet Canon and its customers would be none the wiser. You have also ignore Canon's firmware and hardware fixes... or perhaps those too were for Internet Idiots...?

To OP: I sincerely hope Canon get's the 5D right and with the time they have taken to develop it, and in the light of their own 'mistakes' (minor upgrades to medium level cameras and the well publicised errors with the 1D and possibly 1DS) and Nikon's product onslaught, I suspect they will. They will be looking at the new 5D (possibly in 2 priced versions) as a unique new product to combat bad PR and Nikon in the FF market. And to achieve this the AF system has to be at least as good as its competitors, and will probably be new (albeit an update of what already exists). IQ will also have to an improvement on what Nikon is offering together with basics such as metering and WB. It MUST also be weathersealed which Nikon has be offering for several years even at mid-level. I still have Canon lenses which I am holding onto with fingers crossed...

The original 5D set the standard in its price range for IQ and the new version will have to exceed that standard. The D700 and possibly Sony models now populate the market originally established by Canon. It's now up to Canon to set new standards in that market - nothing less will do.
Tony
 
kruger said:
You sure about that Fanboy ?
Click to expand...
Yep, as in 2+2=4. Anybody with even passing, but hands-on, familiarity with 1D3 knows otherwise. Even the most rabid internet posters (RG comes to mind) admit that 1D3 is a superb camera and keep using it... Not perfect, but superb nonetheless.
 
yes, of course Canon should give up on cameras and just make copiers
of course you are right with your "facts"
LMAO

--
Canon EOS 5D & 40D - Albuquerque NM
 
The reason for such childish behavior is because "FANBOYS" will be "FANBOYS"!
Katy C. said:
Your post was logical and a well thought out analysis of Canons dilemma.

I was amazed that anyone could call it drivel especially as quite a
few posts lately have been so childish!

Katy
Click to expand...
 
Exactly! You hit the nail on the head Pix... to bring out a new model like the MKIII with inherent problems (proven and acknowledged by Canon - eventually) as part of the illustrious model designation is almost unbelieveable, and suicidal. In brand terms it's a disaster that's even bigger than we realise here on DPR. And this is the reason why the 5D with be a revelation (nothing less will do) and the Mark 4 will follow shortly after. As well as being a photographer, I'm involved in marketing and to me it's one of the biggest product ****-ups I've ever seen (as was the timing and nature of the response to it by Canon).

So well done Pix, you at last nailed it... took a while though...
Tony
 
RedFox88 said:
Werecow said:
Canon can't do that with the 5D successor though because that would
mean having to do one of two things..
  1. 1 Using the mk3's AF system, which has been disastrous for Canon
already in the 1D series.
Click to expand...
The focusing of the 1D3 looks pretty much fixed and resolved now.
Click to expand...
WOW - "Pretty much fixed" after charging customers $4499 a pop to beta test it.
RedFox88 said:
RedFox88 said:
  1. 2 Using an AF system which is more reliable than the mk3's. Which
Canon won't do either as it'll render the mk3 null and void.
Click to expand...
No because they are unlikely to put a CPU dedicated just to focusing
like in the 1-series models so you can drop in the focusing but it
won't have the ai-servo performance of the 1D and 1Ds lines.
RedFox88 said:
The only thing i can think of which would stem the flow of customers
to Nikon would be for them to release a new 1D camera and a 5D
replacement at the same time, with pretty much the same internals
like the D3 - D700 relationship.
Click to expand...
Canon won't do that and they don't need to do that. nikon did what
they did with the d300/d700/d3 in order to catch buyers. They cut
deeply the sales of their d3 by the two lesser models. The d300 was
a aps-c sensor d3 that is you pay $200 more for the vertical grip you
get just 1fps less than the d3 for $3000 less and the d700 is a d3
with sensor cleaner, with popup flash for $1800 less and 1fps less if
you get it with the vertical grip.

The d3x will come soon probaly at $5000 or $6000 followed by a $3000
d800 with the same d3x sensor.

Canon makes excellent cameras and a better lens lineup than nikon, a
good customer base, and has no need to sell a lexus for the price of
a Camry.
Click to expand...
Well if Lexus is going to sell for the same price as a Camry, I am going to buy the Lexus. The Camry can sit and rot for all I care. Hello - anybody home!
 
Oh please... forget the 40D, it's not that great and why would anybody want to base anything on it. No, the 5D will be new from the ground up... I'd put money on it!
Tony
 
astirusty said:
For marketing reasons, I believe Canon is going to have to axe the
1D_-Mk_ line of cameras to get away from the bad rep caused by the
Mk3s. IMO: Canon will have to create a new line, with a slightly
altered body styling, and advertise the new line as having a totally
new AF system.
Click to expand...
And why would people bet their bottom dollar that another new body style and new AF system will work better than the III series? I suspect there will be a lot less early adopters when the 'new line' gets announced.
astirusty said:
Canon would also be wise to offer the new line to current 1D(s)-Mk3
owners at a very steep discount.
Click to expand...
Why? People bought those mkIIIs voluntarily, even after the issue was exposed. Canon never forced anyone to upgrade.

Max
 
tissunique said:
Exactly! You hit the nail on the head Pix...
...
So well done Pix, you at last nailed it... took a while though...
Tony
Click to expand...
Tony, sorry to disappoint you but Pix did not suggest the idea of name/style change; he thinks the idea is absurd. So in your terms, Pix missed the nail head and the 2x6 board too. ;)
 
I have been a Canon user (5D, 40D, 1Ds) for many years now - switching from Nikon because of Canon's better upgrade options, and high ISO performance.

Well, things have changed dramatically over the last year or so over at Nikon. So much so, that I am now contemplating a liquidation of all my Canon gear, and re-investing in Nikon's 5D competitor - the D700. One of the main reasons for me to move over to the D700 is because of the peerless Nikkor 14-24 f2.8. I am basically a landscape photographer, and this is a dream lens for me. Canon has nothing, zoom or prime that can compare with this landmark piece of glass. Even Canon's weak attempt to address their shortcoming in the wide angle zoom dept (16-35 f2.8 II), falls far short of Nikon's now legendary 14-24 f2.8. Canon folks have even taken to getting specialized EOS adapters to be able to work with this outstanding piece of optics.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1032&message=26403457

I also agree with the OP'ers premise that Canon will likely do a "incremental" upgrade on any new 5D replacement - not wanting to step on the toes of it's iD line. Canon has dropped the ball on the whole 5D situation and either seriously mis-calculated Nikon's response to this FF niche, or arrogantly dismissed it - thinking that us original 5D users would wait patiently for a 5D II replacement - regardless of what Nikon offered...WRONG!

Unless Canon announces something quite dramatic in the semi-pro/pro FF DSLR range - with dramatic pricing to match, they will continue to hemorrhage customers to Nikon, or even to Sony - with it's upcoming 24MP, FF, Alpha A900.

Whatever Canon does belatedly announce, it is too late for me, as I have an upcoming commissioned shoot in early September, and I need a lighter, more responsive FF DSLR than the older 5D offers right now. The D700, paired with the incredible 14-24, as well as the Nikkor 24-70 f2.8 (also trumping Canon in this range), is just too good a combo for Canon to compete with.
 
tissunique said:
as part of the illustrious model designation
is almost unbelieveable, and suicidal.
Click to expand...
...And yet, the sold them... A LOT of them... And (incredibly)... THEY ARE

WORKING!!! And pictures from the Olympics are coming (in fact, the FINEST images that I have seen, so far, are all coming from the 1D Mark III and 1D Mark IIN)...

Explain my dear Tissy, WHY IN THE WORLD would that be?

:-)

PIX

--

'What we do in life, echoes in eternity...'
 
I enjoy coming to this Canon forum, especially to see people's views on the 5D, a camera in which I'm very interested.

The Nikon forums tend to be full of people ready to jump down people's throats with little provocation, and it's disappointing to see this happening over here.

I would never be offended if someone slagged off anything to do with my equipment (Nikon D300 etc), and hopefully, Canon gear is also strong enough to take any amount of criticism.

People should be able to air their views without fear of rudeness or insult.
 
lordbeau said:
I enjoy coming to this Canon forum, especially to see people's views
on the 5D, a camera in which I'm very interested.

The Nikon forums tend to be full of people ready to jump down
people's throats with little provocation, and it's disappointing to
see this happening over here.

I would never be offended if someone slagged off anything to do with
my equipment (Nikon D300 etc), and hopefully, Canon gear is also
strong enough to take any amount of criticism.

People should be able to air their views without fear of rudeness or
insult.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately, there are enough brand-worshipers here to sink the Titanic without the berg... :( Pixmantra leads that charge, and tries to trash anyone who notes flaws within the brand. It's as though he's psychologically compelled to do so.

--
-----------------
A few Markuson Images...
Look-see at:
http://www.pbase.com/markuson
 
Every time I hear that massive numbers of people who own $10-20,000 in Canon glass are going to defect to Nikon simply because Nikon now has comparable specs in some areas ... geez, am I the only person who fails to find any reason in this argument?

I own the above mentioned $20,000 of Canon glass, and also a bunch of film gear, am getting a little Sigma gear for IR shooting (now that EIR is gone), am buying more film gear, and if I wanted to shoot landscapes with the 12-24 I would buy a Nikon body just for that. (Or actually if I were back into that I would buy a 617. Maybe I will do it anyway just for auroras this next season.) I don't know why it's "one or the other."

Also isn't this a Canon forum? Just checking.
stevielee said:
I have been a Canon user (5D, 40D, 1Ds) for many years now -
switching from Nikon because of Canon's better upgrade options, and
high ISO performance.

Well, things have changed dramatically over the last year or so over
at Nikon. So much so, that I am now contemplating a liquidation of
all my Canon gear, and re-investing in Nikon's 5D competitor - the
D700. One of the main reasons for me to move over to the D700 is
because of the peerless Nikkor 14-24 f2.8. I am basically a landscape
photographer, and this is a dream lens for me. Canon has nothing,
zoom or prime that can compare with this landmark piece of glass.
Even Canon's weak attempt to address their shortcoming in the wide
angle zoom dept (16-35 f2.8 II), falls far short of Nikon's now
legendary 14-24 f2.8. Canon folks have even taken to getting
specialized EOS adapters to be able to work with this outstanding
piece of optics.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1032&message=26403457

I also agree with the OP'ers premise that Canon will likely do a
"incremental" upgrade on any new 5D replacement - not wanting to step
on the toes of it's iD line. Canon has dropped the ball on the whole
5D situation and either seriously mis-calculated Nikon's response to
this FF niche, or arrogantly dismissed it - thinking that us original
5D users would wait patiently for a 5D II replacement - regardless of
what Nikon offered...WRONG!

Unless Canon announces something quite dramatic in the semi-pro/pro
FF DSLR range - with dramatic pricing to match, they will continue to
hemorrhage customers to Nikon, or even to Sony - with it's upcoming
24MP, FF, Alpha A900.

Whatever Canon does belatedly announce, it is too late for me, as I
have an upcoming commissioned shoot in early September, and I need a
lighter, more responsive FF DSLR than the older 5D offers right now.
The D700, paired with the incredible 14-24, as well as the Nikkor
24-70 f2.8 (also trumping Canon in this range), is just too good a
combo for Canon to compete with.
Click to expand...
 
Markuson said:
Pixmantra leads that charge, and
tries to trash anyone who notes flaws within the brand. It's as
though he's psychologically compelled to do so.
Click to expand...
...C'mon! After your today's cross-forum, cross-network post (with new UserID created and evertyhing), you really went the extra mile! You literally exported your talent into another community, jus to... defend the D3!!!

Here's a gift, from a close friend: 8-)



Enjoy!

PIX

--

'What we do in life, echoes in eternity...'
 
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