I believe they have lots of common parts. Thats why the K20D is so "slow" and why all the K-series cameras so far has been to close to each other for comfort....
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Is a pro pentax coming
- Thread starter jagge
- Start date
Tjhe A700 is a very slow seller and Sony have admitted disapointment by its sales performance....
The D300 sells extremely well but its sale are going to be hit hard by the D700, in spite of only 12mp...
*isteve
Veteran Member
a model above the K20D.
It is likely to be the type of camera that Pentax do well, a well specced rugged enthusiasts camera with many pro-level features and build quality and some quirky Pentax features of its own.
We all hope it will have some improvements to frame rate, AF and matrix metering to keep up with the direct competition at its price bracket. I dont think that is unachievable at all, after all Oly managed it with the e3 and Sony with the A700 so I dont suppose Pentax cannot also do it with sufficient funds. However I also doubt it will be ground breaking either as Pentax will want to keep the price at a level where they can expect reasonable sales.
But a professional camera? I think the professional class is generally regarded as the 1D, 1Ds and 3D class. Other cameras may be used by pros but they are not marketed at pros. I cant see a camera in that class from Pentax in the next 2 years if ever. They may do FF eventually but more like the 5D class and probably using the same enhanced enthusiast body (vis D300 vs D700, and 20D vs 5D).
If they go after pros again I suspect they will dust of the 645, but I think they are more likely to dust off the micro APS instead if there is enough positive feedback from Oly.
Steve
When I can master technique I'll be a photographer.
When I can realise a vision I'll be an artist.
When I get paid I'll be a professional.
It is likely to be the type of camera that Pentax do well, a well specced rugged enthusiasts camera with many pro-level features and build quality and some quirky Pentax features of its own.
We all hope it will have some improvements to frame rate, AF and matrix metering to keep up with the direct competition at its price bracket. I dont think that is unachievable at all, after all Oly managed it with the e3 and Sony with the A700 so I dont suppose Pentax cannot also do it with sufficient funds. However I also doubt it will be ground breaking either as Pentax will want to keep the price at a level where they can expect reasonable sales.
But a professional camera? I think the professional class is generally regarded as the 1D, 1Ds and 3D class. Other cameras may be used by pros but they are not marketed at pros. I cant see a camera in that class from Pentax in the next 2 years if ever. They may do FF eventually but more like the 5D class and probably using the same enhanced enthusiast body (vis D300 vs D700, and 20D vs 5D).
If they go after pros again I suspect they will dust of the 645, but I think they are more likely to dust off the micro APS instead if there is enough positive feedback from Oly.
--
Steve
When I can master technique I'll be a photographer.
When I can realise a vision I'll be an artist.
When I get paid I'll be a professional.
*isteve
Veteran Member
Who said?
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Steve
When I can master technique I'll be a photographer.
When I can realise a vision I'll be an artist.
When I get paid I'll be a professional.
tellem_esdreamin
Forum Enthusiast
Hi
Ian
maybe that is why......
and BTW I think they do too, I would have no hesitation recommending them. But in terms of fully blown Pro models no doubt that price will go up.
Ian
Hopefully the K200D replacement will have a K200D-sized body with the K20D sensor, AA batteries and a few more borrowed features.
I'm thinking about....2 wheels...I guess I can always dream.
I'm thinking about....2 wheels...I guess I can always dream.
Ha, ha, LOL trust You to come out with something like that, ROTFL.
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Regards Allan.
breeze_of_wind
Senior Member
Hoya's current financial statement seems upbeat, but the Pentax group suffered a 38 million yen loss (or $345,081).
The Reuters article had the following quote -- for what it is worth:
Hoya Chief Financial Officer Kenji Ema said it would be difficult for Hoya to turn
the Pentax unit profitable on a quarterly basis in the current business year
through March 2009.
"We are planning various restructuring measures, which will cost us at first and
then benefit us later," Ema told a news conference.
The Reuters article had the following quote -- for what it is worth:
Hoya Chief Financial Officer Kenji Ema said it would be difficult for Hoya to turn
the Pentax unit profitable on a quarterly basis in the current business year
through March 2009.
"We are planning various restructuring measures, which will cost us at first and
then benefit us later," Ema told a news conference.
inspector17
Active member
agree with all but would include that a K1D could benefit from a top drawer redesign of the Pentax flash system
Professionals will be expecting a great flash system.
Another thing - I LOVE the fact that the K20D body is as small as it is. Canon bodies feel dumptruck sized in comparison
Professionals will be expecting a great flash system.
Another thing - I LOVE the fact that the K20D body is as small as it is. Canon bodies feel dumptruck sized in comparison
1. You're describing the K30D, not the K1D. These features will differentiate the K30D from the K20D, but not enough for a K1D vs K20D. C*non 's x00D and x0D share the same sensor, have basically the same IQ, yet they're regarded as well-differentiated. Their xD and x0D are differentiated by sensor size. That's probably a bigger difference than a 2nd version of the Samsung 14.6Mp can make to the 1st version. Better IQ is great, but given the great IQ the K20D already has, the K1D better come out with something more than a mere marginal benefit.
You have to think about how the K1D should still be a higher-spec'ed than the K30D when it comes out. If the K1D is a body with only these improvements you describe, a K30D will not be possible.
2. Plus, differentiating from the K10D is not where the focus should be. Instead, time will be better spent to make it obviously higher spec'ed than the D300.
If past bodies are any indication, these should be evolutionary features (i.e. K30D)
If on a bigger body, why not - if we want the same size/weight of the K20D, not quite plausible.
We're onto something. IMHO without improvements in fps, shutter speed, and/or flash sync, it will have nothing over the K30D.
Drastic improvement of AF in EV below 5 is critical - I missed a few shots yesterday in an event again. We should not be required to prefocus and then switch to MF for a shot. Now the K20D is out and IMHO the IQ objective is accomplished.
Speed should be the next objective.
It's a nice feature, but I'd be happy with the GPS in the grip rather than in the body. Also, making the SD card in the grip directly usable is also appreciated - changing cards can make you miss shots - and not everyone carries multiple bodies around.
You're describing at best a K30D with the DA17-70. Star lens with a new body at $1400 USD? It is fantasy.
If the K1D is such an upgradable beast, a lot of us would shell out $1400 body only.
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
I'm not convinced about that.
The Nikon D300 (APS-C) sells better than the 5D (24x36) from Canon.
This shows that people are willing to pay for pro-level APS-C. It exist a market for pro-level APS-C. And pro-level APS-C is less expensive than pro-level 24x36.
The A700 from Sony sells reasonably well, but it has not been marketed well enough.
Sony is not taken as seriously as they would like, this is a problem for them. Sony has a styling-over-performance-image and features-for-features-own-sake-attitude that is a drawback for them in the professional SLR market.
Pentax, being a classic camera company, would go better in the pro-market than Sony. I'm sure.
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
The Nikon D300 (APS-C) sells better than the 5D (24x36) from Canon.
This shows that people are willing to pay for pro-level APS-C. It exist a market for pro-level APS-C. And pro-level APS-C is less expensive than pro-level 24x36.
The A700 from Sony sells reasonably well, but it has not been marketed well enough.
Sony is not taken as seriously as they would like, this is a problem for them. Sony has a styling-over-performance-image and features-for-features-own-sake-attitude that is a drawback for them in the professional SLR market.
Pentax, being a classic camera company, would go better in the pro-market than Sony. I'm sure.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
DLBlack
Forum Pro
I do agree with everything you stated below. There is room for an APC-S camera above the K20D. I am sure when it does come out it will have some minor improvements in the sensor but the biggest improvements will be in the FPS, AF, Metering and 100% viewfinder. I also would guess that it will be a larger body and maybe even metal. It will also have at least a 3" screen. This body will also be used for a FF camera in the future. At a later date when the K30D comes out a few of the K1D features will make their way into the K30D when it is possible without changing the body. Which might mean only the AF and metering since the shutter/mirror/viewfinder improvements might need the larger body of the K1D. This will maintain some degree of seperation between the different bodies.
I would still like to see the 645D as the serious pro-camera. I don't know if I could afford it. A "Micro APC-S" (maybe call it a K-Limited D) camera would also be nice.
Dave
I would still like to see the 645D as the serious pro-camera. I don't know if I could afford it. A "Micro APC-S" (maybe call it a K-Limited D) camera would also be nice.
[snip]
Dave
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
How do you know that the coming 60-250 is a 24x36 lens?
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Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
But the D300 has better image quality (or at least as good) as the 5D. The latter is an old camera with both outdated body and sensor; a replacement is imminent.
The D300 sells (sold) well because it is a Nikon and had no FF competition (then) from Nikon. Now it has.....
They are willing to pay for a pro level Nikon APS DSLR. I doubt many willbe willing to pay for a pro level Pentax or Sony APS DSLR much longer...
There are several FF cameras in the works....
So am I....
muxis
Forum Enthusiast
I wanted a pro level digital SLR from pentax and I settled on the *istD in 2003. It was a good camera, and still is, but I eventually outgrew it and went with the Canon 1D series. Five years later, Pentax hasn't come up with anything equivalent and I don't think that will happen anytime soon.
I still love my Pentax *istD and use it for travel and occasional trespassing due to its compactness and superior/intuitive controls (2-dials), and I don't get busted as often by security for being a PJ.
I still love my Pentax *istD and use it for travel and occasional trespassing due to its compactness and superior/intuitive controls (2-dials), and I don't get busted as often by security for being a PJ.
Given the general tone of the reactions to this thread :
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=28913087
A faster Pentax would not be welcome and there is apparently no market for it.
It seems that faster AF/fps is only required for people who mindlessly shoot in machine gun mode in the hope that they will catch a good one (and of course people with... errr... physical inadequacies....) ...
... ...
But I guess this might change if Pentax gets a 6fps camrera out... ;-)
Roland Mabo
Forum Pro
The D300 is still selling very well.
24x36 pro is more expensive than APS-C pro and this difference in price will continue to exist. Not everyone can afford 24x36 pro. A Pentax 24x36 would also be very expensive. If the market is not prepared to pay for a APS-C pro from Pentax, then the market is not prepared to pay for a 24x36 from Pentax either. Pentax has not been in the pro-market for system less than medium format, for many many years.
But since they have gained new market and new customers and increased market share with their APS-C system, I believe many APS-C users are willing to upgrade to a pro-level APS-C.
Both Nikon and Canon has had pro-level 24x36 for a long time since the film days. They have a large customer base here with a large collection of pro-level 24x36 glass. Pentax does not have a customerbase for pro 24x36, the users does not exist. Some amateurs that has bought old 24x36 lenses cheap on e-bay may not be prepared to pay the huge amount of money for a 24x36 body from Pentax, and those new customers with a large investment in APS-C glass may be more interrested in a high-end APS-C than a high-end 24x36. Seems a bit pointless to buy a 24x36 body when you can only use a small part of the DA lenses.
So a pro APS-C from Pentax is meant as an upgrade to existing users, to all the many new users that does not have a previous investment in 24x36 glass. Or to old users that went to Canon and Nikon for many years and now has come back to Pentax and invested huge money in APS-C lenses. And of course as a PR-trick to convince people choosing Pentax-system because there is an upgrade path from the K200D and K20D.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
24x36 pro is more expensive than APS-C pro and this difference in price will continue to exist. Not everyone can afford 24x36 pro. A Pentax 24x36 would also be very expensive. If the market is not prepared to pay for a APS-C pro from Pentax, then the market is not prepared to pay for a 24x36 from Pentax either. Pentax has not been in the pro-market for system less than medium format, for many many years.
But since they have gained new market and new customers and increased market share with their APS-C system, I believe many APS-C users are willing to upgrade to a pro-level APS-C.
Both Nikon and Canon has had pro-level 24x36 for a long time since the film days. They have a large customer base here with a large collection of pro-level 24x36 glass. Pentax does not have a customerbase for pro 24x36, the users does not exist. Some amateurs that has bought old 24x36 lenses cheap on e-bay may not be prepared to pay the huge amount of money for a 24x36 body from Pentax, and those new customers with a large investment in APS-C glass may be more interrested in a high-end APS-C than a high-end 24x36. Seems a bit pointless to buy a 24x36 body when you can only use a small part of the DA lenses.
So a pro APS-C from Pentax is meant as an upgrade to existing users, to all the many new users that does not have a previous investment in 24x36 glass. Or to old users that went to Canon and Nikon for many years and now has come back to Pentax and invested huge money in APS-C lenses. And of course as a PR-trick to convince people choosing Pentax-system because there is an upgrade path from the K200D and K20D.
--
Take care
R
http://www.flickr.com/photos/raphaelmabo
I'm certainly holding off for a higher level Pentax body . I hope there will be a FF camera so I can use my existing MF lenses to their full advantage .
I worked my way up through the range of film bodies over the years , latterly using two LX bodies and built up a fair collection of SMC manual lenses , some bought new , some secondhand long before the internet and eBay came about ( in those days we went to SHOPS to buy stuff ) .
I was never at all bothered about AF and happily stuck with manual focus . I only got an AF body when I bought my *istD and then got a few AF lenses to go with it . I would still happily use manual focus if only the viewfinder was good enough , but unfortunately the VF on APSC type AF cameras are just for composition and nowhere near good enough . I did subsequently buy a used MZ-S when it came up at a good price and the VF on that one is superb .
I think there are probably a lot of people like me with a fair inventory of K-mount manual glass who would welcome a Pentax FF digital body with a decent viewfinder making manual focus as easy as the film bodies did .
And I will be happy to pay for it .
--
With kind regards
Derek.
I worked my way up through the range of film bodies over the years , latterly using two LX bodies and built up a fair collection of SMC manual lenses , some bought new , some secondhand long before the internet and eBay came about ( in those days we went to SHOPS to buy stuff ) .
I was never at all bothered about AF and happily stuck with manual focus . I only got an AF body when I bought my *istD and then got a few AF lenses to go with it . I would still happily use manual focus if only the viewfinder was good enough , but unfortunately the VF on APSC type AF cameras are just for composition and nowhere near good enough . I did subsequently buy a used MZ-S when it came up at a good price and the VF on that one is superb .
I think there are probably a lot of people like me with a fair inventory of K-mount manual glass who would welcome a Pentax FF digital body with a decent viewfinder making manual focus as easy as the film bodies did .
And I will be happy to pay for it .
--
With kind regards
Derek.
He he thats funny but i think you are spot on. Such a cam would be great though to even the competition.
But it sure seems the K20D is a great cam, if it just delivered on speed...
Best wishes
Jakob
Jay Hawk
Leading Member
Pentax is going to be a niche market player. It's too expensive to try and cater to all tastes.
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http://www.pbase.com/gfakes
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http://www.pbase.com/gfakes
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