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Tripod/ballhead support for 500 f4 and other lenses

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Andy Blanchard said:
For maximum flexibility in one support I'll go with the
3541, M20 and Sidekick which works with everything just fine. For
dedicated wildlife shooting, the M20 and Sidekick get swapped out for
the full Wimberley on the 3531, but for sports/action work my support
of choice is a monopod (also fitted with a lever clamp) or hand held.
Click to expand...
I think that's it! The sidekick with M20 combo probably works for 90% of shooting needs and lens/camera combos. If I really need BIF photos, I may need to go for the full head. Also, the 3541 may be a good choice, only 0.7 lb heavier than the 2540.
Andy Blanchard said:
If I'm working from a vehicle (on Safari, say), I'll generally work
with multiple bodies on multiple support systems and swap stuff
around as required. That generally means a tripod with the
M20/Wimberley, the Ergorest with the Sidekick as required, several
beanbags dotted around and hand held when all else fails.
Click to expand...
My experience on Safari vehicles was with bean bags only, (since tripods were going to be useless) and with a lens plate and two wimberley M-1s attached to it at either end (idea courtesy Joe and Mary Ann McDonald), the camera and lens were rock steady. This is what everyone else was using, including the guys with the 600 f4s.
Andy Blanchard said:
Finally, take a few deep breaths before you fill in the orders. Your
supports are going to come to a significant proportion of the price
of that 500mm!

Andy
Click to expand...
Yeah, I realize that. The tripod plus full head alone is over $1200, and if I add the sidekick and M20 for different needs, we are talking about $1800 or more. Sigh....

Thanks so much for your input Andy.

Pradeep
 
I use that one (Bogen 393) all the time with my 500. It's about half a pound heavier than the Wimberly. But it is very heavy duty and you can't go wrong for the price. I'm very happy with mine.
 
Thanks Walter. Do you have any difficulty in panning or moving the lens around? Are there other attachments/clamps needed or is it an all in one solution?

Pradeep
 
Primus said:
Andy Blanchard said:
[...]
Finally, take a few deep breaths before you fill in the orders. Your
supports are going to come to a significant proportion of the price
of that 500mm!
Click to expand...
Yeah, I realize that. The tripod plus full head alone is over $1200,
and if I add the sidekick and M20 for different needs, we are talking
about $1800 or more. Sigh....
Click to expand...
I don't know. Didn't you say you're not used to tripod and stuff? Just adding a 500 probably doesn't change that for anything else. Adding a Sidekick and a ballhead "just in case" seems pretty extravagant to me...

My lens is arriving in the next few days too, so we're kind of in the same boat. On the other hand, I used to shoot Olympics regulation air rifle and free rifle. The latter in full trim is about the same weight as a 600/4 with body. So at least I don't a psychological barrier about handholding. Instead, the first order of business for me would actually be the camera bags, not the support. If one buys into a modular system like Kinesis, cost can add up rather quickly on that front too.

So for me, it's getting the bags right now so I can go out and shoot. I'm keeping an eye on the CB Gimbal dispite bobbyz's comment. My local dealer carries both CB and Wimberley, so I'll be able to compare them side by side. But I'll be handholding for the next few months. My current feeling is that the big tripod suitable for a 500 is probably not nimble enough for close to the ground macro work anyway, so I think in the end, the 500 will likely have its own dedicated support, and my current tripod and heads will morph into a separate system for everything else.

Andy
 
Andy Wai said:
Primus said:
Andy Blanchard said:
[...]
Finally, take a few deep breaths before you fill in the orders. Your
supports are going to come to a significant proportion of the price
of that 500mm!
Click to expand...
Yeah, I realize that. The tripod plus full head alone is over $1200,
and if I add the sidekick and M20 for different needs, we are talking
about $1800 or more. Sigh....
Click to expand...
I don't know. Didn't you say you're not used to tripod and stuff?
Just adding a 500 probably doesn't change that for anything else.
Adding a Sidekick and a ballhead "just in case" seems pretty
extravagant to me...
Click to expand...
Andy, I agree, adding stuff for 'just in case' is truly extravagant. However, the biggest lens I've owned so far is the 300 2.8 and I could handhold it for a while, but would need to find a place to rest it in between shots. I just received the 500 last evening and tried it out. I can hand hold it, but only for a few moments. There is no way I could say stand by a pond/lake/river and keep taking shots of birds/other fauna. So looks like I am definitely going to need a support system. In a vehicle, I've been very happy with bean bags or the molar, but out on the ground, that is not going to work.

I will need a bag too, I realize and that's another headache. For the 300 I found Think Tank's glass taxi to be just perfect, will need the Kinesis one for the 500.

I am leaning towards the sidekick with the Markins M20 combo at present, simply because it allows me to use smaller lenses for landscape work, although the cost and weight is probably the same as the full Wimberley head.

I do have a Gitzo 1128Mk2, which suffices for small lenses and urban night photography here in NYC, maybe I will just keep that and get the Wimberley full head for the 3541
Andy Wai said:
So for me, it's getting the bags right now so I can go out and shoot.
I'm keeping an eye on the CB Gimbal dispite bobbyz's comment. My
local dealer carries both CB and Wimberley, so I'll be able to
compare them side by side. But I'll be handholding for the next few
months. My current feeling is that the big tripod suitable for a 500
is probably not nimble enough for close to the ground macro work
anyway, so I think in the end, the 500 will likely have its own
dedicated support, and my current tripod and heads will morph into a
separate system for everything else.

Andy
Click to expand...
I am going to check things out at my local dealer. Don't know if the CB will be suitable, cost is only a little less than the Wimberley but it is said to be 'modular', meaning hopefully that different parts can be removed and reassembled for different needs.

In the end, you are right, there will probably be different setups for different shooting scenarios.

Pradeep
 
Primus said:
[...] I just received the 500 last evening and tried
it out. I can hand hold it, but only for a few moments. There is no
way I could say stand by a pond/lake/river and keep taking shots of
birds/other fauna. So looks like I am definitely going to need a
support system.
Click to expand...
One lesson I've learned from rifles is that one should get into shooting position just long enough to take the shot. First you're resting, then you mentally get ready, take the gun out of the rest, form the position in seconds, boom, then immediately get out and rest. Any unnecessary time spent in holding position hurts your eye and muscle.

This strategy seems to adapt to the 400/5.6 quite well. How well it works for the 500 remains to be seen. Now I'm not trying to negate your need for support system, but working towards lessening dependency on pieces that are not absolutely necessary is always good, I think...
Primus said:
[...]
I do have a Gitzo 1128Mk2, which suffices for small lenses and urban
night photography here in NYC, maybe I will just keep that and get
the Wimberley full head for the 3541
Click to expand...
Yup, that's my line of thinking as well.
Primus said:
[...]
I am going to check things out at my local dealer. Don't know if the
CB will be suitable, cost is only a little less than the Wimberley
Click to expand...
You don't go for CB to save a few bucks. You go for the ball bearings and the modularity. The fact that it's a hair cheaper than Wimberley is coincidental. It has better specs than Wimberley, on paper at least.
Primus said:
but it is said to be 'modular', meaning hopefully that different
parts can be removed and reassembled for different needs.
Click to expand...
My understanding is that it comes in three large chunks. All three together is equivalent to full Wimberley. Just the base and middle piece is equivalent to Jobu BWG light weight. Just the middle piece is equivalent to Sidekick. And it supposedly can be configured to act as a 3D pano head as well. But like bobbyz says, all these joints can be dangerous. We'll see.

Andy
 
I've used this combo for 3 years with my 500/4 and 600/4.Fits in my suitcase and travels with me around the world. And by not using the full wimberly I can still use the head for other lenses instead of having to carry a separate head.
--
http://www.pbase.com/kingfisher/
 
Primus said:
I think that's it! The sidekick with M20 combo probably works for 90%
of shooting needs and lens/camera combos. If I really need BIF
photos, I may need to go for the full head. Also, the 3541 may be a
good choice, only 0.7 lb heavier than the 2540.
Click to expand...
Yeah, if you exclude the wildlife only trips, then I'd say about 90% of my tripod shots are taken with the M20 on my 3541 and if I'm using a collared telephoto lens then it'll probably have the Sidekick fitted too, although I sometimes don't bother with my 70-200mm. The combination is definitely at a sweet spot in the compromises you have to make between size, stability and weight.
Primus said:
My experience on Safari vehicles was with bean bags only, (since
tripods were going to be useless) and with a lens plate and two
wimberley M-1s attached to it at either end (idea courtesy Joe and
Mary Ann McDonald), the camera and lens were rock steady. This is
what everyone else was using, including the guys with the 600 f4s.
Click to expand...
Well, that depends on the vehicle and how much room you have. I arrange my own trips and hire local guides if required, so there's always at least 2 seats per person and plenty of room for gear. The modus operandi is to pool our beanbags and fix several in place at key spots on the vehicle(s) for the duration, I also bring a few lengths of pipe insulation that get taped over any suitable edges or bars. The tripods are for those occasions we are out of the vehicle (not always possible, especially on package trips) but we usually have one or two with Gimbal heads on fixed in place with cinch-straps. I also use Ergorest's "Multipod" as a secondary support for a telephoto, usually with my heaviest free ballhead/Sidekick

Here's a link for the Ergorest if you've not seen it:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/220145-REG/Ergorest_185500_Multi_Pod.html
Primus said:
Yeah, I realize that. The tripod plus full head alone is over $1200,
and if I add the sidekick and M20 for different needs, we are talking
about $1800 or more. Sigh....
Click to expand...
It'll all be worth it though, and should last at least one lifetime too. :)
Primus said:
Thanks so much for your input Andy.
Click to expand...
My pleasure.

Andy
 
You're welcome Pradeep!

I've got a new one! Maybe you'll like it...maybe not!

Danny Tuason :)
Primus said:
Thanks Danny. Like your signature.

Pradeep
Click to expand...
--

'The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one.'

George Bernard Shaw
 
Andy Wai said:
Andy Wai said:
but it is said to be 'modular', meaning hopefully that different
parts can be removed and reassembled for different needs.
Click to expand...
My understanding is that it comes in three large chunks. All three
together is equivalent to full Wimberley. Just the base and middle
piece is equivalent to Jobu BWG light weight. Just the middle piece
is equivalent to Sidekick. And it supposedly can be configured to
act as a 3D pano head as well. But like bobbyz says, all these
joints can be dangerous. We'll see.

Andy
Click to expand...
Andy, I looked at the pictures of the thing and there are at least 7 knobs that I can see, apart from anything else you may have on the lens collar or plate. That is a dangerous situation to be in. One loose knob and the entire assembly could topple over (or maybe not). Too much to fiddle with.

Pradeep
 
Primus said:
[...] I looked at the pictures of the thing and there are at least 7
knobs that I can see,
Click to expand...
8 as far as I can tell.
Primus said:
[...] That is a dangerous situation to be in. One
loose knob and the entire assembly could topple over (or maybe not).
Too much to fiddle with.
Click to expand...
Well, full Wimberley has 4. The CB's rotating friction is controlled by an extra pair of knobs independent of the locking knobs. So the real difference is only 2: Exactly where the three big chunks are joined together. There may or may not be safety catches at those big joints. Hard to tell. We'll just have to see the real thing when it's out.

Andy
 
Mount direct to thr tripod, you can adjust the bottom knobs tension with a set screw for panning, and there are two knobs for tension in the up and down movement. I find it very easy to use. The u-shaped main section of the head is solid steel.

The advantage of the Wimberly is weight and it is only on one side of the lens, making manual focus is a little easier with the Wimberly, although I have no problem with the bogen.

However, I could buy a few of the Bogens for the price of the Wimberly.

Romy, also known as "liquidstone" uses it and you can see the shots he gets, here is a link,

http://www.pbase.com/liquidstone/sigma_300800test
 
for me is gitzo 1325 with levelling base, markins M20, and sidekick.

I have both the M10 and M20 and they are excellent heads...I'd go with the M20 for the 500.

I'd also recommend the levelling base not for panos but if you intend to shoot BIF with the sidekick. A level base is a necessity for smooth panning in both the vertical and horizontal plane.

You should get the lenscoat while you're at it as well.

Have fun with the new lens!!!
 
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