Americans go into a panic quicker than other people, and are then outraged at their own fear. No, Obama is for restoring Habeas.
Dave
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The war on photography redux
- Thread starter tinternaut
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Dave
James Arnold 1971
Senior Member
Ah good, i was kind of worried that I had been given the wrong impression about him.
Cheers
James
Cheers
James
With this kind of cr@p floating around, no wonder people are so
suspicious ot the terrorist photographers.
Some people who feel that the above is WAY over the top, have
produced their own versions of this Poster...
http://boingboing.net/2008/03/05/remixing-the-london.html
Al Patterson
Leading Member
makes you odd. So, we leave the dertemination of what is "odd" to us untrained citizens? Yeah, that will work. Not!
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Al Patterson
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Al Patterson
northernscum
Active member
The two people who have objected most to my postings regarding anti terrorism laws and photography in the UK don't actually live here, perhaps you should concentrate your own efforts on your own countries politics before you bad mouth someone elses.
The world is a global village; many who don't live there could be visiting in the near future, so their concern is quite legitimate. Actually, myself I will be in Paris for 2 weeks from the end of next week and I will take the opportunity to visit London. I hope I won’t get harassed with my camera.
northernscum
Active member
Trust me, you won't be.
And this is my point, the frenzy that a minority are trying to create is ridiculous to say the least.
I would love to work out the percentage of pictures taken to the number of photographers arrested for anti terrorism offences. But it would take a mathmatician to come up with the answer, similar to splitting an atom several times I would guess.
Is the chilling effect that Police action has. I don't expect you to either believe there is such a thing as a "chilling effect," or if you did, you wouldn't think it of any importance.
I say this because of your remarks that we need "Anti-terrorism" laws. As if to say that these acts are not criminal, and not punishable without them. Your government AND my government wish to keep our populations in a state of fear to justify decisions like the invasion of Iraq, or war with Iran. What better way to do that, then to imply, as their propaganda DOES imply, that every photographer you see is a potential terrorist., someone to keep an eye on, someone who might be acting odd.
My country had turned the corner on this, while yours is still eating it up.
Dave
northernscum
Active member
http://cms.met.police.uk/news/publicity_campaigns/terrorism/met_launches_new_counter_terrorism_campaign_25_02_08
I take it you own a mobile phone and also live in a dwelling property?
If so why aren't you as concerned over these matters with as much dedication as you are about terrorism and photography as the police aren't just singling out photographers but other groups as well. Surely this also 'implies that they are a potential terrorist'?
I thought this was a photography board, which at least is concerned with the ability of photographers to take pictures?
I take I am wrong about this?
Ohh, and thanks for the link. It proves conclusively that I'm a Terrorist and should be watched.
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"Observation and surveillance help terrorists plan attacks. Have you seen anyone taking pictures of security arrangements such as CCTV? Has it made you suspicious?
"Meetings, training and planning for terrorist attacks can take place anywhere. Do you know someone who travels but is vague about where they're going?
"Terrorists use computers - do you know someone who visits terrorist-related websites?
**********
I really should stop using a computer and ceace visiting terrorist web sites. Of course I also visit Anti-Terrorist web sites like the Counter Terrorism Center at West Point. Indeed, they even gave me clearance to visit the restricted portions of their site. Little did they know that I'm a secret member of Al Qaeda!
http://www.ctc.usma.edu/default.asp
Oh, and one last thing, I get a REAL KICK out of the idea of watching people snapping pictures of CCTV cameras. man will that help. I can just imagine how useful such a picture would be!
Dave
northernscum
Active member
I was trying to look at the broader picture, to explain that it's NOT just about photographers, but it was obviously lost on you, I think you are taking things too literally, but then it's easy to state the obvious isn't it.
This website incidentally was created as you know by the metropolitan police who are one of the leaders if not the leading police service in the world for anti terrorism outside of the security services.
Which of course is why I quoted from it. NONE of the tips they give are valuble. They are in fact SO broad as to be ludicrous. They serve only ONE purpose, to inspire fear of your neighbor.
Give me a break:
************
"Observation and surveillance help terrorists plan attacks. Have you seen anyone taking pictures of security arrangements such as CCTV? Has it made you suspicious?
"Meetings, training and planning for terrorist attacks can take place anywhere. Do you know someone who travels but is vague about where they're going?
"Terrorists use computers - do you know someone who visits terrorist-related websites?
************
The above is absolute nonsense. How many times have you buttonholed an aquaintance and told them all about your vacation?
How the hell would a picture of a CCD camera have ANTHING to do with going onto a train and blowing yourself up?
And just what the hell IS a terrorist web site, and how the hell would you know about what I visit? And I DO visit real sites, because I want to know what they think - Apparently a sign of the criminal mind. And to many, an innocuous site like Al Jezzera IS a terrorist Web site.
As I said, the above has nothing to do with combatting terrorism, but everything to do in creating an atmosphere of Raw, Naked Fear, in which the public will do whatever their told.
Dave
Al Patterson
Leading Member
Sure, I think the people in the USA are as stupid in general as those in the UK, so my comment stands.
Of course, if you could comprehend SARCASM, you might have been less nasty in your response...
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Al Patterson
Of course, if you could comprehend SARCASM, you might have been less nasty in your response...
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Al Patterson
As the British Security forces warn us, that reading terrorist propaganda is suspicious? I say this because I wish to report the US Army Counter Terrorism Center as a secretly controlled part of Al Qaeda.
Need proof? Look at this link, it's an interview with Zwahiri, the Second in command of Al Qaeda. Who knew that the US Army was a wing of the terrorist infrastructure?
http://www.ctc.usma.edu/questions/CTC-Power_of_Truth_4-21-2008.pdf
Think of all the tender minds who will read the above and Immediatlely strap on suicide bombs and take out the petting zoo at Central Park. Of course, that will be a photo op not to be missed...
Dave
northernscum
Active member
Time I think to start wearing that tinfoil hat you've been keeping in your cupboard.As the British Security forces warn us, that reading terrorist
propaganda is suspicious? I say this because I wish to report the US
Army Counter Terrorism Center as a secretly controlled part of Al
Qaeda.
Need proof? Look at this link, it's an interview with Zwahiri, the
Second in command of Al Qaeda. Who knew that the US Army was a wing
of the terrorist infrastructure?
http://www.ctc.usma.edu/questions/CTC-Power_of_Truth_4-21-2008.pdf
Think of all the tender minds who will read the above and
Immediatlely strap on suicide bombs and take out the petting zoo at
Central Park. Of course, that will be a photo op not to be missed...
This is a photography forum, please keep it on track if you could manage it
... but I have two additional questions:
1. How to quickly estimate, which Search Warrant doc is a real one? Any standard look of such document?
2. One of the frequent phrases in intimidation is an universal "lack of cooperation". How to respond to that?
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1. How to quickly estimate, which Search Warrant doc is a real one? Any standard look of such document?
2. One of the frequent phrases in intimidation is an universal "lack of cooperation". How to respond to that?
(-)
Robert999
Leading Member
Funny - which of those two is the one that fought a full-fledged terrorist war for two decades on it's own soil? The US lost a few office buildings - the UK had the entire downtown of Manchester blown up in a single bombing - and that was one of many.
Living here in the UK as an American, I get the impression that the average UK Met police officer isn't quite as good as your run of the mill NYC officer. BUT - having seen the anti-terrorist squads deployed all over after 7/7, and knowing what the SAS can do, I think the UK could probably still teach the US a thing or two about anti-terror work...those guys are impressive, and impressively equipped.
The UK could solve many of it's current ills if it would arm it's beat officers with guns...it is a testament to British character strength that they have not. But I feel the day is approaching (due to immigration) when that will come to pass...
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Robert
Olympus E-3 & E-500, 7-14mm, 14-54mm, 40-150mm, 30mm
Olympus 1030SW P&S
Yashica Lynx-1000
northernscum
Active member
I'm interested as to your take on this, why do you say this?
It used to be the basic of good PR. Not anymore. But they still can transfer your e-mail to a security unit as a threat.
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You left out the censorship of the media in WWII. The internment of the Japanese, Italians and Germans.
Shoot lots of pictures, always fill the frame
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