S5 Pro focus errors.. follow-up (Matt, Crystal, Herbert, Davor etc)

Further to my thread here:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1020&message=28033374

I have pretty much confirmed that this "new" (03Uxxxx) S5 Pro is completely unable to focus accurately at all.

I ran the 3 battery test I advocated to Matt here:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1020&message=27863653

These are my results, focus is on the middle battery:

Image on the left is with AF, image on the right is with MF:



Results - With AF the rear battery is always more focused (focus is behind target).

Matt, Crystal, Herbert, Davor - Do any of you have "before" and "after" shots after adjustment? Did it work?

I'm so fed up with this, I am seriously considering exiting Fuji ownership and just taking the refund

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

You should try also wiht a test-focus chart...somewhere in my older posts for this well known problem of the S5, I have posted the sites that you can visit to learn who to confrm that your camera has a problem...but I think that you know this as also that you must make your tests in the widest f stop of your lens.

And then to be lucky to find out a solution with Fuji, but I doubt that they can resolve this problem.... At the first time I was thinking that this could be a problem from the lens, but know I know that this is coming more from the side of the camera.

By my experience, I was lucky that after all, they returned me back the money, for my first wrong S5 !

I am working with a second one, who works good. We will see in the future after next Photokina if Fuji will stay in the game of DSLR....

I like the colors from Fuji and the simulation films who is a good way for the Raw working photographer.
Good luck to you with Fuji, you need it !!!

Thanks for the support.

I have tested again and can confirm I see the same problem with a Sigma 17-70, Sigma 17-50 and a Nikkor 18-70 DX. Back focus on this test is consistant.

The Sigma 70mm is WAY off on long distances too.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1020&message=28033583

I am even shooting at f/4 (f/4.5 on the 18-70 DX) for the battery tests but even with more DoF its still off - at a distance of about 18cm I see about 1cm of backfocus, regardless of lens. Thats the differences between a pin sharp eye for a portrait, or not...

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

If you want to verify your camera with your any of your lens in focus problems you should alway try in the more opened f stop, wiht the charts, see the sites in my posts.

Why do you think a focus test chart is a better test?

Or to turn the question around, do you think my test is invalid? My own personal opinion is that focus charts can induce false positives due to 45 degree slanting and AF sensors being bigger than the AF point indicated in the viewfinder.

My previous S5 Pro nailed this no problem, as does my D100....

I believe the RMA will lose credibility if accompanied by a focus chart shots tbh!

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

Because this is the best way, with test carts that you are going to have more stable results and more to confirm to you where exactly is the problem with any lens in your camera... You must know that this is the way that in repair service technicians cotnrol all the cameras for Front and Back Focus problems wiht film cameras or Digitals.

So I don't say that your past tests are 100% wrong, you did have there an indication of the camera's problem in focus, which need more attention by you..

Our major problem is that in CEE Fuji's service is quite theorically and never at the level of quality with the equivalent from Nikon.... This is a bad story for me also, with what happened to my first Fuji S5.

I don't trust again to buy in the future Fuji cameras in CEE because they don't have service and if I don't go back to Nikon in the future (for digital, as I am stil working with Nikon F6 with films and I do have an excellant service by Nikon) I don't know what to do with Fuji....yes I like the colors, this is the best from Fuji, but I don't have a decent service, in my country as Nikon offers to me. In after sales, service Fuji is very bad in my country, this is the bad thing from Fuji, and some friends of me photographers went back to Nikon or to Canon. And until now nobody knows if they will stay or leave the DSLR market. It seems that in this side of the Atlantic ocean Fuji S5 was not a succes, and I understand why the best french photo magasins in tests: Chasseur d'Immages et Reponses Photo never gave the top for the S5, as they were waiting something more better just after the S3. In France they didn't have a succes at all. Only wedding photographers in USA are working with the S5. And as I know many studio photogrpahers in my country. But in weddings here Nikon or Canon and few Fuji.

A focus chart is a great way to get an item returned with code "NABFTC" if test shots are used with this.

NABFTC stands for "not another bloody focus test chart"

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

So what are you thinking to do?

Look this past post in this forum from another who trusted as we did Fuji waranty...= http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1020&thread=27445920

" I'm sorry to hear that you are having focusing problems with this camera too. If you live in Europe don't even try with Fuji Europe. The best place to send your camera is a US service, like Edison.

I was without my camera for more than two months and both Fuji DE and FUJI UK "did not find problems" for something as obvious as day and night. And yes, the focus gets worse as the focusing distance grows. Just search for my posts about S5 focusing issues and you will see all my findings.

Τoo bad I can't afford sending my camera to US. I have to live with the fact that I can't rely on it for critical focusing (wide open).

If Fuji has no part in the focusing software, than having changed two bodies with focusing problems I can conclude that Nikon is giving suboptimal bodies to Fuji and Fuji does nothing to adjust this in production. That's the price we pay to have Fuji sensor in Nikon body. But I'd be a fool to buy a Fuji camera again..."

and I agree wiht him ....
because I tried 5 differant S5 until know and the results were :
1 with one AF indicator tottaly wrong, from the first models.

1 with wrong focus accurancy with any Af points and any lens. (this was my first)

1 could not even make AF with any Af point with any lens, just coming new out from his box, and was returned to Japan.

1 with only one of the low AF point also out of work, just out also new from the box.

1 only finally was working perfectly with all Af indicators and any lens, AF , AFS, MF older as the more new editions. (I am working wiht this one).
Conclussions are yours....

Andy,

Unfortunately, Fuji did not fix my camera. All they said is that my camera is within tolerances. The only Fuji service that seems to understand and be able to fix this is Edison, USA. However Fuji Germany rejected to handover the camera to USA for service, although they shipped it to UK for inspection. Living in a non EU country, the mailing expenses would be too high for me, and I have no guarantee that the camera will be fixed.

Worse thing is that the AF is only fixed with software, we can't do anything ourselves. I think that the AF system was designed to be clever and take into account the lens speed and the AF drift with changing aperture. Too bad it only makes problems to many of us. I find the AF of this camera totaly unpredictable with fast lenses, and dependent on the distance.

I tried pushing Fuji USA and Fuji DE to accept this and offer a free of charge solution, but I did not succeed in this.

Each time I get hot to go out and take pictures I am dissapointed by the AF inacuracy. I simply can't depend on this camera for mission critical focus.

--Davor

This is why I am going to persue a refund.

I'm not going to send this camera (which I've only had 6 days) in for repair and be without it for an unknown period of time, with no guarantee of a fix.

I know if this was a D200, Nikon would do an "AF adjust and body depth check", and it would come back fine. With Fuji tbh I imagine it'll come back as "in spec"

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

Andy you can see that I am not the only one, who did had problems wiht Fuji in Europe, as I have said before my first S5 was send to Germany, but not only they could not fix it, they could not be able also to see, as also to answer where the problem were in the camera, which was obvious to see in any picture with any lens....

Maybe a solution is for you, if you insist that the camera to be returned to Japan to be fixed....

Good Luck and please inform us with the results.

Pkphoto said:

Maybe a solution is for you, if you insist that the camera to be returned to Japan to be fixed....

Click to expand...

I'm really not prepared to do this when I can get a refund. Sending it to Japan could take weeks. Not an option.

Just to clarify in case you missed - this S5 Pro is brand new, and was only delivered by DHL on Monday 19th. So you can see why I am unwilling to consider a repair on a new item. Sending off a £500 camera for repair after 6 days is not something I will consider. I like the S5 Pro, but not THAT much

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

horrar for distance selling act in the UK

within 7 days you are 100% entitled to a refund - even if it wasn't faulty

if faulty its something like 14 days isn't it ?

will this leave you S5 less ?

I've decided after reading about all these AF faults (not just on this thread) - that if I want to change my D200, I'l get a 40D, Sigma SD14, Or wait for the D90

ps did a "far" wide open focus test on my D200 tonight, and in no way could I improve upon it with manual focussing - it was spot on

Mark Buckley said:

ps did a "far" wide open focus test on my D200 tonight, and in no way could I > improve upon it with manual focussing - it was spot on

Click to expand...

This is how it should be, as a general rule.

There are some things when AF does not work well and manual focusing is the way to go, especially wide at fast apertures.

There are a number of users just in this forum with AF issues that I know off:

Me
scathew - Matt (just back from repair)
acrystalball - Crystal (sent her in for repair)
Herbert Bisko - (back or front focus, repaired)
Pkphoto - Unresolved I think, huge battle with Fuji Germany?

Davor Spasoski - Davor (Unresolved, huge battle with Fuji Germany, then ping ponged to Fuji UK, persuing refund)

joshuanorthwestexposures - Joshua (focus problem at distance, we are corresponding off-forum)

Thats at least 7 of us from this Fuji forum alone, and I recall other posters.

All of us are fairly "prominent" posters with years of experience as well, and a history of posting here, so its not a case of "hit n run" trollers jumping in to bash Fuji.

The Distance Selling Regulations will be used if needed, but in all honesty I don't expect any return hassles with Calumet.

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake

I have 2 S5s, the older one focuses perfect the newer one focuses all over the place. Like a portrait would be sometimes the face is in focus sometimes the midsection belt area. Both cameras are set exactly the same using the same lenses. I sent in to fuji and got it back, no change at all, still focuses all over the place and a far away full length type pose is a good chance of being out of focus.

Do you think a final effort in a form of a joint open letter to the president of Fuji would help us get a solution in a form of factory tuned replacement body?
We could include all our tests, findings and experience with the Fuji service.

--Davor

Davor, Andy and all friends in this forum...

Fuji returned back my money, for my first S5, who was never returned from Germany. So this is closed.

The second S5, I bought it, from an independand importer who offers me his waranty and promissed to send, in case of problem the camera to Japan. That's why I bought the camera from him.

And I insisted to take the camera only AFTER testing the AF system. This is what I did.

So if I am here is for helping others, by informing from my experience ...

But I don't think that someone of them do really care in Fuji ....and will take care to answer to few people as we are.

Please notice that from Germany they were asking to know, and to informe them, who I arrived to find out that their camera did had a problem...of coarse I didn't answered...

This is sad for me as for you... who want a decent after sales service.
Andy, you may ask a loyer for your problem.

I had a D70years back with a bad back focus issue. Nikon was not bright enough to fix it but here was the fix and it should be the same for the S5.

http://www.leongoodman.com/d70focus.html

Test charts here

http://www.focustestchart.com/chart.html

Good luck
Steve

puddleduck said:

--
-Andy

Click to expand...

I bought an S5pro and a Nikon lens from Calumet (UK).
I had a focus problem.

I took them back to Calumet who told me that they would have to send
the body back to Fuji and the lens back to Nikon.
They told me that the process would be quicker if I sent them!!

Cutting a long story short, I took the body back to Fuji myself,
they tested it and sent it back very quickly saying that there was no problem,
it was all within spec.

But it still had problems; I phoned them and told them that although it was within their spec. for their tests, it was no good in many real world situations.

They were very good and agreed that they would swap my body for another,
and this second body is much better.

At the time of purchase 1 year ago, Calumet gave me a free 3 year Mack warranty. I bet that any major repair over the next three years would cost more than the value of my camera!!

When you say "took them back" was this a purchase from a physical Calumet store, or an internet purchase?

--
-Andy

Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydrake