manual focus,where did it go ??

Tom Rowland · May 17, 2008

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
hamx15 wrote:

SNIP

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
Joseph S Wisniewski said:

I need to be able to do close focus,sharp IQ,of watch movements.
Focus being critical.......

Click to expand...

Nikon D300, Canon 40D, anything with liveview mode. I've been doing
high precision and high magnification macro work for decades, and
liveview beats any other manual or automatic method of focusing that
you've ever seen. You have to try it to believe it.

Works well when you are using long glass on a tripod too.

SNIP
--
Those who forget history are condemned to go to summer school.

Joseph S Wisniewski · May 17, 2008

funnelwebmaster said:
so...don't you mourn the loss of your spot metering?

Spot metering only is disabled in the areas inside the split image and microprism circle.

This aside, I have run into so few photographers who actually know how to use spot metering effectively that I'm convinced it's one of those "me too" features.

One camera company figured out that the AF sensors could be used as an improvised spot meter, next thing you know, they're all doing it.

Seriously, do you try to accurately estimate 18% gray (zone V) when you find a "spot" to spot meter? Do you find some Caucasian skin (zone VI) and open up a spot? How do you shoot a landscape or a macro?

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

Joseph S Wisniewski · May 17, 2008

Tom Rowland said:
Joseph S Wisniewski said:

hamx15 wrote:

Click to expand...

SNIP

Tom Rowland said:

Tom Rowland said:

I need to be able to do close focus,sharp IQ,of watch movements.
Focus being critical.......

Click to expand...

Nikon D300, Canon 40D, anything with liveview mode. I've been doing
high precision and high magnification macro work for decades, and
liveview beats any other manual or automatic method of focusing that
you've ever seen. You have to try it to believe it.

Click to expand...

Works well when you are using long glass on a tripod too.

Definitely. Telephoto, macro, micro, product, copy, all the obvious stuff.

But picture this: I actually used it for some portraits last month. I wanted to visualize the contrast, in B&W, of some strongly colored clothing and backgrounds. So, there I am, shooting a D3 at arms length like a tourist with a point-and-shoot.

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

Tom Rowland · May 17, 2008

Joseph S Wisniewski wrote:
SNIP

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
But picture this: I actually used it for some portraits last month. I
wanted to visualize the contrast, in B&W, of some strongly colored
clothing and backgrounds. So, there I am, shooting a D3 at arms
length like a tourist with a point-and-shoot.

Maybe it is just my shooting style, but I sometimes get smudges from the oil on my nose on the screen. But I do shoot of a tripod; hopefully with the sun behind my back and shining directly on the screen, so I try to get as close as I can and block as much light as I can. And I do have a big nose.

--
Those who forget history are condemned to go to summer school.

Jay Turberville · May 17, 2008

hamx15 said:
Hi,I have a question about manual focus...
I've been around long enough to have bought my first SLR in 71.
Minolta 202.

Actually, you didn't. The Minolta SRT series didn't switch from the 100 series to the 200 series until 1975.

hamx15 said:
Why would I want to
???

A better question is why wouldn't you want to?

hamx15 said:
If I were to have to give up one or the other....
Please ........ take the auto focus away.....
I assure all,I personally can manual focus to beat the best auto's....

I seriously doubt it. I especially doubt it if you are using a modern DSLR with a high pixel density sensor.

I also started with a Minolta SRT camera - the cheapest in the line, the SRT-100. I used it for many years. I was always quite happy with it. But in recent years I've scanned some of my decades old slide and B&W shots. They aren't as well focused as I thought.

Further, I've equipped my E-300 with a Katz-Eye split prism focus screen and use it to shoot with a 50-300mm f/4.5 ED Nikkor. Very retro. Also, pretty inconsistent with focus. It does much better when I have a decent bit of DoF, but there's a fine line between exact focus and sorta-kinda-almost in-focus. And that really matters when your sensor can resolve around 80 lp/mm.

My general experience with focus accuracy goes as follows from best to worst.

1) 10x live view manual focus
2) AF
3) Split prism manual focus
4) Standard focus screen manual focus

hamx15 said:
Tirelessly all day...
It's even fun.... It's like taking aim,during bird season....
Spot on,click...... Got another one.

Sorry. I've tried it with birds in flight. Sure, I can get in-focus shots. But my keeper rate would be better with a good tracking AF. I spend hours in the field at times, and it isn't fun seeing that you got everything just right in an image, but the image is a tiny bit out of focus. Not fun at all.

hamx15 said:
Thousands spent,and no manual focus screen.......

If you really want manual focus it isn't a big deal. You buy a Katz Eye screen and have it installed. Done. I did this with a redundant camera body - my E-300. You could do this by purchasing a used older model camera with whatever system you end up choosing. You could also choose a system that allows you to change focus screens. Either way, it isn't all that hard to do.

hamx15 said:
Manual focus is as close to perfection as you'll ever get....

Not with a split prism it isn't, and not if you want fast focus.

hamx15 said:
Why would this area of mechanical focus involvement be removed... ??

See above.

hamx15 said:
I'm shocked....at the enlightenment.

Seems you just havent' looked at camera gear for a few decades is all.

hamx15 said:
Why would it be,that the builders of Pro equipment would cripple user
control,and impede the artists attempt at perfection,with the
possible erroneous auto focus measure ??

Why indeed? Kinda makes you want to check your premises - eh?

hamx15 said:
What you see appears in focus.
What the camera sees isn't in focus....

This can happen for sure with fast lenses and is an effect of the bright microprism "focus" screens common today. These really shouldn't be called "focus" screens since they are generally very poor at showing focus well.

hamx15 said:
I would hope that I am misunderstanding something...
But the Ritz guy,was pretty adamant.

Yep. You are misunderstanding plenty. But there are plenty of explanations in this thread that should correct that for you.

hamx15 said:
I'm in need of buying a DSLR (or was) not sure now.
I need to be able to do close focus,sharp IQ,of watch movements.
Focus being critical.......

I strongly suggest getting a DSLR with main sensor based live view. This will provide the precise manual focus that you need. I'm partial to the models that have tilt/swivel or swiveling LCDs for that kind of work. But there are certainly other factors to consider. For instance, you might prefer to run the video out of the camera to a separate display for even better critical focus adjustment and easier viewing. That's pretty easy in a "studio" setup - not so good/easy for field use.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com

Jay Turberville · May 17, 2008

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
But picture this: I actually used it for some portraits last month. I
wanted to visualize the contrast, in B&W, of some strongly colored
clothing and backgrounds. So, there I am, shooting a D3 at arms
length like a tourist with a point-and-shoot.

I strongly recommend a bent arms approach, not "arms length."

If you had a tilting LCD, you chould have gone waist level and felt like 1950's tourist as well.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com

Jay Turberville · May 17, 2008

Tom Rowland said:
Maybe it is just my shooting style, but I sometimes get smudges from
the oil on my nose on the screen.

With my E-330, I found that the anti-reflection coating on the LCD made smudges more of a problem. As it turns out, the AR coating on this camera's LCD was fairly fragile and got easily scratched. I eventually removed it using a CD/DVD scratch remover kit. Smudges aren't nearly as bothersome now.

Its a bit of a shame, because the AR coating really did work and made the LCD more useful in bright direct sunligh light. But overall, I'm happier without it.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com

hamx15 · May 17, 2008

Joseph S Wisniewski ..............

Yes.......that was as a joke ....

mhc_99 had posted the .....comment of the Katz Eye product...
I hadnt heard of...
I found it checked it out... Looked like something I should consider..

So the post I did... was a bunch of questions... that were kinda in spoof format...

You did great supplying answers....... I leave the Bright addition out of the order.

Thanks

ChrisVJ · May 17, 2008

I must say that autofocus on my Canon DSLR is pretty snappy and mostly better and quicker than I could do it but there is one mode that is relatively poor, causes lots of missed shots and it is not just the auto focus, Airshows, photographing airplanes.

Often enough, especially when there is grey overcast, the autofocus misses the planes or picks cloud (as I try to grab a fast moving plane) and because the cloud is so even hunts a whole cycle, then stalls at one end of the focus range (at least, that is what it feels like,) and I can't then find the aircraft without zooming back and refocussing. By the the shot has gone.

Because my zoom is autofocus (and cheapish) it has separate focus and zoom rings. The zoom ring is the big one but twists to zoom On my old manual Nikon lens there was just one ring, push/pull to zoom and twist to focus.

I am not sure whether it is just the quality of the lens or my fond but faulty remembrance of the performance of my old lense and camera but I can't seem to get a crisp picture from my current long zoom. It may be me. I felt the same about my short zoom but decided that I would go out and very, very carefully choose a crisp, contrasty subject and very carefully set up before shooting. The result was sharp and beautiful.

Shooting aircraft in flight is always difficult, one is constrained by flight lines, viewing angles, weather in particular, the way the show is arranged and so many other things, that I am almost always unsure that I am going to get a great result. Abbotsford Airshow in particular is unfailingly annoying because the flight line is slap due South of the public enclosures and last year there was haze as well.

After many years of insisting on a 'Macho" manual gearbox I eventually succumbed and bought my first automatic. No comparison. I even had an automiatic in my 'boy racer' Camarro. It's similar with auto focus. For most things it is just great . .

But I do miss that split image and my manual focus zoom. I guess I'll just have to get a Nikon DSLR and see whether it is as good as I remember.

hamx15 · May 17, 2008

At this point.... I certainly have ....wayyyyyyyy
more info than when I started.....
It'll take a day .... to sort and place comments into,categories...

Or I will try anyway... I'm sure there will be many duplicates.....

In any case thanks to all for helping.....

I'm going to post below,some info ... ( good stuff) posted to another area of the forum where I had asked in gereral,the same questions..
Could be worth reading.... This is mostly about the Katz Eye add 0on.

I was asked within the replies,what kinda camera I was interested in...
I (repeating) need to do close up work,I need sharp focus detail.

(the sharp focus detail) and my question to the Fritz rep,is what started all this.

I at that time found out that the split focus area of view for manual focus,was no longer in the works within DSLR's....

Hence all the posts,all the time consuming replies (thank you again),were all based on my perception of auto focus only,in todays DSLR Auto's..
I'm sure the Katz eye product is going to be of great value..
I'm not a photographer,or that is not for any reason other than necessity.

Noting : I haven't used any camera,for at least 20 years.My experience is all with SLR's, manual focus..

My last rig,was pretty much complete....three lenses,all the filters I could ever want (all gathered over time)along with much more.....
Was all stolen ...for my home in 86.......
Along with all my gun collection .... 8 pieces.... all having cases seperate...
I have not replaced any of this sense.....
I'm not a collector...at heart... or not for show anyway....
I was just at the right place at the right time,when someone needed money.
In any case back to the cameras....

..... I was considering the Oly line up,I get the Live view,and for what I need,I think the lenses avail will be ok.....
I was only concerned about the focus.... and my close up IQ,due to focus.
I'm sure the DSLR cameras avail today,must do a fine job,or they wouldn't sell.
I was just wanting to be able to focus manually....pin point,close up.
This is long again........... Dang.
Thanks for all those that had input ..... I feel much better now.

You may want to go see.
My other post in the (Olympus SLR Talk Forum)
I posted there Entitled ... (bring back the split focus prism )

Read down (not far) and find reply by ( James A Rinner )
entitled ( I worked with Katzeye on the E-3 screen )
Follow his links.... every good personal input,about the Katz Eye system.......

One more time,thanks again to all ........

funnelwebmaster · May 17, 2008

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
Spot metering only is disabled in the areas inside the split image
and microprism circle.

Uhh.yes. That's a pretty critical area, ne cest pas?

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
This aside, I have run into so few photographers who actually know
how to use spot metering effectively that I'm convinced it's one of
those "me too" features.

Maybe you should get out more - you know, meet more photographers...

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
One camera company figured out that the AF sensors could be used as
an improvised spot meter, next thing you know, they're all doing it.

Heh, that's funny. Here, let me try: One automobile company figured out how to include airbags in their cars...next thing you know, they're all doing it!" Hey, that was fun...

Joseph S Wisniewski said:
Seriously, do you try to accurately estimate 18% gray (zone V) when
you find a "spot" to spot meter? Do you find some Caucasian skin
(zone VI) and open up a spot? How do you shoot a landscape or a macro?

Seriously, I'm not going to argue the utility and merits of spot metering with you. It's like they say..."if you have to ask, you'll never understand."

--
My Art, Your Pleasure

http://photopedia.homestead.com

Joseph S Wisniewski · May 18, 2008

funnelwebmaster said:
funnelwebmaster said:

Spot metering only is disabled in the areas inside the split image
and microprism circle.

Click to expand...

Uhh.yes. That's a pretty critical area,

Uhh, I guess, if you happen to compose all your images with a portion of the subject, in a known zone, dead center.

funnelwebmaster said:
ne cest pas?

Do you mean "n'est-ce pas?"

In the future, if you're going to try to add an air of authority to your poorly supported statement by attempting a bon mot, you might consider learning to spell the French properly, lest you instantly brand yourself as hors concours.

funnelwebmaster said:
funnelwebmaster said:

This aside, I have run into so few photographers who actually know
how to use spot metering effectively that I'm convinced it's one of
those "me too" features.

Click to expand...

Maybe you should get out more - you know, meet more photographers...

Funny, that's exactly the same advice I'd offer you. Except that I would be offering it correctly and helpfully, instead of insultingly.

funnelwebmaster said:
funnelwebmaster said:

One camera company figured out that the AF sensors could be used as
an improvised spot meter, next thing you know, they're all doing it.

Click to expand...

Heh, that's funny. Here, let me try: One automobile company figured
out how to include airbags in their cars...next thing you know,
they're all doing it!" Hey, that was fun...

You really should work on learning to have a conversation, instead of throwing insults.

As in your earlier comment about "Nikon, get off your a$$". I patiently explained the physics and logistics of the situation: Nikon did get off their "a$$"! C'est un fait établi! They spent time and money to move from the original (essentially free) spot metering via the AF sensors used in the 8008s and N90 to a more expensive, more complex system with spot metering via the main metering sensors. This increased overall accuracy, eliminated problems with metering errors due to subject color, and increased low light metering ability.

Your desire that they provide support for both spot metering and split image focusing would require reverting back to the older method of performing spot metering. Although you regard spot metering as important, you do not see anything wrong with requesting that it be made less accurate and less sensitive for all users in order to satisfy the demands of a very small minority of users who wish to also add a split screen. Although I am a split screen fan (as established earlier, I have fit third party split screens to every AF SLR and DSLR I have owned from 8008, F100, D100, D70, D2X, and D200) I do not believe in making all other photographers suffer for my preference.

funnelwebmaster said:
funnelwebmaster said:

Seriously, do you try to accurately estimate 18% gray (zone V) when
you find a "spot" to spot meter? Do you find some Caucasian skin
(zone VI) and open up a spot? How do you shoot a landscape or a macro?

Click to expand...

Seriously, I'm not going to argue the utility and merits of spot
metering with you. It's like they say..."if you have to ask, you'll
never understand."

Yes, it does appear that you will never understand. The argument is not about the utility and merits of spot metering, for it is you who are arguing for changes that will decrease the capabilities of spot metering.

Adieu flâneur, adieu poseur

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

NoTx · May 18, 2008

I have a Katze Eye in one E-1 and my nephew in another. We both use spot still.
--
Rob aka NoTx...
-Film: Fuji GX680, Leica M6TTL, Contax G2, Contax G1
-Digital: Olympus E1 x2

Jay Turberville · May 18, 2008

NoTx said:
I have a Katze Eye in one E-1 and my nephew in another. We both use
spot still.

I'm not sure, but I think the E-1 uses the AF sensors for spot metering. I know that at least some of the early four thirds DSLRs did.

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com

funnelwebmaster · May 18, 2008

Really, your rudeness and arrogance are invigorating to me. But I must ask - are you some kind of apologist for Nikon? Sure seem like it, the way you throw out half-truths and unsupported factoids regarding Nikon's research and development strategies and policies. Do you really think that I or anyone else with half a brain would take your word for it - that Nikon (or any other major camera manufacturer) lacks the resources and/or expertise to produce a viable split-screen focusing system in a modern digital camera? Really? I find that attitude on your part disturbing in its shortsightendess. Ye of little faith... Hey, just saying.

You strike me as a conformist and reactionary. And please don't take that as an insult. It's simply an honest observation based on your style and content of posting. Not that you don't have the right to exspress your opinion..but then don't yell at me for expressing a contrary one.

Cheers, etc.

--
My Art, Your Pleasure

http://photopedia.homestead.com

Jay Turberville · May 18, 2008

funnelwebmaster said:
Really, your rudeness and arrogance are invigorating to me. But I
must ask - are you some kind of apologist for Nikon? Sure seem like
it, the way you throw out half-truths and unsupported factoids
regarding Nikon's research and development strategies and policies.

I frequently double-check Joe on Olympus cameras/gear and he's made some errors. I'm all for being skeptical. But he seems to have much better knowledge in the Nikon arena. Do you have information/resources that contradict his assertions?

So which things did he say that were half-truths? Which "factoids" require support? Seriously. One reason I visit these forums is to learn stuff. What are the errors/ommisions that Joe made?

funnelwebmaster said:
Do you really think that I or anyone else with half a brain would
take your word for it - that Nikon (or any other major camera
manufacturer) lacks the resources and/or expertise to produce a
viable split-screen focusing system in a modern digital camera?

Well he didn't really say that, so I guess no, he probably wouldn't want us to take his word for it. What he said was that the previous method of using the AF sensors had problems with matching the color sensitivity of the finder sensors as well as not being as sensitive. He didn't say the problem was without a solution. It's just that the old solution would be a step backward and a new solution probably doesn't make economic sense. Does Nikon even sell a split prism screen for their DSLRs?

funnelwebmaster said:
You strike me as a conformist and reactionary.

Joseph Wisniewski a conformist? You're joking - right?

--
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com

Joseph S Wisniewski · May 18, 2008

funnelwebmaster said:
Really, your rudeness and arrogance are invigorating to me.

This is not surprising. Since it is you chose to fertilize what was a civil thread with mounds of rudeness and ignorance, one can only conclude that this is the environment in which you thrive.

funnelwebmaster said:
But I must ask - are you some kind of apologist for Nikon?

Why "must" you ask? Will your world be incomplete if you do not manage to get some sort of admission from me? Is everyone who does not refer to Nikon the way you do, using obscenities, an apologist?

But hey, I bet you think you're really cute, spelling a$$ with the dollar signs to get past the forum censors.

funnelwebmaster said:
Sure seem like
it, the way you throw out half-truths and unsupported factoids
regarding Nikon's research and development strategies and policies.
Do you really think that I or anyone else with half a brain would
take your word for it

No, I do not expect to be able to reach you, or anyone else like you with half a brain. I am sorry that I mistook you for someone with a full brain.

funnelwebmaster said:
that Nikon (or any other major camera
manufacturer) lacks the resources and/or expertise to produce a
viable split-screen focusing system in a modern digital camera?

Despite your half brained state, you're fully aware that is not what I said. I did say the problems are formidable, and the market demand not high enough to justify the expenditure to solve them.

funnelwebmaster said:
Really? I find that attitude on your part disturbing in its
shortsightendess.

As do I, yours.

funnelwebmaster said:
Ye of little faith... Hey, just saying.

Right.

funnelwebmaster said:
You strike me as a conformist and reactionary. And please don't take
that as an insult.

If you're saying it, it is an insult. You are nothing but belligerent and insulting. It is what you desire. It is what you thrive in. You claim "rudeness and arrogance are invigorating to me". Sir, those are the word of a deeply disturbed individual.

funnelwebmaster said:
It's simply an honest observation based on your
style and content of posting.

As are my observations on your own style and content. Except that it is obvious that I have much better powers of observation, and considerable more honesty, than you.

funnelwebmaster said:
Not that you don't have the right to
exspress your opinion..but then don't yell at me for expressing a
contrary one.

I did not "yell" at you. But you also knew that. If being treated to a small reflection of your own hostility bothers you so much, it is just a sine of how much help you really need.

funnelwebmaster said:
Cheers, etc.

A false expression of good cheer: what a hypocritical way to conclude your vile and hostile post.

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

Chip B · May 18, 2008

funnelwebmaster said:
so...don't you mourn the loss of your spot metering?

--
My Art, Your Pleasure

http://photopedia.homestead.com

Not sure how this "misinformation" has gotten around - I installed a Katz Eye screen on my Pentax *ist DS about a week ago so I could better utilize the collection of manual focus lenses I have. Works great - AND spot metering (and spot focusing) work like a charm!! If anything, better than before.

And, I have no interest in Katz Eye - just a satisfied customer.
--
Chip B

'If it's still ticking, you're ok'
Bob Newhart

Joseph S Wisniewski · May 18, 2008

Jay Turberville said:
Jay Turberville said:

Really, your rudeness and arrogance are invigorating to me. But I
must ask - are you some kind of apologist for Nikon? Sure seem like
it, the way you throw out half-truths and unsupported factoids
regarding Nikon's research and development strategies and policies.

Click to expand...

I frequently double-check Joe on Olympus cameras/gear and he's made
some errors.

And I also accept your well researched corrections.

Jay Turberville said:
I'm all for being skeptical. But he seems to have much
better knowledge in the Nikon arena. Do you have
information/resources that contradict his assertions?

So which things did he say that were half-truths? Which "factoids"
require support? Seriously. One reason I visit these forums is to
learn stuff. What are the errors/ommisions that Joe made?

Jay Turberville said:

Do you really think that I or anyone else with half a brain would
take your word for it - that Nikon (or any other major camera
manufacturer) lacks the resources and/or expertise to produce a
viable split-screen focusing system in a modern digital camera?

Click to expand...

Well he didn't really say that, so I guess no, he probably wouldn't
want us to take his word for it.

Agreed.

Jay Turberville said:
What he said was that the previous
method of using the AF sensors had problems with matching the color
sensitivity of the finder sensors as well as not being as sensitive.
He didn't say the problem was without a solution. It's just that the
old solution would be a step backward and a new solution probably
doesn't make economic sense.

Exactly.

Jay Turberville said:
Jay Turberville said:

You strike me as a conformist and reactionary.

Click to expand...

Joseph Wisniewski a conformist? You're joking - right?

Ha!

I am too a conformist.

Oxygen breathing, carbon consuming, upright posture, bipedal locomotion, opposable thumbs, two eyes, one mouth, just like the majority of humans.

He's just trying to find something to get me riled up, Jay. Read his other posts, He's a button pusher, a wandering trouble maker. Tried several different ways to get under my skin. I think my defense really made him blow a gasket, especially the French. But boy, was that fun. I haven't put that much though into French since working on a multilingual voice recognition system a couple of years ago, and that was considerably more pedestrian. Tune the radio, dial the phone, zoom the map, etc...

(to be continued)

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

Joseph S Wisniewski · May 18, 2008

OK, I did something a little different this time when I hit the 6000 character limit. Instead of just splitting the post in the middle, I sort of separated the technical part and off-the-wall part...

Jay Turberville said:
Does Nikon even sell a split prism screen for their DSLRs?

No. They never have.

The only AF bodies that they sold split screens for were the high end film SLRs F4, F5, and F6. F4 and F5 had screens you changed by removing the interchangeable pentaprism (a very cool feature). F6 uses a mechanism similar to "mid line" AF film SLRs like F100, N90, and good old 8008. There's a little latch at the top of the mirror box that drops the screen neatly down in a little "tray", where you can change it with tweezers, then raise the tray back into position. This mechanism is also used on midline manual focus SLRs, FM2, FE2, Fa2, Fm3a.

F6 was also the last of the "system" cameras, with a decent variety of screens (At least 7, including Nikon Type A, B, E, J, L, M, and U). These include matte, split image, crosshair, aerial image, matte with special Fresnel lens for long telephotos to reduce corner blackout (also great on bellows).

All F6, F5, and F4, FM2, FE2, and FA screens are incompatible with all Nikon DSLRs. Some have the wrong size, others lock tabs that won't match the slots in the screen tray.

Nikon actually only provides an interchangeable screen capability for their high end DSLRs, D1, D1X, D1H, D2X, D2H, and D3. Those DSLRs have a simple bail lock lever that can be pulled forward with a pair of tweezers, dropping the screen down in a small drawer.

I can point you to camera manual downloads on the Nikon support site. Each contains a list of the accessories such as screens that operate with each camera.

The stock screen for all Nikon DSLRs and AF film SLRs is the type B, plain matte.

D1, D1X, and D1H accept screens designed for the Nikon F100 film SLR. The only screens Nikon sells are the type B and type E (matte with grid lines, an option).

You can use the D1, D1H, and D1X with the third party Beattie Intenscreens designed for Nikon F100. These are available in 6 variations, plain matte, 45 degree split image, and horizontal split image, each with and without grid lines. The screen is more transparent than Nikon screens, requiring exposure compensation. I have used the Beattie diagonal split with grid lines for years on my Nikon F100. I tried it on a D1X, and found it most objectionable. The Beattie split image screens are molded in blanks designed for medium format cameras, and cut down to 35mm size, so their split image is large, about 8mm, as opposed to around 4mm on Nikon split image screens such as the K3 for the FM3a. When used on a 1.5x crop camera, the split image circle is half the height of the viewfinder, and the microprism circle spans the viewfinder almost from top to bottom.

The best third party screen for these cameras that I have used is Katz Eye. The prisms are sized much more conveniently.

D2X and D2H accept a screen of unusual size and aspect ratio that is unique to those two cameras. Nikon sells screens type B, E, V, and W (V and W are still plain matte, they just have special masks to help with the high speed crop mode).

D3 accepts a screen that is unique in size. Nikon currently offers types E and F.

All lower end Nikon DSLRs are not intended for field replacement of the screens. The screen lock mechanism is designed only to be operated by factory personnel for the insertion and removal of shims, to achieve focus alignment of the screen and main sensor (I can send you a service manual PDF if you like). Since there isn't a screen drawer, as soon as you release the screen holding mechanism, the screen and shims are free to drop down into the DSLR mirror, risking scratching mirror and/or screen. The original D100 used a sliding lever release and spring steel hold down. Release it wrong, it could propel parts from the camera with considerable enthusiasm. A dpReview forum member was actually the first to post DIY instructions for unlocking it. Several people reported breaking the lever and being unable to lock in the new screen.

D70 and more recent cameras use a bail wire locking system that again drops both screen and shims. I was actually the first person to discover this and post the instructions for unlocking it, cutting a Nikon K3 screen to appropriate size, and mounting it in the D70.

Now Katz Eye and Haouda (I may have spelled that wrong) make split image screens for all Nikon DSLRs. They're tricky on models that use the "factory service" method of accessing the screen, but it is possible. The complexity scares a lot of users, and many send their cameras in to Katz Eye to have the screens changed.

Restrictions on spot metering are as I pointed out earlier. All Nikon DSLRs from the original D1 on do spot metering with the main light meter array and will act up with a split image screen.

Now, this may come as a surprise, but Canon took an entirely opposite approach. Their midline DSLRs like 40D and 5D use interchangeable screens via a complex system where 6 tabs sticking out of the screen (makes it a pain for DIY folk) lock into latches in the frame. But Canon also only sells matte screens (although they have one we'd both like, a "high precision" screen that's basically an old fashioned ground screen without the"bright screen" hex grid cuts and coatings).

Canon did something cool at the high end: they kept screen compatibility across the top of the line EOS 1v film SLR, midline EOS 3, and the DSLRs 1D, 1D II, 1D III, 1Ds, 1Ds II, 1Ds III. 10 screens, matte, microprism, split, cross split, etc.

But then, you know what Nikon fans say about Canon metering

anyway, this part would make a good wizfaq

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

manual focus,where did it go ??

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