This forum suffers from a real plaque: Fanboyism!

If you don´t get it what I wanted to say so please stay out of this thread. Yes, I made a little mistake and have written plaque instead of plague. Haha, that can happen. So what? Oh and BTW some people are also a little bit like plaque. Bad to remove and always coming back...

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You made a picture...fine!

lovely rant, absolutely agree. enjoyed reading it and how you sum up the different forums is very much the attitude that i get from canon/nikon users.

why cant people accept that canon/nikon arent the "only decent" manufacturers out there. but then at the same time, why do people feel obsessed to fight over petty differences when they could be out taking images which show just how well the camera performs when used correctly.

just because a new camera comes out doesnt mean that the previous model will start to produce worse results, the results will still be stunning and the wallet will thankyou for it. i have seen the results from the E-3, it makes me crave for one but then i have the E-510 and that doesnt require me to pay out another £1000 for it.

im actually happy to just have a giggle with some threads on here about how oly should improve the E-system to make it better.

after all, if i wasn't happy with oly i wouldn't of brought a second camera, a flash gun, lensbaby 3G, spare batteries and more...

but at the same time, i would hope that they add a few features that would make it better. although its the same with everything, more can always be added.

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if you can imagine the picture, then do all you can to make it

Lin Evans wrote:
(snipped)

Member said:

The point is that what is "better" is highly subjective and use
dependent. So perhaps go easy on folks who believe that their Sigma
or Olympus or Pentax is "better" than your Nikon or Canon. For their
purposes it may be. For yours the opposite may be true.

Does this then make me a "Fan Boy" for the Nikon CP990? LOL. Nope - I
like them all. That's why I have dozens of digicams and a dozen
dSLR's. I'm a "Fan Boy" for the right tool for the job....

Click to expand...

Lin,
Can't agree more with what you said. Being a carpenter, you need a bunch
of tools.

I'm still using my CP990 for copying old slides with it's special slide copier
attachment! Attaching it to a quality spotting scope like your Swarovski
has always been an idea here. I've used a Swift s-scope with it.
The macro abilities of the CP990 make it a great "tool" for doing slide
scans cheap and fast. Its slowness is pitiful compared to any DSLR with
a Bigma... but the Bigma only goes to 500mms. Different tools for diff
uses.

Regards,
WayneB.

It's been quite some time since I last posted or bothered to even read anything other than tech news on this site....

In that time, I have made close to 30,000 images in all areas of my profession. Some in digital, some in film. I have had several nice assignments come my way and have really benefited from not getting sucked into this sad place.

If you give a guy a Martin acoustic guitar who does not know how to play, but still can tell you all about why the guitar is great, he may or may not be able to tell you anything you really would benefit from.

But if you give that same guitar to a master, a legend...and he plays it, he will make you forget all about the guitar as you drift off to some fantasy world.

One thing I have found through personal experience is in the real photography world in the more meaningful circles has thankfully not changed much. But the amateur one most certainly has, it is now much farther from the real photography world than ever before.

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Goodness gracious, what is the big deal if someone happens to like their camera and supports the manufacturer?

What do we call those who love their Ford Trucks, or Chevy Trucks, or Dodge Trucks?
Why do we have to label those who like their cameras??

Conrad 'Bye Bye' Birdie
'Aspire to inspire before you expire'.

Well, if there is a mistake in it, it's a mistake and needs to be fixed. Remember the anti-that brand fanboy will bash that camera based on the review, and if they are using something in the review that is wrong, that is a problem.

Phil and Gang are only human (we think) but they do make mistakes, and it can be frustrating when they don't get fixed.

Reviewing a camera and saying it's a plastic body with a metal chassis and praising it, and then calling a different camera as being just a plastic body when it too has a metal chassis in it, will definitely irritate folks. Or simply complaining about a part on a camera being plastic when it's actually made of metal.

But you are a perfect case study of a person who is the problem too. You just showed massive 4/3rd fanboy-ism and blow off facts from the other side.

You are no different than a FF fanboy from the post you just gave. It's hardly a one way fanboy street there.

Conrad Birdie said:

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Goodness gracious, what is the big deal if someone happens to like
their camera and supports the manufacturer?

What do we call those who love their Ford Trucks, or Chevy Trucks, or
Dodge Trucks?

Click to expand...

"NASCAR Rednecks".

Conrad Birdie said:

Why do we have to label those who like their cameras??

Click to expand...

"CAMERA Rednecks"?

I was called a Fanboy for talking about the Agfa 1680, CP990 and Canon
Drebel 300D. I did a search who called me the names and realized why.
Their electronic devices were being attacked in a forum and they had to
defend them.

Ridiculous.

===================

Count me in.

I'm an unrepentant fan of the Sigma and Foveon combination.

Trolls like Lupti visit the Sigma Forum all the time and attack the cameras and the users. The comments of the trolls are generally rejected as ignorant attempts at provocation. Trolls apparently feel that other people in other forums are interested in their opinions, despite those others not asking to hear them, and despite all evidence to the contrary, and are motivated by hostility, so far as I can determine.
Now the troll posts here and complains of fanboys.

But "fanboy" seems to have no definition, people only claim to know it when they see it. And "fanboy" seems to be applied to those who do not agree with the critical opinions of a given poster. "Don't like my opinion of your camera? Then you must be a "fanboy" I can do better than that: We not only don't like your critical opinion of the camera, we don't like YOU.

And, for those who may not have noticed: the OP has managed to insult all of the forums and all posters. He remains the only rational and sensible one. How likely is that?

Richard
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My small gallery: http://www.pbase.com/richard44/inbox

Wow, that really blows the lid off of discussion forums. Imagine that - happy owners actually talk about why their setup works for them.

However, I won't be so circumspect as to believe that what works for me will work for you. All I know is that it works very well for me.

Conrad Birdie said:

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Goodness gracious, what is the big deal if someone happens to like
their camera and supports the manufacturer?

What do we call those who love their Ford Trucks, or Chevy Trucks, or
Dodge Trucks?

Click to expand...

Americans?

Conrad Birdie said:

Why do we have to label those who like their cameras??

Click to expand...

Ah, but it's not PC to be interested in cameras, only the passion for the art counts

Conrad Birdie said:

Conrad 'Bye Bye' Birdie
'Aspire to inspire before you expire'.

Click to expand...

--
Anders

'It is nice to be important but it is more important to be nice'

Posts like this will always create many replies and I am guilty here too.
BUT TELL US SOMETHING WE DON'T KNOW.
Not old news.
Jules

Lupti said:

I think this phenomen was always there, but in the last time it has
grown very quickly. As the different brands bring out a lot of new
DSLRs with features that others don´t have but this one have other
features it seems to be that a lot of people are becoming paranoid
about "their" brand.

There are some forums with suffer more from fanboyism as others but
overall it seems that most people aren´t able to have an neutral view
of their camera.

Who hasn´t seen this yet?
The Canon people say:

• we have the best high ISO
• you want to have an D300 instead of a 40D? Let´s get one and go

away, you troll
The Nikon people say:

• Nikon has equal high ISO
• you want to switch to Canon, because you think they have better

high ISO performance and the cameras are better? You have no clue
about photography, it isn´t the camera, take your Canon and go away,
you troll
The Olympus people say:

• who needs higher ISOs?
• but my E3 is good
• we have the best lenses
• you want to switch to Nikon or Canon because the 4/3 system doesn´t

offer enough lenses, high ISO etc.? You have no clue about
photography, it isn´t the camera, take your Canon or Nikon and go
away, you troll
The Pentax people say:

• who needs an fast AF?
• we have the Limited primes, haha
• you aren´t satisfied with the K20D? You have to learn it, otherwise

you are a troll from the Canon forum
The Sigma people say:

• we have the Foveon sensor, this is so much better as Bayer
• we don´t need a fast camera
• why should Sigma bring out a faster camera if there is no

competition in IQ?

• you want a faster camera? Buy one and go away, you troll

And so on. Really, that is absolutely annoying. Why can´t people
accept that there are sometimes better cameras as "theirs"? Why is it
so difficult to see that everyone has other needs?
Really, think about this. I thought we are in a serious forum, but in
some cases I really doubt this...

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You made a picture...fine!

Click to expand...

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Why can't you blow bubbles with chewing gum?

title correction: trolling then accusing others being a fanboy is the problem [nt]

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When 4200 posts are made, I will almost not post anymore under my old nickname, change my screen name. You will find my new nickname in my profile.

Conrad Birdie said:

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Goodness gracious, what is the big deal if someone happens to like
their camera and supports the manufacturer?

What do we call those who love their Ford Trucks, or Chevy Trucks, or
Dodge Trucks?
Why do we have to label those who like their cameras??

Click to expand...

The problem are not people that like their cameras, the problem are people that fanatically defend "their" brand. This defense mostly ends in flamewars, insults and brandmarking other posters as "trolls".

They play down issues of "their" brand or camera and everyone who don´t share their opinion is a troll, has no clue etc.

For example it´s just funny how the Casio F1 owners play down the issues of this camera.

I also remember discussions in the Fujifilm SLR board when I had problems with the S5 Pro. Instead of help they only insulted me to have no clue about photography, posting magnified images(they weren´t magnified, they were unsharp because of the strong AA filter, interpolation of the camera and NR) and so on. I only can laugh about this people. With Nikon or Canon I hadn´t such problems. Haha.

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You made a picture...fine!

If this is true, that the forum suffer from a "real plaque," then we should get it to a dentist pronto!
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-pjm



I never gave a damn about the meter man until I was the man who had to read the meters.

TrapperJohn said:

Wow, that really blows the lid off of discussion forums. Imagine that

• happy owners actually talk about why their setup works for them.

However, I won't be so circumspect as to believe that what works for
me will work for you. All I know is that it works very well for me.

Click to expand...

Have you read some other postings here? There is a difference between "like a camera" and fanboyism. A fanboy NEVER recognizes that his or her camera has flaws. From his or her view it hasn´t flaws, the mistake is the photographer.
The camera isn´t slow, but the photographer takes too much pictures.
The AF isn´t slow, it´s just the photographers fault.

The high ISO performance isn´t bad, because noise only can be seen in big prints or viewed at 100 %.
And so on...

I´m happy with my EOS 30D but I don´t give a damn about it when someone doesn´t like it. I don´t see a reason to defend it...

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You made a picture...fine!

Lupti1 is a typical troll who accuses the people he attacks being a fanboy when they reply.

I have just read Lupti1's last posts in the casio forum.
Not only this post
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1015&message=27692463
but all other posts in this thread of him.

Well the Casio F1 is not for me, and I never had a casio camera and probably never will have one, 20 years ago I had a casio watch.

But if I would need the F1 video then the F1 would be interresting for me.

Now Lupti steps in there and loads off a lot of BS and then complains those who reply would be "fanboys".

I also do not have anymore a Sigma ( I once had a Sigma DSLR and sold it and had my reasons for it ) but if you report that Lupti1 also trolls here then the principle is clear:

Buying C&N and feeling superior because going with the lemmings who all buy the same two brands,
bashing others and if they reply then accusing them as being fanboys.

We in the Oly DSLR forum have the same problem with canon people stepping in ( not so much the Nikons ) and I am fully on the side of the attacked Casio and Sigma people in this case.

regards
Martin

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When 4200 posts are made, I will almost not post anymore under my old nickname, change my screen name. You will find my new nickname in my profile.

richard stone said:

Count me in.

I'm an unrepentant fan of the Sigma and Foveon combination.

Trolls like Lupti visit the Sigma Forum all the time and attack the
cameras and the users. The comments of the trolls are generally
rejected as ignorant attempts at provocation. Trolls apparently feel
that other people in other forums are interested in their opinions,
despite those others not asking to hear them, and despite all
evidence to the contrary, and are motivated by hostility, so far as I
can determine.
Now the troll posts here and complains of fanboys.

But "fanboy" seems to have no definition, people only claim to know
it when they see it. And "fanboy" seems to be applied to those who
do not agree with the critical opinions of a given poster. "Don't
like my opinion of your camera? Then you must be a "fanboy" I can
do better than that: We not only don't like your critical opinion of
the camera, we don't like YOU.

And, for those who may not have noticed: the OP has managed to insult
all of the forums and all posters. He remains the only rational and
sensible one. How likely is that?

Richard
--
My small gallery: http://www.pbase.com/richard44/inbox

Click to expand...

Lupti said:

.....overall it seems that most people aren't able to have a neutral view of their camera.

Click to expand...

Sorry, but I don't see this as the case at all. I think you're overgeneralising in referring thusly to "most" people. I'm inclined to think that there's only a tiny minority of brand fanboys here. And whom most of us choose to ignore anyway.

I can't quite understand why this alleged extreme brand loyalty upsets you so much that you've felt the need to start a thread that's really going nowhere, and will ultimately fail in proscribing any "solution" to your perceived problem.

Cheers

I agree and I would recommend Euthymol.
Jules

paulskimcb said:

If this is true, that the forum suffer from a "real plaque," then we
should get it to a dentist pronto!
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-pjm



I never gave a damn about the meter man until I was the man who had
to read the meters.

Click to expand...

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Why can't you blow bubbles with chewing gum?

YOU are one of these people I´ve mentioned here. It has nothing to do that I´ve bought Canon and Nikon. But to be honest: With the "marketing leader" Canon I´m far more satisfied as with other brands. Why that? Only because Canon sells most DSLRs it can´t be the best, right? But surprise, with the 30D I don´t have any of the problems I had before with Pentax, Sigma, Olympus and even Nikon. I don´t have problems with high ISO noise(all of these brands except for 6MP Nikon and Pentax), slow AF(Sigma, Olympus, Pentax) and slow writetimes(Sigma, Pentax and even sometimes Olympus).

And sorry, but from an objective view the Casio F1 is overpriced, if some people don´t see that 1000 $ or 800 € are too much for an camera that offers no wideangle, only gives soft images, limited RAW capabilitys(really only up to ISO200!) and so on I don´t see a reason why not to write this.

The magic word "troll" is the only argument from people which want to justify their expensive purchase.

And sorry, but I really believe that there are cameras that are superior to others. Not only for special needs but overall. Some people pretend to be happy with an expensive Oly E-3 which offers less high-speed performance as an 40D and worse high ISO noise, but for reasons that don´t sound so plausible to me.

Oh and BTW there isn´t a 1 in my nickname...I don´t change it after a number of posts. LOL.

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You made a picture...fine!