tempestfugit
Well-known member
Thom did you notice that your website comments on their product are posted on their ebay D300 page.
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PHOTTIX CLEON IS NOT a scam (etefore)
- Thread starter gradux
- Start date
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Dear uvsub (for sure this one sounds like one),
Funny, co'z I thought it's the other way around. Review your comments and replies on your thread, this thread and most especially your "goodbye" thread and tell me who sounds like one. ;-)
For those who haven't seen his Goodbye thread, it's here:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1039&message=27461412
Funny, co'z I thought it's the other way around. Review your comments and replies on your thread, this thread and most especially your "goodbye" thread and tell me who sounds like one. ;-)
For those who haven't seen his Goodbye thread, it's here:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1039&message=27461412
LuvLatins
Leading Member
Are you kidding ? Just google his name and find out for yourself. The fact that Thom has also had difficulties with them only further demonstrates how messed up they are. Thom writes acticles and reviews about camera gear, including books and he is trusted as a fair and objective subject matter expert which is why his posting negative comments about them speaks for itself. I did not hear from them but after my negative comments where posted I heard from them the next day. It appears that if you post negative comments that does get their attention. In fairness I let them know that many on here are not happy and that I would be willing to remove the negative feedback if the unit ever arrives and is in working order. Here is the email:
(2) Shipping the wrong items in properly labeled boxes
(3) Selling Broken or defective units
(4) Not responding to email complaints
(5) Having the poor taste to ask for $15.00 more to pay for a replacement
(6) Using the postal service as an excuse for long delays
(7) Charging some customers for return postage when it was their error
From: HKSupplies
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 4:54 AM
To: James
Subject: Re: Wrong Cleon N8 Receiver
2. if you are not willing to buy extra, we just send the correct N8 receiver and you send back the N6 receiver first and we will take care of shipping.
Not what he asked me for. He offered to send a complete new box for $15 or he could send me the correct receiver for free. Do I not count as part of "everyone?"
Jack West
Senior Member
wrong again etefore fanboy!
Thom Hogan
Forum Pro
Within six hours of posting my message here I got three messages, two from eBay, one from etefore.
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Thom Hogan
editor, Nikon DSLR Report
author, Complete Guides: D40/D40x, D50, D70s, D80, D100, D200, D1 series, D2 series
http://www.bythom.com
- 1: unpaid strike removed
- 2: request to remove feedback
- 3: an apology from etefore
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Thom Hogan
editor, Nikon DSLR Report
author, Complete Guides: D40/D40x, D50, D70s, D80, D100, D200, D1 series, D2 series
http://www.bythom.com
Wow, that was quick. Great news Thom!
Just a fair question, if you don't mind: Would you now recommend etefore as an ebay seller because it was purely a miscommunication on his part?
Just a fair question, if you don't mind: Would you now recommend etefore as an ebay seller because it was purely a miscommunication on his part?
sevlow
Forum Enthusiast
A couple of weeks ago I had occasion to defend Thom when his business practices were questioned by some people in this very same forum.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1039&message=27270549
My comment at that time was:
'All business is based upon trust, if you can't trust Thom then he can't do business with you.'
As a previous customer of Thom's I had no hesitation in being one of the first to preorder his forthcoming D300 guide.
As a regular eBayer making frequent satisfactory purchases from the Far East my instinct was to order a Cleon from etofore at HK Supplies in spite of all the doomsday posts in this forum and received it here in UK five days after it was posted.
There have been rude, obnoxious, racist and libellous comments made by some people, but not a word of apology that I know of.
It is apparent that there has been some language translation problems, which is all the more reason for having patience and understanding.
The bottom line is that neither Thom or etofore are anything but honest traders, and should be treated as such.
Ray
The labourer works with his hands.. The craftsman works with his hands and his head.. The artist works with his hands, his head, and his heart..
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1039&message=27270549
My comment at that time was:
'All business is based upon trust, if you can't trust Thom then he can't do business with you.'
As a previous customer of Thom's I had no hesitation in being one of the first to preorder his forthcoming D300 guide.
As a regular eBayer making frequent satisfactory purchases from the Far East my instinct was to order a Cleon from etofore at HK Supplies in spite of all the doomsday posts in this forum and received it here in UK five days after it was posted.
There have been rude, obnoxious, racist and libellous comments made by some people, but not a word of apology that I know of.
It is apparent that there has been some language translation problems, which is all the more reason for having patience and understanding.
The bottom line is that neither Thom or etofore are anything but honest traders, and should be treated as such.
Ray
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The labourer works with his hands.. The craftsman works with his hands and his head.. The artist works with his hands, his head, and his heart..
RonHrl
Senior Member
As I mentioned, I bought a Cleon for $36.18. It was defective and I was asked to return it.
They said they would send a replacement and refund or credit the return shipment costs; this is their email:
From: HKSupplies
Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 9:31 PM
Subject: Fautly N8 returned
The faulty remote returned to us today, thanks!
Would you like to use the $5.40 on other product or prefer a refund?
We're ready to ship the replacement.
Regards
Zoe
It has been a month, and I haven't received the requested refund.
In addition, they did not send a replacement as they said, but instead refunded the original $36.18 and then charged me the new price of $50. So I wound up paying more than $19 additional for them to replace the defective unit.
I don't think that's good business practice.
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Ron
CP 5700, D70, D300
http://www.pbase.com/ronhrl
Every man has a right to his opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts. --Bernard Baruch
They said they would send a replacement and refund or credit the return shipment costs; this is their email:
From: HKSupplies
Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 9:31 PM
Subject: Fautly N8 returned
The faulty remote returned to us today, thanks!
Would you like to use the $5.40 on other product or prefer a refund?
We're ready to ship the replacement.
Regards
Zoe
It has been a month, and I haven't received the requested refund.
In addition, they did not send a replacement as they said, but instead refunded the original $36.18 and then charged me the new price of $50. So I wound up paying more than $19 additional for them to replace the defective unit.
I don't think that's good business practice.
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Ron
CP 5700, D70, D300
http://www.pbase.com/ronhrl
Every man has a right to his opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts. --Bernard Baruch
LuvLatins
Leading Member
Its clearly a communications error see the following message. It is just beyond beleif. I have to assume they dont understand english. AT ALL !
Sorry everyone but this is it for me. Hire someone that speaks english and perhaps I will reconsider. Thom, I would not remove the negative comments see below
Oh my God, are you kidding !
Your company is a mess and you need someone that speaks English. I have already sent you the $15.00 dollars and am waiting on you to ship me the correct unit. You said it was shipped but I have no way of verifying that it actually was shipped because your link just says it was shipped to the United Staes and last time I checked there were 350 million people living in the United States. I am not being difficult and I am glad that you don’t care because I have no intention of ever ordering from you again. Your record keeping is a disaster and you clearly do not know what you have sent to who.
If the unit is not received shortly, I will file a complaint with paypal and ebay and seek my money back. I hope that your message is because you don’t speak English and it’s a translation issue but telling me that you don’t care is rude and asking me why I am difficult is also rude. If you are going to continue to sell to English speaking customers then do yourself a favor and hire someone that understands the language.
Sincerely,
James
-----Original Message-----
From: HKSupplies [ [email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:10 PM
To: James Bandes
Subject: Re: Wrong Cleon N8 Receiver
we don't care, 99.9% of our buyers are happy.
packing is by human being and cannot avoid mistake.
most of buyers accept $15 and not choose us just shipping the correct N8 remote.
( they benefit both, if we ship N8 and they will get N8 and N6
receiver, he pays $15 to get $50 goods).
please advise if you pay $15 to get another set or we just send the
correct N8 receiver.
all other buyers understand this well.
not sure why you are so difficult to understand this.
regards
Sorry everyone but this is it for me. Hire someone that speaks english and perhaps I will reconsider. Thom, I would not remove the negative comments see below
Oh my God, are you kidding !
Your company is a mess and you need someone that speaks English. I have already sent you the $15.00 dollars and am waiting on you to ship me the correct unit. You said it was shipped but I have no way of verifying that it actually was shipped because your link just says it was shipped to the United Staes and last time I checked there were 350 million people living in the United States. I am not being difficult and I am glad that you don’t care because I have no intention of ever ordering from you again. Your record keeping is a disaster and you clearly do not know what you have sent to who.
If the unit is not received shortly, I will file a complaint with paypal and ebay and seek my money back. I hope that your message is because you don’t speak English and it’s a translation issue but telling me that you don’t care is rude and asking me why I am difficult is also rude. If you are going to continue to sell to English speaking customers then do yourself a favor and hire someone that understands the language.
Sincerely,
James
-----Original Message-----
From: HKSupplies [ [email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 1:10 PM
To: James Bandes
Subject: Re: Wrong Cleon N8 Receiver
we don't care, 99.9% of our buyers are happy.
packing is by human being and cannot avoid mistake.
most of buyers accept $15 and not choose us just shipping the correct N8 remote.
( they benefit both, if we ship N8 and they will get N8 and N6
receiver, he pays $15 to get $50 goods).
please advise if you pay $15 to get another set or we just send the
correct N8 receiver.
all other buyers understand this well.
not sure why you are so difficult to understand this.
regards
Maybe that's the problem, you're posting from the future.
http://www.census.gov/main/www/popclock.html
Thom Hogan
Forum Pro
I wish I could, because the product is decent and a better value than what Nikon offers. The problem is that miscommunication and difficulty in following up on problems seem to be a real problem with them. It took a post here and my negative feedback on eBay to get their attention. Three emails to them didn't do a thing. Neither did paying them again. They don't seem to realize that I paid them a second time. It was only the post here that seemed to get their attention.
Here's the way I see it: it's a small bet on US$50 (what the items I ordered cost me with shipping). Win the bet and you get your remote and it works and you're happy, as most of Hong Kong's customers seem to be. Lose the bet and get the wrong or defective product, or need to communicate with them directly in English about some aspect of the order, and things break down due to poor or no communication. The odds of winning the bet are quite high. The consequences of losing it are drastic. So, if you're a betting person, order the remote (which as I said, works very nicely). If you're not, I see that a few places in the US are now importing a similar product, so you might look at them.
--
Thom Hogan
editor, Nikon DSLR Report
author, Complete Guides: D40/D40x, D50, D70s, D80, D100, D200, D1 series, D2 series
http://www.bythom.com
LuvLatins
Leading Member
OK 303,808,985 is you want to split hairs but close enough
Thanks for the fair insight!
clcarder
Forum Enthusiast
Thom,
And just so you know they are using your name in their auctions.
And just so you know they are using your name in their auctions.
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- Catalina
@ gradux
For your information I'm 86 years young and farther removed from junior high than most people in this forum, yourself included. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it!
Great, you fixed up this Thom fellow now do the same for the rest of us. I'm not getting any younger and I want my refund while I'm still able to spend it.
For your information I'm 86 years young and farther removed from junior high than most people in this forum, yourself included. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it!
Great, you fixed up this Thom fellow now do the same for the rest of us. I'm not getting any younger and I want my refund while I'm still able to spend it.
redhed17
Senior Member
Was it the posting of negative feedback on Ebay that got their attention, or you posting here that did the trick? Or both?
Redhed17
http://photobucket.com/albums/v253/redhed17/
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Redhed17
http://photobucket.com/albums/v253/redhed17/
LuvLatins
Leading Member
I believe that I can be very demanding however I also pride myself on being fair and honest. As many of you know, I have been one of the loudest critics of HKSupplies however today I received many emails from them but this last one from Ken I think explains it all. I now believe that they genuinely do care about the product they sell and how they treat their customers but from this email you will quickly see that their entire problem is their lack of good communication skills. I received many emails after I posted negative feedback on ebay. As you saw in my last post they actually responded and said they did not care. I received several more that were even worse and then finally this one from Ken. I believe that there is no question now that the entire situation is a lack of adequate English skills. They even state that they are trying to fix the problem.
I have not yet removed my negative feedback from ebay and will not do so until a working unit actually arrives but at least finally we have a true insight into what has been causing the problem. See this message:
Most of their earlier emails were almost impossible to understand but finally someone named Ken sent this:
Hi James,
I am so glad that you got the point.
I just saw the forum and your comment is terrible and we don't mean this at all.
Kindly correct this as this poison our business.
Yes, we are perfect as we ship near 500 hundreds of items per day and should be some problem with communication but we never escape our responsibility as a buyers.
Cleon was released in PMA 2008 in late Jan when we were there and up to now we sold about #5000 of it. Most people will not post good thing on forum.
Supposed it is 1% defect (allow in electronic products) and few of them post bad comment on forum and it will spread any where.
But we are proud to say that we got only one negative in ebay in selling cleon.
If the quality is very poor and our service is bad and we will get tons of negative in ebay.
Yes, i agree with you that we have big space to improve our product and service and we are working on it.
We will have third generation of wireless remote control in 2-3 months and it will be more reliable and buyers will have more benefit on this.
Any comment is welcomed.
regards
Ken
I have not yet removed my negative feedback from ebay and will not do so until a working unit actually arrives but at least finally we have a true insight into what has been causing the problem. See this message:
Most of their earlier emails were almost impossible to understand but finally someone named Ken sent this:
Hi James,
I am so glad that you got the point.
I just saw the forum and your comment is terrible and we don't mean this at all.
Kindly correct this as this poison our business.
Yes, we are perfect as we ship near 500 hundreds of items per day and should be some problem with communication but we never escape our responsibility as a buyers.
Cleon was released in PMA 2008 in late Jan when we were there and up to now we sold about #5000 of it. Most people will not post good thing on forum.
Supposed it is 1% defect (allow in electronic products) and few of them post bad comment on forum and it will spread any where.
But we are proud to say that we got only one negative in ebay in selling cleon.
If the quality is very poor and our service is bad and we will get tons of negative in ebay.
Yes, i agree with you that we have big space to improve our product and service and we are working on it.
We will have third generation of wireless remote control in 2-3 months and it will be more reliable and buyers will have more benefit on this.
Any comment is welcomed.
regards
Ken
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