Firmware Upgrade - 707

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we '"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual controls)
• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from blinking just as the photo is being taken)
• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked as rotated and recorded as per normal.
• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Um, not to burst your bubble, but...

Sony? Firmware updates? Have they ever?

I look at it this way: If they (Sony) want the pro market, they'd go after it. They haven't. It's a consumer electronic company. 99.5% of the consumers don't look for pro equipment.

If Sony DID go pro digicam ($2K> ), then the possibility of firmware updates would improve. In the meantime, enjoy the features you have, and save up for your next piece, which will probably have the features you listed, but won't have the features of the pro units of the day. Or spend $3K on a D60 and watch it depreciate just as fast.

Take pictures, and be happy in the fact that they've come this far in a few years of tweaking.

• David

Simon Glynn said:

Alpha Kilo wrote:
All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade,

Click to expand...

........

Simon Glynn said:

And I'm spent ....

Click to expand...

That's what they want you to do - spend.

To add to the bubble burst, I don't believe Sony cameras are even made to accept software upgrades. That means that Sony couldn't offer one even if they were inclined to.

David_S85 said:

Sony? Firmware updates? Have they ever?

I look at it this way: If they (Sony) want the pro market, they'd
go after it. They haven't. It's a consumer electronic company.
99.5% of the consumers don't look for pro equipment.

If Sony DID go pro digicam ($2K> ), then the possibility of firmware
updates would improve. In the meantime, enjoy the features you
have, and save up for your next piece, which will probably have the
features you listed, but won't have the features of the pro units
of the day. Or spend $3K on a D60 and watch it depreciate just as
fast.

Take pictures, and be happy in the fact that they've come this far
in a few years of tweaking.

• David

David_S85 said:

Alpha Kilo wrote:
All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade,

Click to expand...

........

David_S85 said:

And I'm spent ....

Click to expand...

That's what they want you to do - spend.

Click to expand...

David, many consumer cameras offer FW upgrades. As you say, Sony doesn't.
Bear, I'm inclined to agree with you. But we will probably never know.

Homer

thabear said:

David_S85 said:

Sony? Firmware updates? Have they ever?

I look at it this way: If they (Sony) want the pro market, they'd
go after it. They haven't. It's a consumer electronic company.
99.5% of the consumers don't look for pro equipment.

If Sony DID go pro digicam ($2K> ), then the possibility of firmware
updates would improve. In the meantime, enjoy the features you
have, and save up for your next piece, which will probably have the
features you listed, but won't have the features of the pro units
of the day. Or spend $3K on a D60 and watch it depreciate just as
fast.

Take pictures, and be happy in the fact that they've come this far
in a few years of tweaking.

• David

Floating_Fotoman said:

Alpha Kilo wrote:
All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade,

Click to expand...

........

Floating_Fotoman said:

And I'm spent ....

Click to expand...

That's what they want you to do - spend.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

O.K. after reading this thread I too would like to see if the firmware could be upgraded. We don't know if the firmware can be accessed via the USB connector or not, but maybe it can. I would like to see if we couldn’t find away to forward this thread to someone at Sony so they can see that consumers are interested in a firmware upgrade. I would even be willing to pay a small fee for the upgrade. If we could get a compiled list of what we would like to see upgraded and make it very professional and present it to Sony. It could not hurt, besides they might not even be aware that consumers are interested in this type of upgrade. I would like your thoughts on this subject.

http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6Alpha

Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

Michael,

I want to believe that Sony has its spies in STF.

Yehuda

That may be true, and I hope they do, but you never know. To them, this issue may be so small that it does not even make their list, so we need to bring it to them.

Yehuda Katz said:

Michael,

I want to believe that Sony has its spies in STF.

Yehuda

Click to expand...

--
Always in training
http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6

I fired of an e-mail to Sony, asking them who at Sony to direct this request to. I should get a reply tomorrow. I will also call Sony and ask to speak with their camera-engineering department. I hope someone speaks English.

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

--
Always in training
http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6

Response (Reggie) - 05/13/2002 09:24 PM
Thank you for your interest in F707.

I am glad to know that you are interested in our DSC-F707 camera. There was a problem with some of the initial shipment of DSC-F707's. Sony is not recalling the F707. Sony provided a free service for owners of DSC-F707's who experienced the BFS problem (strongly blue cast when using the flash). The only cameras affected fall between serial numbers 1320001 - 1335130 and 1336621 - 1339030. Please note, a large portion of cameras which have serial numbers in this range have already been upgraded. The problem has been rectified in the new shipments of the DSC-F707 and there is a overwhelming response for the camera. You could purchase the DSC-F707 camera online from our Website at the following URL.

http://www.sonystyle.com/digitalimaging/P_Feature_F707.shtml

The SonyStyle team is available to assist you with further inquiries.

Customer (Michael Miller) - 05/13/2002 08:42 PM

The majority of the F707 owners on dpreview in the Sony talk forum) would like to see a firmware upgrade made available for the DSC F707. Who at Sony would we need to direct this request?

Thanks
Mike
(A Dedicated F707 owner)

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

--
Always in training
http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6

Can I be allowed to take these suggestions a step further??

Anyone use Norton Antivirus? If you do, you are aware that the program can automatically download and install the updated virus difinations.

Now, wouldn't it be just too cool if we could hook up our F707 (or any Sony for that matter) and, have updates downloaded right into the camera making the firmware updates a easy and hands free.... so to speak?

Pardon me if this is what you already had in mind with these firmware update?

Regards,
Mark

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

--
B4 USA / Mark

Ummmmmmmmmm.....................actually Sony do sell a lot of professional equipment, they are the only company at the moment producing 16:9 professional news gathering cams for television use !

B4 USA said:

Anyone use Norton Antivirus? If you do, you are aware that the
program can automatically download and install the updated virus
difinations.

Now, wouldn't it be just too cool if we could hook up our F707 (or
any Sony for that matter) and, have updates downloaded right into
the camera making the firmware updates a easy and hands free.... so
to speak?

Pardon me if this is what you already had in mind with these
firmware update?

Regards,
Mark

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

--
B4 USA / Mark

Click to expand...

--
You only live once ,and always suck the lemon.

Alpha,

I was wondering why you actualy bought the 707 with a wish list that size?

Maybe you should have gone fo another make of camera.

Regards
Richard

sheesh...a non-answer...

Loren

Michael C Miller said:

I am glad to know that you are interested in our DSC-F707 camera.
There was a problem with some of the initial shipment of
DSC-F707's. Sony is not recalling the F707. Sony provided a free
service for owners of DSC-F707's who experienced the BFS problem
(strongly blue cast when using the flash). The only cameras
affected fall between serial numbers 1320001 - 1335130 and 1336621

• 1339030. Please note, a large portion of cameras which have

serial numbers in this range have already been upgraded. The
problem has been rectified in the new shipments of the DSC-F707 and
there is a overwhelming response for the camera. You could purchase
the DSC-F707 camera online from our Website at the following URL.

http://www.sonystyle.com/digitalimaging/P_Feature_F707.shtml

The SonyStyle team is available to assist you with further inquiries.

Customer (Michael Miller) - 05/13/2002 08:42 PM
The majority of the F707 owners on dpreview in the Sony talk forum)
would like to see a firmware upgrade made available for the DSC
F707. Who at Sony would we need to direct this request?

Thanks
Mike
(A Dedicated F707 owner)

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

--
Always in training
http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6

Click to expand...

--
http://www.pbase.com/lorenbc/

Reggie,
That wasn't an answer to my question, (but a great sale pitch) I already
own an F707 and it is in great working order, no DLS (Dark Left Side) and no
BFS (Blue Flash Syndrome).

The majority of the F707 owners on the Sony Talk Forum at DP Review would like to see Sony make available a firmware upgrade for the F707. There are a few upgrades we would like to see made available for purchase. I have a compiled list and we would like to know who at Sony this list needs to be addressed to for consideration. Most all of the $1000 and above Prosummer cameras on the market have made firmware upgrades available for their cameras, i.e. Nikon, Olympus and Minolta. This would fix small problems found after distribution along with extend the useful life of the camera, not to mention add some enhancements not already found on the camera. Sorry if my first e-mail was a bit confusing.

Thanks Mike
(A Dedicated F707 owner)

Michael C Miller said:

I am glad to know that you are interested in our DSC-F707 camera.
There was a problem with some of the initial shipment of
DSC-F707's. Sony is not recalling the F707. Sony provided a free
service for owners of DSC-F707's who experienced the BFS problem
(strongly blue cast when using the flash). The only cameras
affected fall between serial numbers 1320001 - 1335130 and 1336621

• 1339030. Please note, a large portion of cameras which have

serial numbers in this range have already been upgraded. The
problem has been rectified in the new shipments of the DSC-F707 and
there is a overwhelming response for the camera. You could purchase
the DSC-F707 camera online from our Website at the following URL.

http://www.sonystyle.com/digitalimaging/P_Feature_F707.shtml

The SonyStyle team is available to assist you with further inquiries.

Customer (Michael Miller) - 05/13/2002 08:42 PM
The majority of the F707 owners on dpreview in the Sony talk forum)
would like to see a firmware upgrade made available for the DSC
F707. Who at Sony would we need to direct this request?

Thanks
Mike
(A Dedicated F707 owner)

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

--
Always in training
http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6

Click to expand...

--
Always in training
http://www.pbase.com/mmiller6

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Hi, Alph Kilo,

Click to expand...

A very good wish list, and even a few more could be added. The fact that we would like some additions/improvements does not mean that we should have bought something else, as was suggested. I am more than happy with my 707, but would welcome your wishlist, my own, and some others have seen.

As far as FW updating through the USB port, if I remember correctly this was done in a few minutes my a 707 owner in the UK who took his 707 to a Sony station that happened to be nearby. I refer to the BFS.

As far as reaching the Sony engineering department, I don't think this is going to happen. Several months ago I had some technical questions and called Sony (Ft. Meyers). After proceeding through the levels,--1st level - someone reading the manual back to me,- second level about the same, but with courteous persistance I asked to speak to someone who could answer my question. After several days I got a very competent person who indeed answered most of my questions, but said that as a metter of policy they will never put someone through to engineering.

The "kicker" though is that he said "They watch the forums very closely and do pay attention to what people say". (What they decide to do after this may be another question.) At any rate, perhaps persistance will have some good effects, and if anyone gets a substantial answer back to some of these questions to Sony I know very many of us on the STF would be very interested.

Bob

• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked as rotated and recorded as per normal.

the item above in particular could not be firmware anyway, unless they have the hardware in for orientation sensor, or you do it manually when you shoot. what odd is my Minolta film SLR has orientation sensor (changes metering setup).

One other item to add that I really miss is rear curtain flash (so if you have a blur of movement it trails behind rather than in front of object)

All, thanks for the feedback

I too did a little searching around Sony, finding few published mechanisms for getting feedback through to the company, and none to the engineering dept. "Smart" automatic email response systems seem to be in place, but they don't help in a query of this nature.

I've owned a lot of Sony gear in my time (one reason for buying the cam) and with complex gear like an MD recorder I knew there was often a service mode for the device. In the case of my MZR30, you bridge a couple of remote pins with a specified resistor value, and you're in. However that was 5 years ago, and those devices were never designed to connect to PC's. With a 707 it would be reasonable in my mind to see that service mode configuration on the device itself may be an unnecessary software development effort, when the same thing would likely be possible, but over the built in interfaces, expecially since it has computer interface software drivers in built (USB).

I wouldn't be surprised to find that not only is a mass storage device USB signature present on the 707, but potentially some other "Service Mode" driver.

Now the flow on from the almost guaranteed existence of a service mode on the device particularly if it is accessible remotely via USB, would be an upload capability for some part, or all of the onboard software.

I'm convinced firmware upgrade capability on the camera would be in place, as it is a support mechanism to fix post production software bugs (see some of the posts regarding early BSF fixes), and a channel to get information to and from from camera. Without it, any type of software bug means that cameras need to be recalled, opened and bits replaced. With a software upload facility, they need only be serviced. It makes economic sense.

(aside) Something else I just thought of. It is possible that a firmware upgrade could be a function of the memory stick, i.e. special directory, with a key file to match a key inbuilt in the camera. Boot the camera up, it checks the stick, checks for the directory, matches the key, loads the software .

Perhaps I am being a little optimistic about firmware upgrades for the 707, but I did want to ask the question and I don't think the answer is clear cut from the responses so far. Sony make good gear. Their iterations from one model to another generally add the features people want and take away some of the useless ones. They can't do it in isolation, so they must have some way of obtaining feedback on the products they release. That may be through observers, or through active user participation. I am still hoping its the later.

Why did I buy the 707 with a wish list that long? It was still way ahead of the competition

Regards
Alpha

Good List.

I personally think it would be really stupid for a manufacturer not to include a FW upgrade option on a product like F707. Imagine them having to fix the DLS & other issues by having to unsolder a chip and solder a new one... Huge cost. I am pretty sure they have a way to do this. Its another question whether they will release FW updates based on consumer wishlists or not. Based on past history chances look slim.

All we can do is raise the profile of this need. I for one will not buy another Sony that does not get this kind of support. If all of us state the same to Sony maybe we'll make a difference.

Additional wishlist item : I am really annoyed at how hard it is to turn on red-eye reduction on or off. I'd like to have red-eye reduction controlled by the main curson button like it was on the F505V. Right now the flash states controlled on the cursor button are: Auto, Forced On and Forced Off. If Red-eye is set on at the SetUp screen then Auto or Forced On will use it. Suggest addition of another state to the cursor button so the options become : Auto, Forced On, Forced On with Red Eye Reduction and Forced Off.

Question / Proposal : Where do we collect all these great ideas? If there a specific web-site where we can collect the wishlist items?

Best Regards,
Kerem

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

Don't hold your breath waiting for a FW upgrade. With Sony it is very unlikely. There is little if any incentive for them to go this direction. If you can upgrade what you have why would you buy another camera with new features? Sony wants to sell you a better camera. That is how they will make money.

Having said this, they did provide an OS upgrade to the FD88. There was an occasional recording issue. The correction was done via a floppy inserted into the camera. Sony would never release the software correction to the public.

DW

Alpha Kilo said:

All,

In a post that will likely stir some opinion I ask and pose some
questions(and apologies if it has all been done before .

Q: What is the likelihood of Sony releasing a firmware upgrade
which changes/adds to features of the 707? Having recently seen the
announcement of the Minolta Dimage7 firmware upgrade, it gave me
some hope that Sony could undertake a similar exercise and put in
some of those features we ask for. Is there any historical evidence
that shows Sony have done this in the past with other models, and
not just to fix bugs, but to improve on features, or are we
'"stuck" in some respects with what we initially buy with a product
from the Sony range?

Lets me assume that there is a chance Sony may provide a FW upgrade
if there is a consumer need. It leads me to the next question.

Is there an appropriate forum through which to put suggestions
through to Sony on the FW upgrade features (i.e. a user feedback
forum, or user groups) which may give us a channel back to Sony?

What would we ask for if such a channel existed?

This is my list, feel free to add, but think a bit before and make
a judgment on whether you could reasonably expect the
hardware/software combination to do what you ask? From what we have
seen in the Dimage upgrade, it might be reasonable to expect some
improvements in speed of processing for some algorithms/functions
but I wouldn't get too ambitious.

Anyway, here is my wish list. Ohh, and I recognise that one or more
of the following may be possible already, and that I haven't read
the manual properly

New Setup options.

• Hot mirror removal (for IR photography with ability to use manual

controls)

• Toggle ON/OFF for IR illumination lamps
• Ability to switch off preflash metering (i.e. stop people from

blinking just as the photo is being taken)

• Direct manual focus (like the Dimage upgrade) allowing for manual

focus adjustments after the AF has made a lock (and locked onto the
wrong thing).

Menu Options (while shooting)

• Histogram display in preview
• Image rotation (+-90%) for images being shot with camera on its

side (i.e. rotated before recorded to stick) alternatively, marked
as rotated and recorded as per normal.

• Full AE lock until cancelled by user (i.e. not reset after each

shot)

Menu Options (while in playback)

• Histogram display

Exposure feedback (while shooting)

• Over/Under range indicator (i.e. telling you how badly you plan

to over/underexpose your photo by indicating how far out of the
range your shutter or aperture is)

Movie Playback

• Full screen 320x240 playback for the non-HQ movies (am guessing

processing power needing to be split between concurrently accessing
the stick and painting the images is one reason for the current
small-screen format)

Flash Mode

• Slow sync (not sure if that is the correct terminology), I mean

the mode where the foreground is lit by the flash but the exposure
is determined from the background

And I'm spent ....

Thanks for any feedback. If a sensible approach to getting this
info to Sony seems to be available, I'll jump back on the thread in
a few days and see if I can compile the list.

Kind Regards
Alpha Kilo

Click to expand...

Simon Glynn said:

(aside) Something else I just thought of. It is possible that a
firmware upgrade could be a function of the memory stick, i.e.
special directory, with a key file to match a key inbuilt in the
camera. Boot the camera up, it checks the stick, checks for the
directory, matches the key, loads the software .

Click to expand...

A friend of mine recieved a free (!) 8Mb memory stick from Sony, containing a ROM upgrade for his Sony Clie handheld.

Apparently, if a certain file is present on the memory stick when the Clie boots, it is installed into the device's flash-ROM. My firend didn't actually need this upgrade, so he promptly formatted the stick - and now has much more fun with the games stored on it!

Sounds sensible, and if another Sony device does it this way, then there's a good chance that others do too...

(Having said this, the Clie upgrade may have just been a standard PalmOS app - I don't know)