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the reason not to buy the sigmas

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SandyF said:
Yes, it did/does for me.
Click to expand...
OK

Personally I rather get my photographic inspiration from Ansel Adams or Lennart Nilsson or even our own Mr Laurence Mattson than the Dr Bryce E. Bayer or Carver Mead.

But milages do differ.

Now Sandy - do you think that the kind of investigations that David are doing will be different if he knows that Mead founded Foveon?

Honest now :)

--
Roland
 
Roland Karlsson said:
Personally I rather get my photographic inspiration from Ansel Adams
or Lennart Nilsson or even our own Mr Laurence Mattson than the Dr
Bryce E. Bayer or Carver Mead.
Click to expand...
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from Cal Tec in 1960.

--
Those who forget history are condemned to go to summer school.
 
Tom Rowland said:
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from
Cal Tec in 1960.
Click to expand...
Yes I know - and I got mine at the Royal Institute of Technology in Stockholm 1992.

But as I already hinted - fame and titles do not impress me all that much.

--
Roland
 
This is very cryptic - intriguing even - but as much as I'd really love to know what you are going on about, I won't bite - Roland is correct, take your photographic inspiration from photographers not technologists.

Mead's stuff on fundamental physics is a different matter. I doubt it'll run any better than say, Penrose's obession with supposed QM effects in neurone microtubles but never write off an aging superstar especially one with a solid reputation as an iconclast, I say.
SandyF said:
I can read you haven't done your homework either...
seriously, I'm not intending to post more on the topic; that provides
too many openings for tactless and erroneous replies from others.
My email's public.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
 
SandyF said:
I can read you haven't done your homework either...
Click to expand...
Do you mean me missing the Dr?

Then read my reply to Tom

/ Dr Roland Karlsson :)
 
ps

I can enjoy making fun of academia because at the age of 45 I'm 1/4 of the way through the second year of my BSc (Hons) - and it's taken me 6 years to get this far! Gotta love the Open University. Just waiting for the result of my first undergraduate level maths course. Gulp.

I reckon a PhD might be on cards by the age of 80 or so...
DMillier said:
You know what they say, a Doctorate is a ticket to lifetime poverty!
Roland Karlsson said:
Tom Rowland said:
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from
Cal Tec in 1960.
Click to expand...
Yes I know - and I got mine at the Royal Institute of Technology in
Stockholm 1992.

But as I already hinted - fame and titles do not impress me all that
much.

--
Roland
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
 
Hi Roland,

good to see that you back to your good ole self. I read some of your remarks that you and yours made regarding Dr. Mead and this is what I have to say and you can take it any you want and please by all mean report me. I love to get ban.

Offcourse I hope the moderator read all most of your tacky posts first before they ban me.
Roland Karlsson said:
Tom Rowland said:
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from
Cal Tec in 1960.
Click to expand...
Yes I know - and I got mine at the Royal Institute of Technology in
Stockholm 1992.

But as I already hinted - fame and titles do not impress me all that
much.
Click to expand...
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other people and it does not makes you equal in stature or accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic type As.
Roland Karlsson said:
--
Roland
Click to expand...
--

'Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great.'
  • Mark Twain
 
spm

Judging from your recent posts, you seem on edge. Maybe you should take up a spot of yoga or something...

I was rather hoping Sandy was going to come out with some really interesting titbits but looks like I'm going to be disappointed :-(
spm said:
Roland Karlsson said:
Tom Rowland said:
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from
Cal Tec in 1960.
Click to expand...
Yes I know - and I got mine at the Royal Institute of Technology in
Stockholm 1992.

But as I already hinted - fame and titles do not impress me all that
much.
Click to expand...
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other
people and it does not makes you equal in stature or
accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular
basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here
is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to
belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never
becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic
type As.
spm said:
--
Roland
Click to expand...
--
'Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small
people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you,
too, can become great.'
  • Mark Twain
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
 
DMillier said:
spm

Judging from your recent posts, you seem on edge. Maybe you should
take up a spot of yoga or something...
Click to expand...
I am fine has couple healthy hobby and neither is involving badgering people in the website forums...just people like yourself who constantly need to put down other people, whom you never even heard of your name or even do anything to you just to make some one here mad is rather appauling...you in other hand really need a good hobby that does not involve putting down people, it does not speaks well for your character...I might be too straight forward and say like it is but you will never find me put down people for their photography or life's work.
DavidMillier said:
I was rather hoping Sandy was going to come out with some really
interesting titbits but looks like I'm going to be disappointed :-(
Click to expand...
Believe it or not she is has far better sportmanship than you or Dr. Karlsson ever dream of having...there are many people in this forum that criticism the camera and they seem to be doing fine. Why? because they don't hijack other people thread and insisted that their view is not the "only" correct view and putting down people or try to control what people think...if someone object to your antic than you are crying being a victim, citing personal attact against you...you see, it is not the message but the way and the manner that you deliver your message is what ticked so many people off, myself included...by believing that you are the only who know better and always right and insist on being right, I am sure you would find a way to comeback why you are the way you are.

This is all I have to say...it is not you the person but the manner and tone of your conduct is leaving rotten egg residue about your posts.
DavidMillier said:
spm said:
Roland Karlsson said:
Tom Rowland said:
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from
Cal Tec in 1960.
Click to expand...
Yes I know - and I got mine at the Royal Institute of Technology in
Stockholm 1992.

But as I already hinted - fame and titles do not impress me all that
much.
Click to expand...
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other
people and it does not makes you equal in stature or
accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular
basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here
is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to
belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never
becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic
type As.
DavidMillier said:
--
Roland
Click to expand...
--
'Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small
people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you,
too, can become great.'
  • Mark Twain
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
Click to expand...
--

'Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great.'
  • Mark Twain
 
DMillier, tactless comments and getting yourself in deeper post by post
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1027&message=25618474

There are a number of people here who've had the privilege of knowing Dr. Carver Mead, also known by first name to a good number of us, and for many more years than I. BTW, he is a fun person in addition to his accomplishments and credentials. So cool it.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann
 
I'm sorry you feel like that and I understand that for a certain type of person, my "style" (which I don't normally consider to rude but which I accept can be hectoring) can be irritating but I bear no one any malice, including those who post nothing but personal insults (although I may be ratty at the time).

The thing for me, is that I consider the value of these forums not be about friendship or companionship but about working to identify "truth" (irrespective of whether it's pleasant to know sometimes) and to be honest it's very difficult to do that and mollify peoples' feelings and insecurities when to so would require overlooking or covering up flaws and disadvantages. No one really responded to my 4 questions about what they think I think about the Sigma cameras but I really am a fan of the image quality - I just don't have the same emotional need that some seem to have to pretend it is perfect or the only thing worth having. The competition has merit too.

ps

I have never to my knowledge ever insulted anyone's work or photographic talent. I don't mind people doing that to me if I learn something from the experience but it is not fair to do so to others unless they request it. However, i on't believe in praising average work; I reserve my praise for the stuff I think is really good.

pps

I think you may well be making the mistake of stereotyping my supposed attitude and only seeing examples of where I comply with the stereotype and ignoring contrary information. I'm sure it's not too late to get along...
spm said:
DMillier said:
spm

Judging from your recent posts, you seem on edge. Maybe you should
take up a spot of yoga or something...
Click to expand...
I am fine has couple healthy hobby and neither is involving badgering
people in the website forums...just people like yourself who
constantly need to put down other people, whom you never even heard
of your name or even do anything to you just to make some one here
mad is rather appauling...you in other hand really need a good hobby
that does not involve putting down people, it does not speaks well
for your character...I might be too straight forward and say like it
is but you will never find me put down people for their photography
or life's work.
spm said:
I was rather hoping Sandy was going to come out with some really
interesting titbits but looks like I'm going to be disappointed :-(
Click to expand...
Believe it or not she is has far better sportmanship than you or Dr.
Karlsson ever dream of having...there are many people in this forum
that criticism the camera and they seem to be doing fine. Why?
because they don't hijack other people thread and insisted that their
view is not the "only" correct view and putting down people or try to
control what people think...if someone object to your antic than you
are crying being a victim, citing personal attact against you...you
see, it is not the message but the way and the manner that you
deliver your message is what ticked so many people off, myself
included...by believing that you are the only who know better and
always right and insist on being right, I am sure you would find a
way to comeback why you are the way you are.
This is all I have to say...it is not you the person but the manner
and tone of your conduct is leaving rotten egg residue about your
posts.
spm said:
spm said:
Roland Karlsson said:
Tom Rowland said:
Lets give credit where credit is due. Carver Mead got his Ph.D from
Cal Tec in 1960.
Click to expand...
Yes I know - and I got mine at the Royal Institute of Technology in
Stockholm 1992.

But as I already hinted - fame and titles do not impress me all that
much.
Click to expand...
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other
people and it does not makes you equal in stature or
accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular
basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here
is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to
belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never
becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic
type As.
spm said:
--
Roland
Click to expand...
--
'Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small
people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you,
too, can become great.'
  • Mark Twain
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
Click to expand...
--
'Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small
people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you,
too, can become great.'
  • Mark Twain
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
 
What's tactless about that!

I just praised the guy!!!! That for as close as I get to hero-worship and I never heard of him until you talked about him!

Goodness, you are impossible sometimes.

Desparingly,
D
SandyF said:
DMillier, tactless comments and getting yourself in deeper post by post
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1027&message=25618474
There are a number of people here who've had the privilege of knowing
Dr. Carver Mead, also known by first name to a good number of us, and
for many more years than I. BTW, he is a fun person in addition to
his accomplishments and credentials. So cool it.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
 
DMillier wrote:

I just don't have the same emotional need that some seem to have to pretend it is perfect or the only thing worth having.

Just point me to five forum members here that actually think this way.

--
regards, Harry

http://album.zoom.nl/user/hybybyte (dutch)
 
spm said:
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other
people and it does not makes you equal in stature or
accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular
basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here
is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to
belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never
becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic
type As.
Click to expand...
Seng ... I don't think we are talking the same language. You almost always misunderstand whatever I write.

Did I say that it was in any way important that I have a Ph.D?

I only responded to Tom and Sandy that both thought it was important to point out that I missed the Dr before Carver Mead. And - yes I did. And the Dr before my name was a joke.

And what the ¤%¤#¤% is the problem with that I say that it will not inspire me to take better photos knowing that the sensor is made by a company founded by Dr Carver Mead?

It matters to Sandy. Thats fine. But it does not matter to me.

How on earth can you think this is in any way disgracing Dr. Mead.

--
Roland
 
Roland Karlsson said:
spm said:
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other
people and it does not makes you equal in stature or
accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular
basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here
is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to
belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never
becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic
type As.
Click to expand...
Seng ... I don't think we are talking the same language. You almost
always misunderstand whatever I write.

Did I say that it was in any way important that I have a Ph.D?

I only responded to Tom and Sandy that both thought it was important
to point out that I missed the Dr before Carver Mead. And - yes I
did. And the Dr before my name was a joke.
Click to expand...
I never wrote that or thought that. You totally missed many points apparently in my post(s).
Roland Karlsson said:
And what the ¤%¤#¤% is the problem with that I say that it will not
inspire me to take better photos knowing that the sensor is made by a
company founded by Dr Carver Mead?

It matters to Sandy. Thats fine. But it does not matter to me.
Click to expand...
Again, "It matters to Sandy". I never wrote that or thought that. You totally missed many points apparently in my post(s).

Less subtle: two of my points are: know whom you're talking to and with. Listen to people who know what they're talking about.
Roland Karlsson said:
How on earth can you think this is in any way disgracing Dr. Mead.

--
Roland
Click to expand...
 
It seems that many a row hinges on poorly phrased or mis-interpreted statements. Once things start off on the wrong foot they seem hard to get back on to the wrong track.

Now, a cautionary moral (and please don't take this as an attack on CM).

To quote Sir Arthur Clarke (scifi author and inventor of the communications satellite):

"When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong."

I use this (slightly out of context admittedly but I like the words) merely as a caution about having excessive respect for anyone's achievements and talents, however brilliant.

For example, the person who is frequently cited as possessing the finest mind of all time (and one of the worst personalities), Isaac Newton, devoted considerable energies and time to...alchemy, of all things.

Albert Einstein wasted 40 years of his life in a private obsession with an impossible dream.

Sir Arthur Eddington, the person who first provided experimental support for general relativity and had an awesome reputation in his time, became obsessed with numerology and ended his life as somewhat of an embarrassment.

Kurt Godel, he of the Incompleteness Theorem that cultural relativists so like to mis-understand was basically barking.

Today, the remarkably famous Stephen hawking is either going to become even more famous or the next Eddington, depending on success or failure of latest idea.

His 1970s black hole theorist collaborator, the Oxford Professor of Mathematics Roger Penrose is highly esteemed but has got himself into hot water over his theory of consciousness as set out so badly in his terrible book The Emperor's New Mind

The list goes on really.

Of course you are right to give more weight to the ideas of those with the brains and the track record but it is worth remembering that even the greatest of all have historically been known to go off on wild goose chases.

In the end the rule is really really simple: what matters is not the authority, not the reputation, not the list of achievements but how closely the evidence of experiment and the theory fit.

end lecture ;-)

So, go then, did Mead invent the sensor himself or is he more the sponsor?
SandyF said:
Roland Karlsson said:
spm said:
This said everything...so you are Dr. too and so are Millions other
people and it does not makes you equal in stature or
accomplishments...I know at least one Dr. who post here on regular
basis and has far more knowledge and tack than you...figure!...here
is a frog or 2 that think they are equal of a Prince...by try to
belittle someone who in your lilltle Frog millions lifetime can never
becomes a part per billion of someone like Dr. Mead in accomplishment.
Ok...you can report me now...well poisoner/s selfrighteous dogmatic
type As.
Click to expand...
Seng ... I don't think we are talking the same language. You almost
always misunderstand whatever I write.

Did I say that it was in any way important that I have a Ph.D?

I only responded to Tom and Sandy that both thought it was important
to point out that I missed the Dr before Carver Mead. And - yes I
did. And the Dr before my name was a joke.
Click to expand...
I never wrote that or thought that. You totally missed many points
apparently in my post(s).
SandyF said:
And what the ¤%¤#¤% is the problem with that I say that it will not
inspire me to take better photos knowing that the sensor is made by a
company founded by Dr Carver Mead?

It matters to Sandy. Thats fine. But it does not matter to me.
Click to expand...
Again, "It matters to Sandy". I never wrote that or thought that. You
totally missed many points apparently in my post(s).
Less subtle: two of my points are: know whom you're talking to and
with. Listen to people who know what they're talking about.
SandyF said:
How on earth can you think this is in any way disgracing Dr. Mead.

--
Roland
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Galleries and website: http://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/mainindex.htm
 
DMillier wrote:

I think Carver enjoys being a physicist with continuing different, unorthodox, out-of-the box ideas, this is how science advances, even now that's he's retired from regular teaching and research at Caltech... he still has his lab. During the conversation pictured in P0268 http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman/pentax_optiowp_2005&page=2 he was telling of some latest research. His conference speeches' audios are public, but I'm not going to give the links here. BTW, LG's book on quantum entanglement will be published by Knopf soon.
DavidMillier said:
So, go then, did Mead invent the sensor himself or is he more the
sponsor?
Click to expand...
see my last points to Roland; if you don't know this, you really need the references I've mentioned. Again, my email is public.
Best regards, Sandy
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann
 
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