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Nikon D3 "film look": James Russell's 1st Impressions on The Luminous Landscape

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NeilJones said:
You may have noticed that it says Canon EOS-1D/1Ds/5D at the top.
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If you followed the thread closely and read the review by Mr. Russell you'd then notice the relation to this forum and it's members.

Give it another try, and if you're still not interested, skip the thread and find one that's all Canon. Most of the names I recognize in this thread are Canon shooters, and most have probably shot with other brands and are interested in the broader field and not always just all things Canon.

I believe that the OP uses more than one brand of camera as do I and Bernie. Not sure about all the others.

Robert
 
here we go again!
If you do not want to read about this, please simply get out of this thread.

I am canon user and I am very interested in reading opinions about this from canon users stand point.

I do not understand why you have to limit this forum site to talk about only canon camera.

We can talk about leica, nikon or something else as long as it has related issue with our canon camera or future of our canon camera.

I am sick and tied of reading this kind of meaningless policing post.
Who ask you to police the forum?
Click your mouse and go to other thread!
--
zone5
 
I'm just curious if the OP made this post in the Nikon, Olympus, Sony, etc forums? If not, why not? If this is interesting to Canon people, it should be quite interesting to Nikon people, and Olympus people.. and Sony people.. with that logic we should just have 1 'gear' forum because we don't want anyone to miss out on any of this great info. The reason most people responding are Canon users is because this ia a CANON forum.. duhee!
zone5 said:
here we go again!
If you do not want to read about this, please simply get out of this
thread.
I am canon user and I am very interested in reading opinions about
this from canon users stand point.
I do not understand why you have to limit this forum site to talk
about only canon camera.
We can talk about leica, nikon or something else as long as it has
related issue with our canon camera or future of our canon camera.

I am sick and tied of reading this kind of meaningless policing post.
Who ask you to police the forum?
Click your mouse and go to other thread!
--
zone5
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Robert Whiteman said:
I personally like the look of "digital" and find it much easier to
get the look and colors I prefer than when shooting film. In fact, I
just accepted the results from film since I couldn't do much about
it. Shoot it and send it off to be processed (K64) and hope I nailed
the exposure on at least some of the shots.
Click to expand...
I was refering to the raw files, I rarely shoot jpegs. I still shoot a lot of Kodachrome, generally nail the exposure 30 out of 36 shots. I can also meter without a meter and be within a 1/2 stop.

We are all different..
 
Dan Nikon said:
The processing engine is what takes the info from the sensor and
serves it up, I am saying that the M8 is better at this than the 5D
is ( from ISO 640 on down ). I know this is a hyped out I want to see
proof on everything world, but you will just have to take my word for
it.
Click to expand...
It's not really about taking YOUR word. I personally don't doubt your convictions and believe what you're saying, as far as your expectations being met by what you've discovered. I've never even seen an M8 and have no idea of what it's capable of, but it sounds pretty good. Still, the 5D is the best I've used in my probably more limited experience and the results have been very pleasing to me as well.
Dan Nikon said:
It is no knock on canon, they still make awesome stuff. But after
several emails from friends at Geographic who said the M8 is ready
for prime time, I pulled the trigger on it at the end of August and
have been very happy that I did for my documentary work.
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Speaking for myself, I didn't take it as a knock on Canon. We just might have different expectations and without doubt, different experiences. I've never shot with the M8. Perhaps one day I'll get the chance.
Dan Nikon said:
A man is only as good as his word and sometimes, you just have to
take it.
Click to expand...
I don't think there's any problem with your word.

Robert
 
Who told you that we can not take good picture without best gear.
I do not remember anybody said that, unless you have some hallucination.

We are talking about just equipment, even though we can make good picture with current camera we still want to know about and wish for better and more convenient tool to do a job.
What is wrong with that?
--
zone5
 
I use Canon, Nikon, Leica, Hasselblad, Fuji, so you can read about in the Nikon forum or here.

Too bad you are one of those narrow minded gear heads, you might actually get more out of photography if you get over the brand wars..
NeilJones said:
You can read all about this article via the Nikon forum!

Thank you.
Click to expand...
 
this was Mr. Russell's comment:

but when noise does show (and it takes about ISO 2,000 before it really appears) it is more film-like that most digital files I have shot. (OK, now I am hesitant to use the term film-like, because I think film is a romantic notion of the past, but I think the D-3 hit the film look I prefer faster than any digital camera I have previously used).

He also makes it clear that the images posted with this article were heavily post processed in Photoshop and were what he delivered to his client.

In other words, his references to film-like refers to the 7400 images he captured at Osaka and is in possession of - not to his post processed output.
 
Wow.. 17% are exposed wrong? Sounds like its time to throw that film away.. ;) Let the threads start about when Kodak is going to fix their exposure problems with Kodacrome.
Dan Nikon said:
Robert Whiteman said:
I personally like the look of "digital" and find it much easier to
get the look and colors I prefer than when shooting film. In fact, I
just accepted the results from film since I couldn't do much about
it. Shoot it and send it off to be processed (K64) and hope I nailed
the exposure on at least some of the shots.
Click to expand...
I was refering to the raw files, I rarely shoot jpegs. I still shoot
a lot of Kodachrome, generally nail the exposure 30 out of 36
shots. I can also meter without a meter and be within a 1/2 stop.

We are all different..
Click to expand...
 
Did either of you read the review? Do either of you know James Russell or anything about him?

If you can answer yes to these two questions then you should be able to understand the interest there might be here in the Canon forum in his opinions.

If not, don't bother with threads that have no interest for you personally and don't expect others here to share your opinions on what should or should not interest them.

with all due respect,

Robert
 
Yes it is Canon forum.
And we are talking about this matter from canonians view point.
So what is wrong?

We have right to talk about this on forum as much as you can complain about this, fan boys!
--
zone5
 
Nothing.. whats wrong with the 1dm3 and 1dsm3 as competing cameras for the Nikon? Do they not compete?
zone5 said:
Who told you that we can not take good picture without best gear.
I do not remember anybody said that, unless you have some hallucination.
We are talking about just equipment, even though we can make good
picture with current camera we still want to know about and wish for
better and more convenient tool to do a job.
What is wrong with that?
--
zone5
Click to expand...
 
Personally I don't really care that the thread is here.. Its easy to skip.. I think though, that people expect to read about Canon cameras in a CANON equipment forum.. How many 1dsm3 or 1dm3 threads are in the Nikon forum, I would guess next to none. As a former Nikon film shooter, I am certainly not a 'fan boy'.. But I currently own a 1dm3 and would prefer to read about MY camera in this forum than a Nikon.. I also read the Nikon and Olympus forums..

Like you said, people can just skip the the thread, but acting like every Nikon thread posted in the Canon forum is somehow doing us all a favor by enlightening us is just silly.
zone5 said:
Yes it is Canon forum.
And we are talking about this matter from canonians view point.
So what is wrong?
We have right to talk about this on forum as much as you can complain
about this, fan boys!
--
zone5
Click to expand...
 
Dan Nikon said:
What the "film look" is to me is the look of a great slide on a light
table. The M8 is much better than the 5D at doing that out of camera.
Click to expand...
--

Do you know why? Because the M8 has lower dynamic range than the 5D. Wich means: The m8 is S H I T. Sorry.

------
Why do I always have to be so hard on the ones with less knowledge?
 
Danlo said:
Dan Nikon said:
What the "film look" is to me is the look of a great slide on a light
table. The M8 is much better than the 5D at doing that out of camera.
Click to expand...
--

Do you know why? Because the M8 has lower dynamic range than the 5D.
Wich means: The m8 is S H I T. Sorry.
Click to expand...
Actually, the 5D blows out highlights a lot easier.
Danlo said:
------
Why do I always have to be so hard on the ones with less knowledge?
Click to expand...
Because looking in the mirror is too painful for you?
 
That "film look" is because Nikon does heavy chroma noise reduction in-camera, something you can easily achieve after the fact with any other camera.

--
Whoever said 'a picture is worth a thousand words' was a cheapskate.

http://www.pbase.com/dot_borg
 
I don't know who Russell is, but I have read the review. He himself says that if you are looking for a comparison of Nikon vs. Canon that he is not the person to do it, and that while he is a Canon shooter, he has always prefered Nikon. So, we has a bias, and he is not doing a comparison of any Canon cameras.

Seems like an article for the Nikon forum to me, but maybe his background that I do not know explains why this is relevant here. As I said, it doesn't really matter that it was posted here, but I can certainly understand why some find it annoying. There sometimes seems to be more Nikon threads than Canon.. it has died down though.
Robert Whiteman said:
Did either of you read the review? Do either of you know James
Russell or anything about him?

If you can answer yes to these two questions then you should be able
to understand the interest there might be here in the Canon forum in
his opinions.

If not, don't bother with threads that have no interest for you
personally and don't expect others here to share your opinions on
what should or should not interest them.

with all due respect,

Robert
Click to expand...
 
Dan Nikon said:
Nathan Yan said:
Alright then, have an example of straight out-of-camera pics of the
same scene from M8 and 5D?
Click to expand...
I don't really do comparisons, dont have any, that is not my area (
camera tester, gear head, internet junkie ) I am a full time working
pro.
Click to expand...
It has zero to do with testing or comparison. It's called an objective claim, versus a subjective claim. Does the Leica give a more film-like look? Or do you just feel that there's a film look when you look at your Leica images? The latter claim is fine, there's a lot of touchy-feely subjectiveness to images, but if you want to claim that there is a real, tangible difference in the output of the M8 vs. output of any other camera, you're going to have to show some proof.
Dan Nikon said:
Dan Nikon said:
I've seen a lot of similar pictures like this, but I'm completely
unconvinced that the image sensor is doing anything special to
emulate film response to light? In every case it's been
post-processing in Photoshop, or at best a specific contrast curve or
"Picture Style" applied in-camera. Again, this isn't anything
special the camera does, you can apply the exact same effect in any
RAW converter.
Click to expand...
The processing engine is what takes the info from the sensor and
serves it up, I am saying that the M8 is better at this than the 5D
is ( from ISO 640 on down ). I know this is a hyped out I want to see
proof on everything world, but you will just have to take my word for
it.
Click to expand...
Again, this is going into subjectivity vs. objectivity. What good is your word if you have zero proof to back it up?

Like I said before, any "feel" you might get is down to the JPG processing or the default RAW conversion. The sensor in the M8 is not fundamentally different from that in the 5D (or any other camera), and thus will work react to light the exact same way.
 
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