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K.Y.Lee

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As you may aware of my previous test on high ISO comparison of D3 and 1D3. For these 2 days I have been reviewing all the high ISO shots that I took from D3 again and again. I concur with many of the previous posters that the chroma noise is so "abnormally" low when compared with 1D3. I just wonder, can the engineer of a brand will alter the camera's program intentionally for testing? Or the ViewNx may has some hidden NR algorithm in it?

The D3 I tested has been circulating in local newspaper, megazines and Govt departments for preview by their photogs. Is there possibility that they may have tweaked the camera intentionally?

I am not trying to raise any argument between different brand users otherwise I would not have posted the ISO test shots in Nikon;s favour but just curious when a tester specifically mentioned that it is a pre-production model, apart from possible bugs, what else is the difference?
 
by performing and posting your 1d3/D3 comparison. I believe you did an honest and objective job in the face of less-than-ideal conditions. I know it's asking a lot, but I would like to make a suggestion. Outside of DP Review world, I believe that a majority of photographers, even those who do it for a living and especially those involved in the daily, high quantity grind of weddings, graduations, sports, events, etc. are relying on out-of-camera jpegs.

If you have the out-of-camera jpegs for the same set of images used in the comparison, would you be willing to post them in the same fashion as was done for the original comparison?
 
K.Y.Lee said:
I concur with many of the
previous posters that the chroma noise is so "abnormally" low when
compared with 1D3. I just wonder, can the engineer of a brand will
alter the camera's program intentionally for testing? Or the ViewNx
may has some hidden NR algorithm in it?
Click to expand...
Nikon traditionally has had better chroma noise control rather than choosing Canon's approach of controlling lumininosity noise. This is where the "Nikon is more film like" description comes from when discussing Canon and Nikon images.

I suspect that Nikon is simply continuing in it's empahsis on chroma noise control as well as delivering a sensor that is low in lumina noise. My old D2h, D2x, D100, D200 cameras consistently demonstrated lower chroma noise than my 1D-IIn, 1D-III and 5D at similar ISO and white balance conditions.

However, it is presently speculation that the D3 has well controlled chroma noise "out of box". Maybe it is or maybe is done externally in software. Only the future will tell. Here in calgary, some of us are spending too much money arguing this (and other) detail over beer at one of the local photographer evening chat-beer-and-prints sessions.
--
tony
http://www.tphoto.ca
 
for the engineers to tweak a camera to make it shine in the tests, then reverse their hardwork back to lower quality image output before selling it to the public??
 
maxz said:
for the engineers to tweak a camera to make it shine in the tests,
then reverse their hardwork back to lower quality image output before
selling it to the public??
Click to expand...
It is possible to handpick sensors for the best possible characteristics or it is not uncommon to build a hundred or so pre-production units (everyone from development, test, QA, marketing, sales etc needs some and of course there are drop-out units). This allows you to pick the best units for the sales/marketing teams.

I am sure the photgraphic industry is like every other; Canon will have obtained a prototype unit by now and have dismantled it for internal review (I'm sure Nikon had a prototype 1DM3 as well). They will be looking to see if they can 'adopt' any of the features. This will become more prevalent in the future as the hardware becomes less important and more is done in firmware.

As an engineer I would make one (very) general comment; engineering is about trade offs, you can only improve one feature at the expense of something else. In this case I would suspect Nikon manufacturings costs are higher than Canons. Canon could probably undercut Nikon and still make a profit - but no company will deliberately erode their own margins.
 
disneysw said:
maxz said:
for the engineers to tweak a camera to make it shine in the tests,
then reverse their hardwork back to lower quality image output before
selling it to the public??
Click to expand...
It is possible to handpick sensors for the best possible
characteristics or it is not uncommon to build a hundred or so
pre-production units (everyone from development, test, QA, marketing,
sales etc needs some and of course there are drop-out units). This
allows you to pick the best units for the sales/marketing teams.

I am sure the photgraphic industry is like every other; Canon will
have obtained a prototype unit by now and have dismantled it for
internal review (I'm sure Nikon had a prototype 1DM3 as well). They
will be looking to see if they can 'adopt' any of the features. This
will become more prevalent in the future as the hardware becomes less
important and more is done in firmware.

As an engineer I would make one (very) general comment; engineering
is about trade offs, you can only improve one feature at the expense
of something else. In this case I would suspect Nikon manufacturings
costs are higher than Canons. Canon could probably undercut Nikon and
still make a profit - but no company will deliberately erode their
own margins.
Click to expand...
well seems canon didn't do that(handpick), since the sent everyone a cam that could not focus in AI servo.. but I agree...also and an engineer somethings come at expense of others and sometimes corners get cut to save $$$$$$$$$
--
Johnny
 
if there is already NR in the RAW files, then the in-camera jpg would also show this effect right?
 
but I'm just making the request in this thread because I noticed your posting, and thought you might notice the request here, not because of anything necessarily related to this thread. I think it would be informative and add to our understanding of these cameras and how they handle image processing. As I mentioned in the request, I think there are many who are interested in out-of-camera jpegs because that's what they use.
 
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